Patriots Rumor The pending UFA: who do we keep? Who walks?

[ViperGTS]

It's only 3 weeks until he tampering period starts. Man I forgot how quick things are if your team is in the SB.

 

[p8ryts]

I like Pierce. I don't know how serious the team is about a WR and Pierce would be a major star of the free agent market.
I think guard is a need.
I'm not sure where they stand on a tackle.
Fullback, I think they like the one on IR and if not, should be easily able to find another.
I expect some competition for punter in camp.
I don't think they'll go after Shaheed or Pickens.
I think they'll hold onto Diggs until the decide what to do at WR.

I think if you are going to pay big bucks for a receiver, I would go for Pierce. His skills would match up good with Maye. Doesn't seem to be a diva. I would really like to have Diggs for another year if they can work that out. He was taken away with double teams much of the time near the end. His value went beyond catching passes. Don't want Pickens or Shaheed. Pitts would be interesting but not at big bucks. I'm in for improving the run game and that means a FB and a blocking TE.

 

[DaBruinz]

Alec Pierce and Cade Otton would be great signings for me . Focus more on pop and Chism as slot guyz this season to help with blitzes and short intermediate passes. . If we get linderbaum that's a bonus.

Cut or trade Diggs . Don't resign hooper.

This will build the core.

Why would you cut/trade Diggs? What kind of message does that send to younger players? He's a guy who came in, far exceeded expectations for last year since he was coming off an ACL and became a big-time leader for them.

Cade Otton I agree with.
Alec Pierce reminds me of Donald Hayes. I don't understand this want for people to spend money on a position that we have such good young players in the likes of Boutte and Williams. Adding Pierce hurts their development.

 

[DaBruinz]

I think if you are going to pay big bucks for a receiver, I would go for Pierce. His skills would match up good with Maye. Doesn't seem to be a diva. I would really like to have Diggs for another year if they can work that out. He was taken away with double teams much of the time near the end. His value went beyond catching passes. Don't want Pickens or Shaheed. Pitts would be interesting but not at big bucks. I'm in for improving the run game and that means a FB and a blocking TE.

The Pat have a good young player in Brock Lampe for FB. It was an unfortunate injury at the beginning of camp that took him out of contention. But he's still young enough where he should be able to come back and make a impact. I would hope that the Pats bring in someone else as well, but that's likely to be another UDFA.

Cade Otton or Daniel Bellinger are two TEs who are both upgrades as blockers over Hooper and Henry.

Alex Pierce reminds me of Donald Hayes. I don't believe he's a good fit for this offense and I don't think bringing him in at the expense of WIlliams and Boutte is a good idea. And those are the two players who'd be affected by Pierce being added. Pierce is barely better than 50% catch rate. Why would you want that as part of this offense?

 

[mgteich]

I would really like to have Diggs for another year if they can work that out. .

???
There is nothing to work out. If the patriots want to dump their best non-QB on Offense, then so be it. Diggs certainly has nothing to work out.

 

[Real fan 02]

It's only 3 weeks until he tampering period starts. Man I forgot how quick things are if your team is in the SB.

I love it.. this is so much better than having to start talking about the draft and FA in November during the season like last few years..

I believe both us and the Seahawks will be targeted next season.. I fully entrust Vrabel to add quality players to the roster guys that are a culture fit.

 

[bakes781]

Vederian Lowe

K’Lavon Chaisson

I feel like Tonga was overrated for his plays at FB. They have Farmer and the draft is loaded at DT again.

 

[ahmed]

First time since 2020 I have been super excited about the offseason.

We need to upgrade OL and TE.

 

[TheRainMaker]

I feel like Tonga was overrated for his plays at FB. They have Farmer and the draft is loaded at DT again.

All those defensive guys moonlighting at FB whiffed their blocks. Media and fans always found it cute Seymour running out there, but he was also whiffing blocks.

 

[DaBruinz]

Vederian Lowe

K’Lavon Chaisson

I feel like Tonga was overrated for his plays at FB. They have Farmer and the draft is loaded at DT again.

