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2025 New England Patriots Training Camp General Discussion

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Chiefs. Terrible.

No wonder their season sucked.
They had trouble replacing their tackles with a long term answers since they let Orlando Brown walk. They had to let Thuney go to pay Trey Smith and Creed Humphrey. It been tougher since paying Mahomes, it would have been tougher without the NFL making it easy on them. They need to draft well and find cheap bandaids.
 
IMO pop and Boutte have already done that... pops skill set is similarly close to wes welker.. now he has a real coach..

Disagree. The Patriots WR curse in my mind isn't finding okayish #3 or #4 WRs in round 4-7 or a good WR who one day becomes a quality starter like Edelman did. It is about finding a talented WR in the first 2 days of the draft who very quickly becomes a very good WR and stays one.

I don't dislike Pop or Boutte. But let's not get it twisted. We shouldn't talk them up like they are special. How many Bouttes or Pops are there in the league right now we haven't heard of because we don't deal with them on a day to day basis? If one came here would you feel excited about it?

Edelman is one of my favorite all time Patriots. But it wasn't just Wes Welker being here that kept him form being the guy. He took some time to grow into his role fully.

IMO to truly break the curse they need a high talent guy and highly drafted guy to come in here and play like it. And by year 2 he isn't only good around here. He is a name the whole league is looking at a guy people talk about outside of the final rounds of fantasy football cause he has the stats to back it up. That is the metric I'll go by. If by year 3 a guy isn't picked in the first 100 picks of most FF mocks he didn't break the curse.
 
Disagree. The Patriots WR curse in my mind isn't finding okayish #3 or #4 WRs in round 4-7 or a good WR who one day becomes a quality starter like Edelman did. It is about finding a talented WR in the first 2 days of the draft who very quickly becomes a very good WR and stays one.

I don't dislike Pop or Boutte. But let's not get it twisted. We shouldn't talk them up like they are special. How many Bouttes or Pops are there in the league right now we haven't heard of because we don't deal with them on a day to day basis? If one came here would you feel excited about it?

Edelman is one of my favorite all time Patriots. But it wasn't just Wes Welker being here that kept him form being the guy. He took some time to grow into his role fully.

IMO to truly break the curse they need a high talent guy and highly drafted guy to come in here and play like it. And by year 2 he isn't only good around here. He is a name the whole league is looking at a guy people talk about outside of the final rounds of fantasy football cause he has the stats to back it up. That is the metric I'll go by. If by year 3 a guy isn't picked in the first 100 picks of most FF mocks he didn't break the curse.

Yep. Golden Tate, Keenan Allen, Tyler Lockett, AJ Brown & George Pickens would've asked What curse...?
 
They were a Fraud conference champion, more so this past season than most other ones.
The fact that you have to say most makes this statement rediculous. Using most because you don't want to actually count them kind of validates them all. You don't just fraudulently do that so frequently.
 
Disagree. The Patriots WR curse in my mind isn't finding okayish #3 or #4 WRs in round 4-7 or a good WR who one day becomes a quality starter like Edelman did. It is about finding a talented WR in the first 2 days of the draft who very quickly becomes a very good WR and stays one.

I don't dislike Pop or Boutte. But let's not get it twisted. We shouldn't talk them up like they are special. How many Bouttes or Pops are there in the league right now we haven't heard of because we don't deal with them on a day to day basis? If one came here would you feel excited about it?

Edelman is one of my favorite all time Patriots. But it wasn't just Wes Welker being here that kept him form being the guy. He took some time to grow into his role fully.

IMO to truly break the curse they need a high talent guy and highly drafted guy to come in here and play like it. And by year 2 he isn't only good around here. He is a name the whole league is looking at a guy people talk about outside of the final rounds of fantasy football cause he has the stats to back it up. That is the metric I'll go by. If by year 3 a guy isn't picked in the first 100 picks of most FF mocks he didn't break the curse.
Thanks for sharing your opinion. Let me elaborate. Not just high round picks were bust even later round picks during the Brady era busted. In ****ty situations last few seasons at least pop and Boutte have shown they can contribute to a team. The second round pick in Thornton got cut in season.. Harry asked for a trade or all things.

Last season Boutte was the play maker for Drake on the outside and commanded teams best corner. Remember Drakes first start? The CB who supposed is an all pro in stingley? Yeah Boutte beat him for a TD, go back and look at all off Drakes big scoring plays Boutte is on most of them. So I'm just simply saying guys that have at least showed something deserve an opportunity. So we'll see what Williams becomes.
 
And, by any metric you want to use, he is underpaid...
Nah, QB’s are overrated. He’s the best for sure… but a large part of him being the best is Andy Reid’s brain and the superior team around him. Also a lesser Chiefs roster is still much better than the really talent starved teams in the NFL.

