Malcolm Butler sort of talks about his SB benching

[rochrist]

In yet somehow every Bill Belichick benching besides one has made it's way to the media within like a day or two. The one where the owner is calling it personal and his star player is having his team tell the media how pissed off he and other players were over how it was handled is conveniently the one that didn't get out there.

You can disagree with Kraft, but he's legitimately the only person on the planet who could drag Bill into his office and demand an explanation for why he made such a huge decision with the team he owns. And if he just flagarantly makes up a bs lie about Bill Belichick and airs it out to the world, he looks like absolute dogshit if Bill comes back and says no he's lying with receipts.

Again there's a reason there's 1 benching we didn't get an explanation for within a couple days, still doesn't have an official explanation out there, has the owner calling it personal, has players leaking to media that it's personal, and has a ton of people at Patriots place who are connected to all the hire ups going around saying it was personal. And frankly there's more than a few Boston reporters who have alluded to what happened and it's been out there. In fact, the biggest elements of it were actually one of the first things the media put out (the Steve Belichick/Malcolm Butler fight).

Star player is a stretch. Butler was bad that year, all year.

And there's a reason why whenever people try to say it's a football decision they can never explain why Bill watched his defense have the worst game of the year and didn't go back to the CB who played the most snaps that year and was crying on the sideline of the Super Bowl.

If the story didn't reflect incredibly badly on Butler do you truly think he would have kept his mouth shut all these years?

 

[rochrist]

The whole "Butler wasn't that good anyways" thing falls apart when you realize the Patriots spent a whole Super Bowl season that year consistently deciding he was going to get the most snaps on defense. You don't win one way all year, switch it, watch your team have the worst defensive game since the opener where you objectively **** your pants vs the Chiefs and then stay with your new plan when the way you went about things all season was more successful.

Nobody would be questioning this if the Pats defense were having an average game or Butler was in and out of the line up all year. They made a change that was against what they did all year and then stuck with it when they were melting.

Him being awful doesn't mean they had somebody better to replace him.

 

[Wozzy]

Rowe was graded out as one of the worst CB’s in the NFL that season and the media said during Super Bowl week that the Eagles were going target him whenever he made it on the field which was odd why Bill still put him out there.

Rowe missed the entire season until week 12 and didn't make a start until week 14, so how could he "grade out poorly?"

You're confusing Rowe with Butler, Butler was one of the worst starting CB's based on stats... catches, yards and TD's, not some dumb PFF grade.

Rowe played for the Eagles as a rookie, so I suspect they thought they knew the guy. The Patriots lost because Nick Foles had all day to throw, no defensive front.

Butler wasn’t that good in 2017, but we’ve seen way worse. He also played in the AFCCG game two weeks prior. If he was such a liability, they would’ve benched him sooner.

Rowe wasn't healthy, they didn't have any option.

He clearly did something during the week that Bill didn’t like and the decision was made to put Rowe on Jeffrey and Gilmore on Agholor instead.

Yeah... he screwed over his teammates by putting his contract situation above winning. That's why he was crying... he knew he was wrong. In hindsight the mistake BB made with Butler was not trading him that offseason when the Saints were offering a 2nd. Butler peaked in 2016.

 

[lancerman]

Star player is a stretch. Butler was bad that year, all year.



If the story didn't reflect incredibly badly on Butler do you truly think he would have kept his mouth shut all these years?

It reflects badly on multiple people. It makes Butler look like an ******* who is ungrateful who also can go way overboard, it's personally embarrassing for Steve and professionally a bad look that a young coach had a personal matter impact the team at it's most important game, and Bill Belichick knows it benefits both guys to not let it be public which is why his team never addresses it in the media even when guys like Kraft and Brady's camp make comments to the media.

Butler is far blameless in the matter, it's just that it wasn't a football decision and the owner on down in the org have let people know as much. At the same time, for 6 years after Kraft still had enough faith in Bill to have him be the HC so he made sure his team and front office didn't go defcon one and air out dirty laundry while still making it known they were pissed about how it all went down.

Him being awful doesn't mean they had somebody better to replace him.

Rowe in that game was straight up worse than Butler was all season. You don't magically decide in the last game of the year to replace your post active defensive player and watch his replacement have the worst game a CB on the roster had all year and then never make move back to what worked better all season. There is no world where you look at Butler's play all year, watch Rowe in the SB, and still decide it makes no sense to go back to what you did for 18 games that season.

And I'll even grant you, that there are no guarantees Butler would save the game. You still can't watch Rowe all game and say what you were fine with for the whole rest of the season wasn't worth reverting back to.