Farmer isn't a NT the way that Tonga is.

While the draft is loaded, is DT an actual area to spend a pick on?

Williams, Barmore, Farmer, Durden, Greggory, Taylor, Pharms.. They also have Jaquelin Roy who is an RFA (whom I don't expect to be tendered) and Isaiah Iton who is an ERFA (whom I do expect them to tender).

They may look at a DT/NT later in the draft as a luxury pick, but I don't expect them to look at one before the 4th round.. Not when Edge and LB and IOL should be priorities.

 

[Hugepatsfan]

Farmer isn't a NT the way that Tonga is.

While the draft is loaded, is DT an actual area to spend a pick on?

Williams, Barmore, Farmer, Durden, Greggory, Taylor, Pharms.. They also have Jaquelin Roy who is an RFA (whom I don't expect to be tendered) and Isaiah Iton who is an ERFA (whom I do expect them to tender).

They may look at a DT/NT later in the draft as a luxury pick, but I don't expect them to look at one before the 4th round.. Not when Edge and LB and IOL should be priorities.

I think NT/DT is an actual area to spend a pick on if the draft board dictates it. That's the approach you have to have if you want to be a good drafting team IMO. These rookies sign 4 years deals (potentially 5 for 1st rounders with the option). Roster change in the NFL year to year is crazy. By the end of the contracts these guys sign 80% or more of the roster around them will probably be different. Positions that aren't needs now will be in a year or two. It's always great when the draft board lines up for immediate help at a need area, but it should be secondary to just drafting good players IMO. Over time, the depth chart will sort itself out and the more high end players you have the better spot you'll be in.

I also think NT is a sneaky need area or at least a strong want. Our interior pass rush is supposed to be the strength of our defense but when we had to put Tonga out there on running downs we kind of neutered that. In his career he has 0.5 sack. I know that's not the only stat, but he gives you NOTHING as a pass rusher. I think it would be HUGE for this defense if they had a NT that can actually push the pocket because then the strong interior pass rush DUO at DT would actually be an EVERY DOWN strength.

 

[TommyD4207]

I think NT/DT is an actual area to spend a pick on if the draft board dictates it. That's the approach you have to have if you want to be a good drafting team IMO. These rookies sign 4 years deals (potentially 5 for 1st rounders with the option). Roster change in the NFL year to year is crazy. By the end of the contracts these guys sign 80% or more of the roster around them will probably be different. Positions that aren't needs now will be in a year or two. It's always great when the draft board lines up for immediate help at a need area, but it should be secondary to just drafting good players IMO. Over time, the depth chart will sort itself out and the more high end players you have the better spot you'll be in.

I also think NT is a sneaky need area or at least a strong want. Our interior pass rush is supposed to be the strength of our defense but when we had to put Tonga out there on running downs we kind of neutered that. In his career he has 0.5 sack. I know that's not the only stat, but he gives you NOTHING as a pass rusher. I think it would be HUGE for this defense if they had a NT that can actually push the pocket because then the strong interior pass rush DUO at DT would actually be an EVERY DOWN strength.

The D-Tackle draft crop isn't as deep as last year, but it's still pretty deep. Getting a developmental rookie later on, and letting him ease into the rotation, is a pretty good idea.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Break the bank for Tyler Linderbaum. Figure it out accordingly around him. You're going to need to draft a tackle in this draft to replace Moses, preferably, and at least one guard to replace Onwenu. No way can you bring him back for the money he's making.

Re-sign Tonga if he wants to stay cheap, he fell off a cliff, even a little bit pre-injury, but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt there. He is 29, almost 30, however.

Hawkins can take the next plane out of town, as far as I'm concerned. He's fine as a depth piece, but no way am I signing him for anything resembling starting money, and you need to improve that position dramatically. He's not Myles Bryant bad, but he's damn close.

You need to dramatically improve at linebacker. Spillane and the Special Teamers are a nice story, but if Spillane is your best linebacker, you need a better linebacker, and Gibbens and Elliss should be depth pieces at best. Jehlani Tavai should never be allowed back in the facility again. This is something you should address twice in the draft, and probably in free agency as well.

