Speculation - Diggs to Start Season on the PUP?

[Real fan 02]

players can be taken off pup at any time prior to cut down day... if they are removed, then they are good to go...

If they remain on the PUP list after cut down day, they have to miss the first four games...

Got it. I figured it was something to the effect of what your were saying just wasn't entirely sure. Noticed Davis is on the NFI list anything on that?

 

[Pape]

Got it. I figured it was something to the effect of what your were saying just wasn't entirely sure. Noticed Davis is on the NFI list anything on that?

NFI - Non football injury list... just means he's hurt, but didn't get hurt via a team related activity ... basically it protects teams from having to pay an injury guarantee; happens when guys get hurt working out on their own or get into an accident etc...

He can't practice until he passes a medical... But once he clears a medical check hes good to go... Hope Davis is cleared by the time camp starts, but ??? ... there's no info on what the injury actually is afaik...

 

[Real fan 02]

players can be taken off pup at any time prior to cut down day... if they are removed, then they are good to go...

If they remain on the PUP list after cut down day, they have to miss the first four games...

NFI - Non football injury list... just means he's hurt, but didn't get hurt via a team related activity ... basically it protects teams from having to pay an injury guarantee; happens when guys get hurt working out on their own or get into an accident etc...

He can't practice until he passes a medical... But once he clears a medical check hes good to go... Hope Davis is cleared by the time camp starts, but ??? ... there's no info on what the injury actually is afaik...

Reiss

 

[WazzuWheatfarmer]

The ACL recovering process has gotten remarkably better since the career ender it used to be. It's the recovery process that determines how fast a player can get back. Diggs has clearly put in the work. I feel like him going through the injury has Sharpened his focus and he wants to prove he is still elite.

True. The ACL recovery had greatly improved. Still, Diggs has recovered very quickly, even by today’s standards. That’s great. I just hope he’s not pushing too hard too fast. But if he’s on the field healthy Week 1, that’s definitely a great thing for the Patriots.

 

[Real fan 02]

NFI - Non football injury list... just means he's hurt, but didn't get hurt via a team related activity ... basically it protects teams from having to pay an injury guarantee; happens when guys get hurt working out on their own or get into an accident etc...

He can't practice until he passes a medical... But once he clears a medical check hes good to go... Hope Davis is cleared by the time camp starts, but ??? ... there's no info on what the injury actually is afaik...

Sent you Reiss tweet. So pretty much as you stated. He was at minicamp practices so to your point likely something working out on his own.. next week Monday is really the day things will ramp up for competitive practices.. be nice to see him out there with his all pro partner..

 

[Real fan 02]

True. The ACL recovery had greatly improved. Still, Diggs has recovered very quickly, even by today’s standards. That’s great. I just hope he’s not pushing too hard too fast. But if he’s on the field healthy Week 1, that’s definitely a great thing for the Patriots.

Agreed there. Watching his YouTube channel ( definitely check it out) it shows indepth footage of him going through the recovery. It appears that himself, the organization and his trainers all have a plan for him. Diggs has worked his but off, he's a 11 year veteran.. I would hope that he would know when to push himself and not push himself.. but your right.. week 1 is huge for Drake and the offense.. you want he and Drake to be in unison be the time the joint practices roll around.

 

[Ross12]

Adrian Peterson returned from an ACL in 9 months to start. Diggs will be at 9 months in early August. It is a quick return but not unprecedented.

It’s not just that he’s back, he looks extremely good. Not unprecedented, but still very impressive. Speaks to his dedication and effort.

 

[Pape]

Sent you Reiss tweet. So pretty much as you stated. He was at minicamp practices so to your point likely something working out on his own.. next week Monday is really the day things will ramp up for competitive practices.. be nice to see him out there with his all pro partner..

who knows what the injury is... scraped a knuckle grating parmesan cheese or he could have stubbed a toe going to the bathroom at 1 am... doesn't really matter... If it was a major issue we would have heard something...

 

[Pape]

It’s not just that he’s back, he looks extremely good. Not unprecedented, but still very impressive. Speaks to his dedication and effort.