If this wasn't the Bill Belichick and the Patriots, we'd all be going "haha they took their most active defensive player and replaced him in the Super Bowl and they got killed, shows how stupid and incompetent some of these teams are". But we know Bill is neither stupid nor incompetent. Which is why this has been the big issue it has for years.

Again at the end of the day, one mistake doesn't offset all the success Bill brought us, which is why Kraft still employed him for years despite being ripshit about it and why players who made it clear they felt betrayed have since got over it and focused on the good times.

 

[rochrist]

It reflects badly on multiple people. It makes Butler look like an ******* who is ungrateful who also can go way overboard, it's personally embarrassing for Steve and professionally a bad look that a young coach had a personal matter impact the team at it's most important game, and Bill Belichick knows it benefits both guys to not let it be public which is why his team never addresses it in the media even when guys like Kraft and Brady's camp make comments to the media.

Butler is far blameless in the matter, it's just that it wasn't a football decision and the owner on down in the org have let people know as much. At the same time, for 6 years after Kraft still had enough faith in Bill to have him be the HC so he made sure his team and front office didn't go defcon one and air out dirty laundry while still making it known they were pissed about how it all went down.

Rowe in that game was straight up worse than Butler was all season. You don't magically decide in the last game of the year to replace your post active defensive player and watch his replacement have the worst game a CB on the roster had all year and then never make move back to what worked better all season. There is no world where you look at Butler's play all year, watch Rowe in the SB, and still decide it makes no sense to go back to what you did for 18 games that season.

And I'll even grant you, that there are no guarantees Butler would save the game. You still can't watch Rowe all game and say what you were fine with for the whole rest of the season wasn't worth reverting back to.

If this wasn't the Bill Belichick and the Patriots, we'd all be going "haha they took their most active defensive player and replaced him in the Super Bowl and they got killed, shows how stupid and incompetent some of these teams are". But we know Bill is neither stupid nor incompetent. Which is why this has been the big issue it has for years.

Again at the end of the day, one mistake doesn't offset all the success Bill brought us, which is why Kraft still employed him for years despite being ripshit about it and why players who made it clear they felt betrayed have since got over it and focused on the good times.

Bringing Steve into it means you're buying in to one particular story.

 

[lancerman]

Bringing Steve into it means you're buying in to one particular story.

People in the building buy into that story

 

[Wozzy]

delete

 

[sb1]

Why in the would the coach who won more SBs than anyone and gave credit to the players every time he was asked spitefully bench a player? What could possibly be the cause for spite? Why would that sane coach sign that same player again.

You tell me.

 

[Wozzy]

You tell me.

This was the same documentary that pretended Belichick was a tourist just along for the ride and the real dynasty genius was Bob and Jonathan?

Malcolm Butler sucked in 2017, want to know who said so… why Malcolm Butler did.

Malcolm Butler admits he had a bad season in 2017

Two years ago, Malcolm Butler became a household name by saving the game for the New England Patriots on one of the most remarkable plays in Super Bowl

larrybrownsports.com

He was arguably the worst starting CB in the NFL that season and he was never good again. The Titans paid him, then Vrabel benched him for sucking. Show us a time Butler was good after 2016? He wasn’t…..

 

[Ring 6]

You tell me.

The guy who created an entire TV series to trash Belichick to make himself seem like the key to the dynasty?

 

[WhatJustHappened]

You guys are fkn Pathetic

 

[aluminum seats]

This was the same documentary that pretended Belichick was a tourist just along for the ride and the real dynasty genius was Bob and Jonathan?

Malcolm Butler sucked in 2017, want to know who said so… why Malcolm Butler did.

Malcolm Butler admits he had a bad season in 2017

Two years ago, Malcolm Butler became a household name by saving the game for the New England Patriots on one of the most remarkable plays in Super Bowl

larrybrownsports.com

He was arguably the worst starting CB in the NFL that season and he was never good again. The Titans paid him, then Vrabel benched him for sucking. Show us a time Butler was good after 2016? He wasn’t…..

They got to the Super Bowl that year with Butler playing nearly 100% of the snaps.

They lost the Super Bowl with a historically awful defensive performance with Butler on the bench.

Whatever Belichick was smoking to bench him in the first half, when it was clear the Pats were on pace to give up 40 or 50 points and lose the Super Bowl, he should’ve played him. This **** isn’t difficult guys, sorry.

 

[signbabybrady]

They got to the Super Bowl that year with Butler playing nearly 100% of the snaps.

They lost the Super Bowl with a historically awful defensive performance with Butler on the bench.

