Patriots Pregame Thread 2025 Raiders @ Patriots - Early thoughts

[mgteich]

Good fair article which raises the critical question as to whether the pats did enough to improve the wr group in the offseason. I agree that the answer is no

No, we have not improved enough to give us a SB quality WR group.

 

[mgteich]

Good fair article which raises the critical question as to whether the pats did enough to improve the wr group in the offseason. I agree that the answer is no

Perhaps it is enough to be better than what Jones had in his rookie trip to the playoffs: Meyers, Bourne, Agholor and Harry.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Good fair article which raises the critical question as to whether the pats did enough to improve the wr group in the offseason. I agree that the answer is no

I think they are better than expected. Diggs will approach 1000 yards. And the TEs are going to contribute. It is a good bunch because it is balanced with WRs, TEs, and the RBs all contributing. The article does not look at the whole group.

I am higher on Hollins than most and lower on Douglas. Oddly Williams may be the key, if the kid can shine it will make the whole offense be unpredictable. I think we will surprise with Henderson creating a lot of mismatches. Also Chism will take snaps away from Douglas.

 

[Dec54]

Good fair article which raises the critical question as to whether the pats did enough to improve the wr group in the offseason. I agree that the answer is no

You are seriously saying that the wide receiver group has not improved this off season from last years?

 

[slash83]

Unfortunately even if Gonzo comes back to practice on Wednesday, doubt he plays Sunday after not practicing for over a month.

 

[Real fan 02]

I like the idea of a “Josh revenge game” but I just don’t see it. Week 1 is not the time where he is going to go into his bag of tricks. He is still focused on his offensive skill players, particularly Maye, grasping the fundamentals and executing them consistently. He will probably call a relatively simple game plan that targets LV’s weaknesses to some extent but will be more about playing to NE’s strengths and avoiding mistakes.

One thing I haven’t seen highlighted is that this is a classic “West coast team has to fly to the East coast and play at 1 PM” game which is always some level of disadvantage to the visiting team.

I think Josh throws some wrinkles, obviously in the preseason no team is showing anything. Josh will use the run game to set up play action. Getting the OL to push the line or scrimmage early in the game will set the stage. I agree on the 1 pm game. However last season the Chargers came here and spanked us.

 

[Huckleberry1]

We still need to threaten the deep 1/3rd of the field, or our opponents will do exactly what they did against us with Mac. The D will shrink closer to the LOS and take away those quick throws if we don't make them respect the threat of deeper shots. We simply can't just rely on and say, "short quick throws". We've seen in the past, that doesn't work if that's all you can do.

I’m not concerned about this. Maye’s strength is the deep ball, and they will take their shots with Boutte, Williams and Hollins. They won’t throw deep all day, but they will definitely throw deep enough to keep the Raiders honest.

Just as a note on this, his last 2 seasons at UNC Maye led the nation in big time throws.

 

[Real fan 02]

If the Patriots have playoff aspirations this season this would be a bad time for an “extended preseason”. They might need that H2H tiebreaker over the Raiders to get in.

Important game.

Bingo!! I've been saying the same thing. None of this September is an extension of the preseason. No, the preseason is over. This is live action. We've been terrible in September the past few seasons. Important we get off to a fast start the AFC is loaded with contenders.

 

[Real fan 02]

We still need to threaten the deep 1/3rd of the field, or our opponents will do exactly what they did against us with Mac. The D will shrink closer to the LOS and take away those quick throws if we don't make them respect the threat of deeper shots. We simply can't just rely on and say, "short quick throws". We've seen in the past, that doesn't work if that's all you can do.

Agreed. There is where the presence of Henderson comes into play. I can guarantee you Carroll is trying to come up with a way to cover him. This is exactly what you want. We need to hit seam routes and chunk yards. We have the guys to get it done. Henry, pop, Diggs, Boutte, Hollins, with rham and Henderson as well.

 

[Ring 6]

I think he would be an OK backup RT because I saw him do it in preseason.

Preseason games against scrubs doesn’t wipe out 2 years of sucking for real.

 

[Ring 6]

If the Patriots have playoff aspirations this season this would be a bad time for an “extended preseason”. They might need that H2H tiebreaker over the Raiders to get in.

Important game.

The Raiders aren’t sniffing tie breaker zone.
But you are right a fast start is important.
Raiders, fins, Steelers, panthers before the Bills.
The Bills game is followed by 3 terrible opponents: Saints, Titans and Browns.
That’s 7 very winnable games surrounding the Buffalo game.

 

[Real fan 02]

The Raiders aren’t snuffing tie breaker zone.
But you are right a fast start is important.
Raiders, fins, Steelers, panthers before the Bills.
The Bills game is followed by 3 terrible opponents: Saints, Titans and Browns.
That’s 7 very winnable games surrounding the Buffalo game.

Your exactly right 6, these games are very important. The AFC is the dominant conference and so many contenders. To get wins early on do so much for the culture, the locker room, the believing in what Vrabel's doing. Winning games in September makes all the difference in September when teams are pushing for a playoff spot. Especially with only the top seed getting a bye.

