POLL: Caleb Williams or Drake Maye?

[Ross12]

Belichick stays, it’s a trade back (twice) and take a safety with the 25th pick

Just saying they do really need a free safety lol.

Just for fun I played this out - Pats trade down from 2 to 8 with NYG because the Giants want to replace Daniel Jones. Pats get 8 + Giants' two 2nd rounders (40 and 45) + their 3rd rounder (72).

Then Pats trade down from 8 to 25 with KC because KC wants a top WR prospect. Pats get 25 + KC's 2nd (57) + KC's 3rd (89) + KC's 2024 2nd rounder.

In totality this would leave the Pats with these picks:

Top 103 - 9(!!) picks: 25, 34, 40, 45, 57, 66, 72, 89, 103
Outside top 103 - 3 picks: 138, 184, 226
Added 2024 picks: KC's 2nd rounder

If you think this draft is meaty in the 2nd and 3rd as many do then that's a lot of dart throws.

 

[mgteich]

Perhaps we need a poll of Maye or Daniels.

The team will wont' necessarily choose Maye over Daniels.

 

[TinhWoodhead]

Caleb wants equity of whatever team drafts him. Unproven guy who thinks he deserves that kind of compensation. Someone who thinks like that imo is a red flag.

I haven't seen much of Maye or Daniels to really say. I just think of all the hyped QBs who have become crap the past 10 years.

Daniels runs too much, while exciting to watch, can be stopped in the nfl, so I Maye have to go with drake

 

[TheRainMaker]

I watch a lot of USC games and they haven't had one high ranking QB that has panned out in the NFL since Carson Palmer. The only QB I knew was going to bust was Sanchez - I never liked him and Carroll was right in saying he was making a mistake leaving early (only started one year). I liked Darnold and thought he was going to do well until he went to Gase and the Jets.

Now that I think about it, how weird is it that Matt Cassel never saw the field at USC (Leinart's backup), yet had a better career than Matt Leinart? That is wild! I loved Leinart at USC and thought he was going to do well in the NFL. That was our pro team out here in the early to mid 2000's.

I think Williams is very talented, but history is not on his side. A question Dan Orlofsky believes will be asked is why he plays a lot of backyard ball? Is it because he feels he needs to make a play because the defense was Madden AI level bad or is because he can't go through progressions?

 

[They_Hate_We]

One thing to note J Daniels and Penix Jr are throwing to NFL caliber WR's. We have to wonder if those boys are making them look better than they really are just something to ponder.

Can't speak for Penix, but I've watched a ton of Daniels. One of the most impressive passing abilities is his ability to throw into tight windows at the sideline and in the back of the end zone against tight coverage. He drops dimes just out of reach of the defenders. Mac (at Bama) was just throwing the ball deep and his receivers just outran the coverage. Also, his scrambling ability scares the crap out of college defenses. When he's rolling out, it's difficult for defenders to commit to cover the receiver or stop Daniels. These types of plays are really a result of Daniels' skill.

I think Nabers will be a good WR in the NFL. He's strong, wins his share of 50-50 balls, and is difficult to bring down after the catch. He doesn't play like a speedster though. Thomas Jr's success may be more due to Daniels and Nabors. He's tall and fast, and caught a lot of touchdowns this year, however, this is the first year he's really been noticed on the depth chart for LSU. IMHO opinion, if we're looking at a receiver in the 2nd round and Brian Thomas Jr, and Xavier Legette are both available, I'd take Legette. Again...just an opinion.

By the way, as an LSU fan, it sucks to think I won't see another game with Daniels at QB for the Tigers again. The guy is just FUN TO WATCH! Just like Burrow was.

 

[BennyBledsoe]

If your GM expresses interest in Caleb, expect pain in the future. The kid is not NFL quality mentally. For QBs, that is the BIGGEST question. In the NFL, it's all studying. It's all anticipation. In short, it's all between the ears. And Williams has an echo chamber in there.

EDIT: Kyler Murray is a perfect example. If you are even hinting/considering that STUDYING THE PLAYBOOK should be a stipulation of a new contract, you made a mistake. And you're about to make another one signing him to another contract.