Whatever Belichick was smoking to bench him in the first half, when it was clear the Pats were on pace to give up 40 or 50 points and lose the Super Bowl, he should’ve played him. This **** isn’t difficult guys, sorry.

Butler did something to cause it not Bill.

 

[aluminum seats]

Butler did something to cause it not Bill.

Unless Butler went on a killing spree, in which case Bill really should’ve called the cops, that doesn’t hold a teaspoon of water.

 

[sb1]

This was the same documentary that pretended Belichick was a tourist just along for the ride and the real dynasty genius was Bob and Jonathan?

So? Why would Kraft fabricate that in his own documentary? why would Danny Amendola still be pissed off about it even to this day?

 

[sb1]

Unless Butler went on a killing spree, in which case Bill really should’ve called the cops, that doesn’t hold a teaspoon of water.

That or something like he bet against his own team. Which obviously would get him cut immediately and kept far away from the game by both the Patriots and the NFL…and not dressed for the game standing on the sidelines.

Worst coaching decision in a Super Bowl ever. It’s ok to admit BB f’ed up not sure why it’s difficult for some.

 

[signbabybrady]

Unless Butler went on a killing spree, in which case Bill really should’ve called the cops, that doesn’t hold a teaspoon of water.

That or something like he bet against his own team. Which obviously would get him cut immediately and kept far away from the game by both the Patriots and the NFL…and not dressed for the game standing on the sidelines.

Worst coaching decision in a Super Bowl ever. It’s ok to admit BB f’ed up not sure why it’s difficult for some.

That's always been the rough part to swallow. There is probably a small a subset of things where you would dress him and still discipline him. I don't think the subset is zero and without knowing what it was you guys have decided to just put it all on Bill. You give zero culpability to Butler as if he did nothing.

Also your line of thinking ignores that the final decision may have been made after the active roster was submitted. Also another difficult part of the story to justify but you guys again put it all on Bill with no consideration that Butler actually did something that warranted action.

The fact that Bill refuses to throw Butler under the bridge is an admirable thing especially given how much heat he gets from haters like you over it. And it's that sort of thing that likely contributes to the event not blowing up the team and then being able to pull off another title.

 

[aluminum seats]

you guys have decided to just put it all on Bill. You give zero culpability to Butler as if he did nothing

That’s not exactly it for me. I don’t care about Malcolm Butler at all. I care about the Patriots winning Super Bowls. I have no doubt something happened. My point is that there was a Super Bowl to be taken against Nick Foles and the Philadelphia Eagles. You got to the Super Bowl with Malcolm Butler playing more snaps than any other player on the defense. It’s insane to think you can simply bench him and not have that have an impact. The defense played historically badly, and at halftime it was clear the Eagles were going to score 40 or 50 points. At that point there was a Super Bowl to be won if Belichick had simply taken Butler aside, regardless of whatever in the world might’ve happened, and said, let’s win a Super Bowl. Said to the team, let’s win a Super Bowl. They would’ve won. Can I prove that? No because it’s an alternate universe. But in the universe we do have Butler stayed on the bench and the Patriots lost.

EVERYTHING else is beside the point. “Malcolm was sick, Malcolm had a mental breakdown, Malcolm was crying, there was simply no way he could’ve gotten on the field and done anything, blah blah blah.” The defense couldn’t have played any worse.

Belichick was a great coach, but he wasn’t perfect. He screwed this up. It sucks, because a loss based off of a decision like that as opposed to an error on the field is tougher to swallow. But denial just prolongs the agony. Let’s just all agree on this and let the healing begin. God bless America.

 

[aluminum seats]

Btw apologies @pazrul72 for going on about Malcolm Butler in this thread that has nothing to do with that. Enjoyed your OP, interesting stuff

 

[Wozzy]

They got to the Super Bowl that year with Butler playing nearly 100% of the snaps.

They lost the Super Bowl with a historically awful defensive performance with Butler on the bench.

Whatever Belichick was smoking to bench him in the first half, when it was clear the Pats were on pace to give up 40 or 50 points and lose the Super Bowl, he should’ve played him. This **** isn’t difficult guys, sorry.

And Butler allowed league worst in yards and TD’s allowed by a CB… teams picked on him.

They also had Stephon Gilmore as a stud on one side so that mitigated Butlers horrid play. If Eric Rowe wasn’t injured and available until late in the season there’s a strong possibility Butler would have been replaced sooner.

Their defense gave up an historically awful Super Bowl performance because Hightower, Alan Branch, Jon Jones and Patrick Chung (in game) missed the Super Bowl with injuries.

Football is won in the trenches… a CB who sucked all that season and for the next three years before retiring wasn’t helping.