Great post.

We signed Williams last year, and let's hope we keep the same approach and sign Linderbaum. We could even let Onwenu go, even though this suggestion shocks lots of PatsFans posters, and sign Linderbaum and Edwards. We can draft a RG and can't do worse than Wilson was a LG this year. Having a veteran LG will greatly help Campbell. Big mistake putting 2 rookies on the left side this year.

Tonga - another PatsFans favorite. The dude is a JAG, against good competition he disappears. He would have to be cheap, cheap, cheap. Hopefully Farmer has a Y2 leap. We can draft a replacement in R5 to R7.

Hawkins has to be a backup at best. There are some cover safeties in the draft. A cover safety and cover LB are more important to me than an EDGE.

LB has to dramatically improve - agreed. There are a bunch of veterans in FA plus a coverage LB like Louis in the draft. A weakness is immediately a strength.

We have 6 picks from R5 to R7. Backup TE, Fullback, slot receiver, Div. II CB, WR, and OT for Y1 training are all on the table.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

I also think NT is a sneaky need area or at least a strong want.

This is correct. Tonga was signed to plug a hole and now PatsFans has fallen in love with him.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Alec Pierce should be a target, and Pitts, or Njoku.
Get competition at Tackle and guard.

A better fullback, a better Punter.
Resign Tonga, Hawkins, Chasson, Gibby comes back.
I’d be tempted to go after Shaheed and or George Pickens.
You have to let Diggs go sadly.

I’d love to make Diggs a coach.

There is ZERO chance that George Pickens becomes a Patriot. They have a " no assholes" policy.

 

[DaBruinz]

I think NT/DT is an actual area to spend a pick on if the draft board dictates it. That's the approach you have to have if you want to be a good drafting team IMO. These rookies sign 4 years deals (potentially 5 for 1st rounders with the option). Roster change in the NFL year to year is crazy. By the end of the contracts these guys sign 80% or more of the roster around them will probably be different. Positions that aren't needs now will be in a year or two. It's always great when the draft board lines up for immediate help at a need area, but it should be secondary to just drafting good players IMO. Over time, the depth chart will sort itself out and the more high end players you have the better spot you'll be in.

I also think NT is a sneaky need area or at least a strong want. Our interior pass rush is supposed to be the strength of our defense but when we had to put Tonga out there on running downs we kind of neutered that. In his career he has 0.5 sack. I know that's not the only stat, but he gives you NOTHING as a pass rusher. I think it would be HUGE for this defense if they had a NT that can actually push the pocket because then the strong interior pass rush DUO at DT would actually be an EVERY DOWN strength.

The idea that Tonga doesn't offer anything as a pass rusher is an over-statement. Tonga, on the season including play-offs, had 218 pass rushing snaps. He accrued 1 sack, 3 QB hits and 17 QB hurries. That's a pressure every 10.38 snaps... His 418 defensive snaps this year, Including the play-offs, were career highs.. No one will ever mistake him for Pat Williams or Kevin Williams from the vaunted Minnesota line nor will they mistake him for Vince Wilfork or Ted Washington or even Tim Goad. But he really broke out this year with the Pats.

Cory Durden saw his snaps go up with Tonga out, he's not a prototypical NT at 6'4-305 lbs. Eric Gregory, at 6'3-320lbs is closer to the prototypical NT. And Gregory is someone they sorta stashed on the roster all year..

The Pats have 7 D-line under contract plus Roy and Iton whom they have rights on.

I'd be curious to find out how many plays this year the Pats had Barmore, Williams and Tonga / NT on the field. I saw far more 2 D-lineman/2 Edge guy formations even with Tonga in the rotation. I think that the Run Defense was more affected by Williams & Spillane not being in the line-up than Tonga..


So, they may be looking at what we know is a prototypical NT, or they may be looking for a Pat Williams/Kevin Williams type NT/UDT.

 

[mgteich]

This is correct. Tonga was signed to plug a hole and now PatsFans has fallen in love with him.