 

[VrabelJr]

Just saying they do really need a free safety lol.

Just for fun I played this out - Pats trade down from 2 to 8 with NYG because the Giants want to replace Daniel Jones. Pats get 8 + Giants' two 2nd rounders (40 and 45) + their 3rd rounder (72).

Then Pats trade down from 8 to 25 with KC because KC wants a top WR prospect. Pats get 25 + KC's 2nd (57) + KC's 3rd (89) + KC's 2024 2nd rounder.

In totality this would leave the Pats with these picks:

Top 103 - 9(!!) picks: 25, 34, 40, 45, 57, 66, 72, 89, 103
Outside top 103 - 3 picks: 138, 184, 226
Added 2024 picks: KC's 2nd rounder

If you think this draft is meaty in the 2nd and 3rd as many do then that's a lot of dart throws.

It's more likely that we ask for higher picks in future years than tons of pick this year. Definitely in the case of the high first rounder I hope we would ask for a future first.

 

[vicspats]

Just saying they do really need a free safety lol.

Just for fun I played this out - Pats trade down from 2 to 8 with NYG because the Giants want to replace Daniel Jones. Pats get 8 + Giants' two 2nd rounders (40 and 45) + their 3rd rounder (72).

Then Pats trade down from 8 to 25 with KC because KC wants a top WR prospect. Pats get 25 + KC's 2nd (57) + KC's 3rd (89) + KC's 2024 2nd rounder.

In totality this would leave the Pats with these picks:

Top 103 - 9(!!) picks: 25, 34, 40, 45, 57, 66, 72, 89, 103
Outside top 103 - 3 picks: 138, 184, 226
Added 2024 picks: KC's 2nd rounder

If you think this draft is meaty in the 2nd and 3rd as many do then that's a lot of dart throws.

Imagine this board after trading down lol… but I think it could be the best path forward. Focus all of it on the offense and you might have a good nucleus.

 

[vicspats]

Daniels runs too much, while exciting to watch, can be stopped in the nfl, so I Maye have to go with drake

I agree. But I think it’s more of the threat to run vs taking a sack that will make the difference

 

[PancakeBlockPaul]

No option for Hoyer??!?! jkjk...

I'd go with either tbh. Can only go up from here.

 

[upstater1]

Belichick stays, it’s a trade back (twice) and take a safety with the 25th pick

Except for the 5 times he's had a pick in the top half of the draft, right? He just sat there and took his guy. Only failed once: Mac Jones.

 

[JohnJH]

Daniels is a good player. Watched some of him last night and he's also a tall guy, which I didn't realize just by watching game footage.

My only concern with Daniels is that he's listed at 6'4" and 205-210. He really needs to get up to 215 bare minimum, and preferably 220-225 (without loosing his speed and quickness). Otherwise, he looks like, with the right coaching and talent around him, that he could be a true steal.

 

[JohnJH]

It’s tough looking at highlight reels of these guys because first of all, by their nature it’s their best plays, and even Zack Wilson won AFC offensive player of the week once this year. And secondly, a lot of the conditions aren’t translatable to the NFL — wide open receivers, completely clean pockets, first reads always open. Sometimes I like looking at lowlights reels, actually, because it tells me what happens when things hit the fan.

Haven’t done enough of that with these guys yet. I did see some plays made by Maye in one highlight reel which were NFL conditions so that was nice to see, but I need to do some more watching.

I know that Maye has had great stats with a mostly horrible O-Line and not so great weapons. I do love his legit potential.

 

[JohnJH]

I am more interested in Daniels than Maye, but that's only because I have seen Daniels play and have not seen Maye. Williams, meh. I don't love the hype machine, and him breaking down in his mother's arms, while endearing if I wanted a nice kid to be my future son-in-law, doesn't make me think he's emotionally mature enough to lead an NFL franchise day one.

I have watched more Ewers and McCarthy than any of them.

McCarthy (if he comes out), would have the makings of a nice consolation prize that could turn out to be something special with the right coaching and decent talent around him. The dude has skills.

 

[JohnJH]

BB wants players who are passionate about football.

Does Williams seem passionate about football, or is he more focused on what football success will bring him?