Yeah, he had a very fast ... *cough* hgh *cough* ... recovery period...

 

[Ross12]

True. The ACL recovery had greatly improved. Still, Diggs has recovered very quickly, even by today’s standards. That’s great. I just hope he’s not pushing too hard too fast. But if he’s on the field healthy Week 1, that’s definitely a great thing for the Patriots.

It will be fun to watch Gonzo and Davis lock down the Commanders’ and Vikings’ WRs. Will also be interesting to see how NE fares against the WAS and especially MIN defenses.

 

[Real fan 02]

who knows what the injury is... scraped a knuckle grating parmesan cheese or he could have stubbed a toe going to the bathroom at 1 am... doesn't really matter... If it was a major issue we would have heard something...

Very true, the only knock on Davis is injury history otherwise guys a top CB in the league for sure and brings championship pedigree to the defense. If he misses any extension of time.. we have a more than capable backup in Austin.

 

[Ross12]

Yeah, he had a very fast ... *cough* hgh *cough* ... recovery period...

You know this is an interesting point. Let’s say hypothetically he did take steroids to get back faster. It’s an interesting gamble:

- juice up and be ready for week 1 but risk a possible 4-6 week suspension if caught
- don’t juice up, but still be recovering in camp and face 4 weeks of PUP to start the season

You can understand reasons to pick the former. The suspension is not guaranteed and even if caught, the punishment is similar to what you’d have faced on PUP anyway.

 

[Real fan 02]

It will be fun to watch Gonzo and Davis lock down the Commanders’ and Vikings’ WRs. Will also be interesting to see how NE fares against the WAS and especially MIN defenses.

Gonzo appears like a man on a mission.. he likely feels slighted being 2nd team.. the other guys " supposedly " ahead of him have been in a league a year or 2 longer.. however no singular CB in my viewpoint shuts down WRs like Gonzo has.. early on last season Gonzo was a victim of mayo and the dysfunctional staff.. that had more to do with busted coverages..

 

[Pape]

You know this is an interesting point. Let’s say hypothetically he did take steroids to get back faster. It’s an interesting gamble:

- juice up and be ready for week 1 but risk a possible 4-6 week suspension if caught
- don’t juice up, but still be recovering in camp and face 4 weeks of PUP to start the season

You can understand reasons to pick the former. The suspension is not guaranteed and even if caught, the punishment is similar to what you’d have faced on PUP anyway.

Rodney got caught for that very reason... suspended 4 games in 07 for using hgh trying to recover faster ...

I have no problems with guys doing that... In fact, I think the NFL should allow peds like HGH as long as they are used during a doctor managed recovery process... There is no reason not to use all facets of medical science during rehab...

sure it can lead to guys pushing the bounds with some trying to cheat the process. but eh, deal with that as it comes up...

 

[Real fan 02]

Rodney got caught for that very reason... suspended 4 games in 07 for using hgh trying to recover faster ...

I have no problems with guys doing that... In fact, I think the NFL should allow peds like HGH as long as they are used during a doctor managed recovery process... sure it can lead to guys pushing the bounds with some trying to cheat the process. but eh, deal with that as it comes up...

Hot rod forget to have it delivered in his wife's name...



I approve this post-

 

[n1997y]

He can look great in workouts and the muscles around the injured knee can be in great shape, but the ACL ligaments may not be ready yet to handle full speed cutting in full pads. So there'd be increased risk of reinjury if rushed.

At least that's what I think I understand of how this works.

There’s a lot more to it. But pads won't make a difference. Full speed cutting might, but that’s no different with or without pads. It comes down to rebuilding strength and flexibility. But if those are at the point where he is medically cleared to go full bore in workouts it’s going to be all or nothing. Muscles and ACL and everything else have to all be ready or he’s not ready.

Pads don't make a difference. If he can run and cut a full speed in shorts and shells, he can do it in pads, which are almost non existent for a WR. Now can he take contact, that remains to be seen. From the footage I've seen, he appears to be running and cutting at what appears to be full speed.

Exactly. His workout videos do not seem to show him holding back. So now the biggest thing is getting comfortable and building confidence so he is in fact going flat out without holding back and not even thinking about it so he can concentrate completely on the ball and the defense and everything else, not wondering whether he can trust his knee.