Are you cutting Daden or Farmer?

 

[DaBruinz]

Are you cutting Daden or Farmer?

Right now, the Pats have 7 D-Line signed. I expect that they'll have 10 signed by TC to give Barmore/Williams rest time.

Of Leonard Taylor, Josh Farmer, Cory Durden, Jeremiah Pharms, and Eric Gregory, only Gregory has the build of a "traditional" NT. But I don't think that Vrabel & Co are looking for a NT for other than short-yardage/Goal Line situations. I think they're looking for Pat Wiliams/Kevin Williams types (6'3-6'6 & 300-310 lbs) who can cause havoc on the interior..

The Pats started the season with 5 DL. They added Gregory, making him the 6th. It wasn't until Farmer and Williams went down that they started using guys off the PS in Lovett, Pharms and Taylor, for game day elevations.

So, I would expect 1 of Durden, Farmer, Taylor, Pharms and Gregory to be cut at the end of TC. More depending on how they hold up.

 

[Real fan 02]

I think you need Diggs for another year for Williams protection. An AJ Brown trade ain't gonna happen until that price falls. Diggs a year removed from the ACL could still be very effective. Shaheed is a one-trick pony, and George Pickens is a loser nightmare no one in their right mind should want.

Break the bank for Tyler Linderbaum. Figure it out accordingly around him. You're going to need to draft a tackle in this draft to replace Moses, preferably, and at least one guard to replace Onwenu. No way can you bring him back for the money he's making.

You need a better fullback. Westover, I gave him all year, he didn't improve nearly enough.

Baringer has two bad games in snowstorms, and everyone wants him cut. Baringer basically won them three games this year.

Re-sign Tonga if he wants to stay cheap, he fell off a cliff, even a little bit pre-injury, but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt there. He is 29, almost 30, however.

Hawkins can take the next plane out of town, as far as I'm concerned. He's fine as a depth piece, but no way am I signing him for anything resembling starting money, and you need to improve that position dramatically. He's not Myles Bryant bad, but he's damn close.

I'd try to get Chaisson on a short-term (2-3 yrs) on relatively short money with a high guarantee. You can't pay him 20 mil a year, he's not that guy. I think a big trade-up to get Harold Bain in the draft would be ideal. Landry's stuck here for another year unless he retires, and whether via draft or free agency, pass rusher desperately needs to be addressed, because you can't blitz 6 on every play and expect your back end to hold up, especially with those holes at linebacker.

Gibson on a cheap one-year deal sounds fine, but he's coming off an ACL as well. Need to get a guy in the draft as a Stevenson replacement in-waiting. Stevenson earned the right to finish out his contact here, in my mind.

Henry has a lot of dead cap, it's fine to keep him, Hooper you can probably get back on a 1-year cheap. You need to get younger and simply better at the position though. If you can't make a big move for Bain in the top 10, maybe a smaller deal to get Sadiq in the top 20, that guy's going to be a big-time star.

You need to dramatically improve at linebacker. Spillane and the Special Teamers are a nice story, but if Spillane is your best linebacker, you need a better linebacker, and Gibbens and Elliss should be depth pieces at best. Jehlani Tavai should never be allowed back in the facility again. This is something you should address twice in the draft, and probably in free agency as well.

You need to spend a premium pick to replace Carlton Davis and slowly add them to the mix. Free Agency doesn't seem to be much of a crop at Corner.

That's a lot. Incredible that roster won the AFC. I guess coaching still matters.

Questions?

1. Isn't Gibson under contract?

2. As bad as you hate Hawkins he's not as bad you think and I believe he resigns and the team drafts a Safety and signs a veteran depth. Who do you see out there at S?

3. Landry knee is supposed bad and may knee surgery.. doug kyed was talking about on you youtube patriots. We will need his replacement. Is Ponder ready?

4. Who do you like at Edge in FA?

But agreed with your overall post.

 

[Real fan 02]

Are you cutting Daden or Farmer?

Neither..both are cheap options and great depth guys.. farmer had a nagging ankle all season.. he will be healthy going into camp.