Mahomes doesn’t look so good on last year’s Raiders, Browns or Giants. He hasn’t looked good the couple times his offensive line fell apart at seasons end or his weapons were lesser.
 
Disagree. The Patriots WR curse in my mind isn't finding okayish #3 or #4 WRs in round 4-7 or a good WR who one day becomes a quality starter like Edelman did. It is about finding a talented WR in the first 2 days of the draft who very quickly becomes a very good WR and stays one.
Curses don’t exist. Some front offices are just better at recognizing talent at certain positions. The BB teams only spent two high round picks in twenty years on WR’s, they preferred vets and late round fliers. It was smart, WR has one of the highest failure rates in draft history.
I don't dislike Pop or Boutte. But let's not get it twisted. We shouldn't talk them up like they are special. How many Bouttes or Pops are there in the league right now we haven't heard of because we don't deal with them on a day to day basis? If one came here would you feel excited about it?

Edelman is one of my favorite all time Patriots. But it wasn't just Wes Welker being here that kept him form being the guy. He took some time to grow into his role fully.
Pop has the talent to be as good as any slot WR they had going back to Dave Meggett and ending with Edelman. Obviously this team doesn’t have Brady… there’s a lot that has to go right for a passing attack and offense to be effective besides “weapons.” Blocking, scheme, QB play… it’s a team game.
IMO to truly break the curse they need a high talent guy and highly drafted guy to come in here and play like it. And by year 2 he isn't only good around here. He is a name the whole league is looking at a guy people talk about outside of the final rounds of fantasy football cause he has the stats to back it up. That is the metric I'll go by. If by year 3 a guy isn't picked in the first 100 picks of most FF mocks he didn't break the curse.
I fall back to those early 2000’s Patriot teams. Troy Brown in the slot was an 8th round pick…. today he’d be an UDFA, the 8th round no longer exists. The outside was manned by big physical 7th round pick David Givens. He wasn’t super fast or flashy, but he was physical, could get open and had iron grip hands. Out the other side was UDFA speedster who came from the Arena League David Patten. He was smallish but stupid fast, he took the top off the defense and forced opponents to defend the entire field.

You don’t need superweapons… you just need competent guys who can fill a role, blocking and a good QB.
 
Chiefs. Terrible.

No wonder their season sucked.
They won 15 games and went to the Bowl.

The Eagles were a bad match up for any AFC team.
 
Curses don’t exist. Some front offices are just better at recognizing talent at certain positions. The BB teams only spent two high round picks in twenty years on WR’s, they preferred vets and late round fliers. It was smart, WR has one of the highest failure rates in draft history.

Pop has the talent to be as good as any slot WR they had going back to Dave Meggett and ending with Edelman. Obviously this team doesn’t have Brady… there’s a lot that has to go right for a passing attack and offense to be effective besides “weapons.” Blocking, scheme, QB play… it’s a team game.

I fall back to those early 2000’s Patriot teams. Troy Brown in the slot was an 8th round pick…. today he’d be an UDFA, the 8th round no longer exists. The outside was manned by big physical 7th round pick David Givens. He wasn’t super fast or flashy, but he was physical, could get open and had iron grip hands. Out the other side was UDFA speedster who came from the Arena League David Patten. He was smallish but stupid fast, he took the top off the defense and forced opponents to defend the entire field.

You don’t need superweapons… you just need competent guys who can fill a role, blocking and a good QB.
While I agree with your overall point, you don't need a top 10 #1 WR to win, let's also keep in mind those offenses weren't that good either. They knew who they were, a ball control, give our defense a chance to rest, don't make mistakes, take what is given, non explosive offense and a big part of it was lack of talent at WR. The other part was a young Brady that still needed time to grow but let's not over romance how good they were because they won a super bowl. Of the 58 teams that have won super bowls that 2001 team is ranked somewhere in the 50's as far as talent. Heart and grit? Somewhere in the top 10 for sure but you can't build a team like that expecting to consistently win.
 
Thanks for sharing your opinion. Let me elaborate. Not just high round picks were bust even later round picks during the Brady era busted. In ****ty situations last few seasons at least pop and Boutte have shown they can contribute to a team. The second round pick in Thornton got cut in season.. Harry asked for a trade or all things.

Last season Boutte was the play maker for Drake on the outside and commanded teams best corner. Remember Drakes first start? The CB who supposed is an all pro in stingley? Yeah Boutte beat him for a TD, go back and look at all off Drakes big scoring plays Boutte is on most of them. So I'm just simply saying guys that have at least showed something deserve an opportunity. So we'll see what Williams becomes.
After that Big play Boutte was being shaded by the Safety's on many deep plays. I think Boutte will benefit from Diggs and torch the Defense silently. Some here are really undervaluing Boutte.
 
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