Agreed there. Watching his YouTube channel ( definitely check it out) it shows indepth footage of him going through the recovery. It appears that himself, the organization and his trainers all have a plan for him. Diggs has worked his but off, he's a 11 year veteran.. I would hope that he would know when to push himself and not push himself.. but your right.. week 1 is huge for Drake and the offense.. you want he and Drake to be in unison be the time the joint practices roll around.

Yes, there’s a plan. I’ve had much more opportunity to rehab knee surgeries than I’d ever have wanted (one cadaver ACL long ago, two total knee replacements more recently). Surgeon who did my ACL worked on Dee Brown, and was team doctor for the U.S. Women’s Olympic Ski Team. The husband and wife team that rehabbed me after the two replacements have some pro athletes as clients, including Steph, Chris Paul, Jeff Halpern. They have reconstructive knee surgery and the subsequent rehab pretty well dialed in these days. They’ll monitor the healing process, work strength and flexibility as much as possible without overdoing it to control scar tissue, and coordinate the rehab with full body training and conditioning so core function is maintained and imbalance is avoided.

I’m not sure exactly what surgical procedure Diggs would have had. I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t be a cadaver ACL graft like I got, because revascularization takes longer than his recovery time. IIRC one of the common ACL repairs harvests part of the patellar tendon to be repurposed as an ACL graft, but I’m not sure if that would be used for a competitive athlete in contact sport such as football. I learned about that one when I was told it was not an option because the rest of my knee was too badly compromised. That makes me think it might not be the best choice for repairing an NFL WR or RB either, but I’m unfamiliar with what other options there might be.

Anyway, the point of all that is that there very well might be other collateral concerns, like healing and rehabbing the donor site for the graft as well as the ACL repair itself. All of that will be very carefully considered and planned and monitored by his medical team.

As far as timeline, my surgeries were certainly not the same as his, but both knee replacements were outpatient surgery. In by nine out by five, just like dry cleaning. Both times I walked out of the recovery room bearing weight on the newly installed replacement parts. His was doubtless different, but that gives an idea of current practices. I had to wait a couple of weeks before beginning PT to allow the incisions to heal, then started flexibility and range of motion work. Strength building kicked in once range of motion was satisfactory, and I was discharged with clearance to resume full activities within about nine months. That’s starting as a generally sedentary guy in my sixties (first knee replacement) and now early seventies for the second one. Incidentally return to full activities included clearance to hit the slopes for some downhill skiing last winter (but no snowboarding) although circumstances didn’t work out for me to try it.

Anyway, from my experience and understanding, his physical recovery is pretty much complete by now. The main thing remaining is the mental conditioning, confidence building and learning the new sensations because there’s residual effects and physical changes that he needs to get used to. From his workout videos it seems he is well into that already, so he should be able to forget about that and concentrate on learning the new playbook to be good to go at the start of the season.

 

[SlowGettingUp]

Note there is no functional difference between the PUP and NFI lists - just the origin of the injury.

 

[n1997y]

You know this is an interesting point. Let’s say hypothetically he did take steroids to get back faster. It’s an interesting gamble:

- juice up and be ready for week 1 but risk a possible 4-6 week suspension if caught
- don’t juice up, but still be recovering in camp and face 4 weeks of PUP to start the season

You can understand reasons to pick the former. The suspension is not guaranteed and even if caught, the punishment is similar to what you’d have faced on PUP anyway.

Not sure how much juice would really be needed. There’s a lot of natural and legal substances that can be used to tweak the bodily chemistry, plus electro stim and heat and cryo and massage and probably magnetism that will promote healing and recovery. Heck that’s enough to pack the schedule so full it’s difficult to see how he would have time to play around with antler spray or baggies of pink powder…

 

[Real fan 02]

There’s a lot more to it. But pads won't make a difference. Full speed cutting might, but that’s no different with or without pads. It comes down to rebuilding strength and flexibility. But if those are at the point where he is medically cleared to go full bore in workouts it’s going to be all or nothing. Muscles and ACL and everything else have to all be ready or he’s not ready.