This question applies to the other QB candidates as well.

Which ones of them are passionate about football?

Williams and Penix Jr. I would avoid. Williams concerns me and Penix Jr. makes Jimmy G. look like the definition of durable.

 

[upstater1]

If we have a chance to take Caleb and we pass over him, it will be the single worst decision the franchise has ever made.

I see a guy with unreal arm talent. A guy who has great awareness in the pocket. He just moves around it beautifully and he finds it very easy to get reset as he's moving. These are huge intangibles.

He has a very short compact throwing motion that allows him to have a very quick release.

Of the 3 QBs we're comparing, he's the only one who is processing in these videos. You see him move through his progressions quickly. He surveys the entire field. Maye and Daniels, on the other hand, are locked in.

I would trade up to get him if Chicago is antsy at all.

I think the Patriots finish 4-13 which gets them to the 2nd pick. I am not convinced that Chicago is going to take a QB but it would be a big mistake for them not to take Caleb. If they're not sure, give them a sweetener and move up, because I'm sure they'll want Harrison.

 

[JohnJH]

A lot to love about both of them. I’m not big into college football so would love to hear more from posters like Bacon who follow college more. From the limited amount I’ve seen:

Williams - great athlete, strong arm and accurate, maybe the best thrower on the run I’ve seen. But, he’s 6’0 and runs around a lot waiting to make the big play. That’s not gonna work very often in the NFL. Can he operate in the pocket and pick his spots to run around? Is his height an issue? Is he a leader and emotionally ready to carry a franchise?

Maye - Josh Allen meets Justin Herbert. Big guy, big arm, big plays. Can also run. The potential with Maye is huge. Upside is that within a few years he’s among the best QBs in the league. Could he be a project like Allen was when he came in? Do we have the right guy to coach him like Allen did with Dabol?

While nothing is guaranteed, you gotta swing to get a hit. Both these guys have a ton of potential and I’m good with taking the shot.

I suspect that Maye is going to be a much more polished QB in killing defenses with his arm and just using his mobility to by time to throw and not try to always run over front 7 defensive players (which will come back to bite Allen in the butt someday, which I'm surprised that it hasn't yet).

 

[JohnJH]

Can't speak for Penix, but I've watched a ton of Daniels. One of the most impressive passing abilities is his ability to throw into tight windows at the sideline and in the back of the end zone against tight coverage. He drops dimes just out of reach of the defenders. Mac (at Bama) was just throwing the ball deep and his receivers just outran the coverage. Also, his scrambling ability scares the crap out of college defenses. When he's rolling out, it's difficult for defenders to commit to cover the receiver or stop Daniels. These types of plays are really a result of Daniels' skill.

I think Nabers will be a good WR in the NFL. He's strong, wins his share of 50-50 balls, and is difficult to bring down after the catch. He doesn't play like a speedster though. Thomas Jr's success may be more due to Daniels and Nabors. He's tall and fast, and caught a lot of touchdowns this year, however, this is the first year he's really been noticed on the depth chart for LSU. IMHO opinion, if we're looking at a receiver in the 2nd round and Brian Thomas Jr, and Xavier Legette are both available, I'd take Legette. Again...just an opinion.

By the way, as an LSU fan, it sucks to think I won't see another game with Daniels at QB for the Tigers again. The guy is just FUN TO WATCH! Just like Burrow was.

Leggette could be, best case scenario, a 6'3 227 pound A.J. Brown who is said to run a blazing 4.30 40.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Kraft (Bob or Jon) or both are choosing ....

 

[upstater1]

If your GM expresses interest in Caleb, expect pain in the future. The kid is not NFL quality mentally. For QBs, that is the BIGGEST question. In the NFL, it's all studying. It's all anticipation. In short, it's all between the ears. And Williams has an echo chamber in there.

EDIT: Kyler Murray is a perfect example. If you are even hinting/considering that STUDYING THE PLAYBOOK should be a stipulation of a new contract, you made a mistake. And you're about to make another one signing him to another contract.

I see it as the opposite of what you wrote. the only one of the 3 who scans the field and goes through his progressions. When he had Addison, he looked way better than the other 3 (Maye had Downs).