 

[KCSVEN]

The experts are not as impressed as the homers here are....
Can Drake Maye End the QB Nature-vs.-Nurture Debate Once and for All?

That article is BAD and inaccurate. The whole premise is "The second-year passer had a rough supporting cast in 2024, and it doesn’t appear to be a whole lot better this season." That is ABSURD.

Game breaking rookie RB with a history of never fumbling. Better
Veteran RT with a history of solid play. Better: Jacobs was worst OL in the entire league.
LT drafted top 5 : Better, replacing Lowe who was average Pass Blocker and very bad run blocker.
LG and C are question marks but likely Better
Diggs: Better than anyone in 2025 they had
Coaching: Better
They are better at RB, WR, OL, OC and equal at TE.

I think the debate is how much better due to some unknowns.

How quickly will the players pick up what Josh wants them to with his complex offense?
Diggs is a true NFL #1 receiver, he was last year, he was the year before. He's not in the elite #1, like Chase or Jefferson but in the next tier. The only question is how he looks after the injury and a year older.
How much better will the line be?

When they went to Buffalo and almost won in 2024 here are the guys that played the most Offensive snaps outside Maye.

Line: Robinson, Brown, Lowe, Jacobs, Onwenu.
TE: Henry and Hooper
RB: Gibson and Stevensen
WR: Boutte and Bourne played more than Douglas

1/2 those players will not start/play significant minutes and 3 of those 6 were cut and won't even be a backup.

 

[DC Patriots]

Agree with folks the Pats will find a way to win this.

Have a slightly different game script. I think they start Stevenson until he coughs the ball up and try to run at Crosby to let Cambell settle in. A lot of short throws. Deep shots on play action.

Going to go with Boutte as the guy who has a big day.

 

[Ross12]

Preseason games against scrubs doesn’t wipe out 2 years of sucking for real.

But consider that his coaching received was pretty poor those 2 years and he was also forced to start when he's really not a starter. Better coaching this year and being an actual backup can make him adequate for a relief or backup role.

 

[Ring 6]

But consider that his coaching received was pretty poor those 2 years and he was also forced to start when he's really not a starter. Better coaching this year and being an actual backup can make him adequate for a relief or backup role.

I’m not buying the coaching excuse. Bad players don’t suddenly become good when you change coaches.
Why would being a back up make any difffernce in how he plays when he is on the field? It’s like you are saying it’s ok to suck if you are a backup.
When you are out there it doesn’t matter where you are on the depth chart.
Lowe sucks. Unfortunately we couldn’t find 4 better tackles, only 3.

 

[Ross12]

I’m not buying the coaching excuse. Bad players don’t suddenly become good when you change coaches.
Why would being a back up make any difffernce in how he plays when he is on the field? It’s like you are saying it’s ok to suck if you are a backup.
When you are out there it doesn’t matter where you are on the depth chart.
Lowe sucks. Unfortunately we couldn’t find 4 better tackles, only 3.

I just have a hard time believing that most NFL rosters have a 4th tackle better than Vederian Lowe.

 

[jdlboot14]

I see this playing out similar to the Seahawks game last year with Geno's team.
But this time, Pats should be better on O (+ 3pts) and much better on D (- 6pts), and coaching is vastly better (+ 4pts)

Resulting in a Win ~ 27-17

D: I don't believe Jeanty is going to run wild. I don't think they have the WR punch to stress our DBs. Bowers will be doubled. Geno gets impatient in the 2nd half if stymied - causing bad decisions or a lot of QB-runs which end up derailing game plan.
- impact player: Chaisson goes off, 2 sacks + 1FF

O: Our OL will struggle. May not be a great running game 1st half. Maye will have at least 1 TO. But LV 2nd + 3rd level is not good, Pop & Diggs will expose them short/quick. Boutte with a couple big plays.
- impact player: Henderson has ~80yds + 1TD receiving

 

[Ring 6]

I just have a hard time believing that most NFL rosters have a 4th tackle better than Vederian Lowe.

I don’t know if any NFL rosters have a T worse than Lowe.
Quite a few might fall into unknown, but he has proven to be terrible.
The fact that another team might have a worse guy on the end of the bench doesn’t give us extra points when we have to out him in the game.

I understand your basic point, most teams have crappy depth, but if we lose 2 OTs that doesn’t mean every other team has to sit 2 OTs.

It’s 2 different conversations whether teams generally have good depth and whether we are screwed if we have to rely on this guy.

That said Bryant could be worse, but at this point we don’t know that yet, we just know Lowe is unacceptable and awful.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

It would be huge to see Maye get time to throw and post a nice game. Second choice, it will also be huge for him to settle for 150 yards and no TDs (if necessary) rather than try to do too much if the play's not there - just channeling recent Vrabes counseling,

The above stat line wouldn't be a good sign, mind you, but would come with a "taking the point" asterisk