Exactly. His workout videos do not seem to show him holding back. So now the biggest thing is getting comfortable and building confidence so he is in fact going flat out without holding back and not even thinking about it so he can concentrate completely on the ball and the defense and everything else, not wondering whether he can trust his knee.

Yes, there’s a plan. I’ve had much more opportunity to rehab knee surgeries than I’d ever have wanted (one cadaver ACL long ago, two total knee replacements more recently). Surgeon who did my ACL worked on Dee Brown, and was team doctor for the U.S. Women’s Olympic Ski Team. The husband and wife team that rehabbed me after the two replacements have some pro athletes as clients, including Steph, Chris Paul, Jeff Halpern. They have reconstructive knee surgery and the subsequent rehab pretty well dialed in these days. They’ll monitor the healing process, work strength and flexibility as much as possible without overdoing it to control scar tissue, and coordinate the rehab with full body training and conditioning so core function is maintained and imbalance is avoided.

I’m not sure exactly what surgical procedure Diggs would have had. I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t be a cadaver ACL graft like I got, because revascularization takes longer than his recovery time. IIRC one of the common ACL repairs harvests part of the patellar tendon to be repurposed as an ACL graft, but I’m not sure if that would be used for a competitive athlete in contact sport such as football. I learned about that one when I was told it was not an option because the rest of my knee was too badly compromised. That makes me think it might not be the best choice for repairing an NFL WR or RB either, but I’m unfamiliar with what other options there might be.

Anyway, the point of all that is that there very well might be other collateral concerns, like healing and rehabbing the donor site for the graft as well as the ACL repair itself. All of that will be very carefully considered and planned and monitored by his medical team.

As far as timeline, my surgeries were certainly not the same as his, but both knee replacements were outpatient surgery. In by nine out by five, just like dry cleaning. Both times I walked out of the recovery room bearing weight on the newly installed replacement parts. His was doubtless different, but that gives an idea of current practices. I had to wait a couple of weeks before beginning PT to allow the incisions to heal, then started flexibility and range of motion work. Strength building kicked in once range of motion was satisfactory, and I was discharged with clearance to resume full activities within about nine months. That’s starting as a generally sedentary guy in my sixties (first knee replacement) and now early seventies for the second one. Incidentally return to full activities included clearance to hit the slopes for some downhill skiing last winter (but no snowboarding) although circumstances didn’t work out for me to try it.

Anyway, from my experience and understanding, his physical recovery is pretty much complete by now. The main thing remaining is the mental conditioning, confidence building and learning the new sensations because there’s residual effects and physical changes that he needs to get used to. From his workout videos it seems he is well into that already, so he should be able to forget about that and concentrate on learning the new playbook to be good to go at the start of the season.

Wow, that is awesome information thanks for sharing all of that it definitely gives me some great perspectives on ACLs.. more than I thought I'd knew. Much appreciated! Well as we all know athletes have the privileges of having round the clock treatment is they so chose.. from hyperbaric chambers and other means. For example Brady had Guerrero Brady said if not for him he would likely had been done by 31 playing. If you notice Brady became a more deadlier QB post ACL injury.. of course 2007 was magnificent. But it's the treatment as you mentioned perfectly how serious guys take it, some organizations balk at top tier players going outside the organization to recover and rehab. I recall Diggs talking about the scar tissue in his last episode. Diggs looks a good as I've ever seen him in his career. Football shape is totally different than anything else. He looks ever so focused and I think we see a 2020 esquqe like Diggs meaning the effects he will have on Drake and the entire offense.

 

[Real fan 02]

Not sure how much juice would really be needed. There’s a lot of natural and legal substances that can be used to tweak the bodily chemistry, plus electro stim and heat and cryo and massage and probably magnetism that will promote healing and recovery. Heck that’s enough to pack the schedule so full it’s difficult to see how he would have time to play around with antler spray or baggies of pink powder…

It's amazing how far recovery aids and herbal products have come.. those that were "illegal " say 15-20 years ago are now marketed.. some owners even have ties in business to some of these companies..