David Andrews gets it

[upstater1]

Thornton posted an article ripping on Josh McD. I know it's not about BB specifically but here's a couple of quotes Jerry highlight that grabbed my attention:

"Can Josh design a good play? Sure. Can he make his players care about running that play? He cannot. …

If you don’t have the respect of your team, it doesn’t matter how clever you are on the ****ing whiteboard. Coaching is about connecting with other humans. It's about paying attention to what they are going through and responding to it. It's about listening to what they tell you. It's about putting them in positions to succeed, challenging them to be their best, and respecting the effort they give you. Honoring their sacrifice. Believing in them. Showing them that you love them, not just as players, but as people. …"

And

"Bill Belichick knock-offs, like putting slogans and mantras in big block letters around the building, then calling guys out in meetings, making them stand up to recite them, and cussing out those who couldn’t."

Here's a link to the whole piece if you're interested:

Josh McDaniels Gets Nuked From Orbit by a Former Broncos Player Who Accuses Him of Dumping Peyton Hillis Because His Wife Had a Crush on Him

Read more about Josh McDaniels Gets Nuked From Orbit by a Former Broncos Player Who Accuses Him of Dumping Peyton Hillis Because His Wife Had a Crush on Him on https://www.barstoolsports.com/

www.barstoolsports.com

A lot of these players find it easy going during the regular season.

But in the crucible of the playoffs, how will they react?

It's a big thing. The players who have been tempered under pressure all year should react better to those tight moments. I don't think coaches are doing players any favors by coddling them.

But the incentives for coddling are too great. If they help a coach win more games, the coaches have to do it. Even if it means they don't have the kind of team culture that can win a championship.

I take it Harbaugh is a hardass, but his team repeatedly finishes short after good regular seasons. From the QB on down. It just makes me wonder why they have a difficult time in crucial situations.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Again is it agenda or is it intellect? The world may never know.

Your legacy as forum idiot is secure for eternity.

 

[upstater1]

Looking back at the Grier draft, they are not that bad.

4 drafts:

Terry Glenn, Tedy Bruschi, Lawyer Milloy, Brandon Mitchell, Tebucky Jones, Greg Spires, Andy Katzenmoyer, Damien Woody, Kevin Faulk, Sean Morey.

Not great, but not horrible either.

 

[Ring 6]

Your legacy as forum idiot is secure for eternity.

Maybe it’s both agenda and intellect.

 

[VJCPatriot]

You don't understand.

performance doesn't matter.

What counts is attitude on a 2-8 team.

He has been late. So, he'll be cut and contribute elsewhere next year. jack Jones also. It is a matter of priorities. It is NOT putting the best team on the field each week. Rather it is putting the team that most respects Belichick and his rules. Ask Bourne, or a dozen others.

Who needs talent on the field? Obviously what matters most is "sending a message"!

It doesn't matter if Malcolm Butler was benched for an entire Superbowl in a game we were losing and could have won if we could just stop the bleeding with say a cornerback making a play on 3rd down...

No what's important is that BB could feel smug and satisfied that he properly disciplined Butler!

Does this just about sum it up?

The real problem is that BB's hardnosed "I'll sit you if you cross me" method of doing business might be well and fine if you have another player waiting in the wings who can step in and do just about the same job.

But this doesn't work when there's no equivalent backup talent. The cupboards are BARE in New England now.

The "just do your job" system doesn't work anymore when you don't have a gamechanger at QB to hide your team's warts and deficiencies.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Looking back at the Grier draft, they are not that bad.

4 drafts:

Terry Glenn, Tedy Bruschi, Lawyer Milloy, Brandon Mitchell, Tebucky Jones, Greg Spires, Andy Katzenmoyer, Damien Woody, Kevin Faulk, Sean Morey.

Not great, but not horrible either.

I miss the old days of Scott Pioli. He was director of Player Personnel from 2001 to 2008.

2001 Richard Seymour, Matt Light
2002 Daniel Graham, Deion Branch
2003 Ty Warren, Eugene Wilson
2004 Vince Wilfork, Ben Watson
2005 Logan Mankins, Ellis Hobbs
2006 Laurence Maroney, Chad Jackson
2007 Brandon Meriweather
2008 Patrick Chung, Sebastian Vollmer

2006 and 2007 were probably his weakest drafts but in all the other drafts we either got solid players or even a stud each year.

Considering how badly the Patriots have drafted in the last decade one could argue that Pioli and Brady together were more responsible for the Patriots success in the first 10 years of the dynasty than Belichick.

 

[upstater1]

I miss the old days of Scott Pioli. He was director of Player Personnel from 2001 to 2008.

2001 Richard Seymour, Matt Light
2002 Daniel Graham, Deion Branch
2003 Ty Warren, Eugene Wilson
2004 Vince Wilfork, Ben Watson
2005 Logan Mankins, Ellis Hobbs
2006 Laurence Maroney, Chad Jackson
2007 Brandon Meriweather
2008 Patrick Chung, Sebastian Vollmer

2006 and 2007 were probably his weakest drafts but in all the other drafts we either got solid players or even a stud each year.

Considering how badly the Patriots have drafted in the last decade one could argue that Pioli and Brady together were more responsible for the Patriots success in the first 10 years of the dynasty than Belichick.

The early drafts though we had much higher picks than in the middle of the dynasty. Seymour, Warren, were high draft picks

 

[archstanton543]

The early drafts though we had much higher picks than in the middle of the dynasty. Seymour, Warren, were high draft picks

It's not where you pick, it's who you pick.

 

[TinhWoodhead]

Wouldn’t traveling to Germany be a “mental reset”??

 

[archstanton543]

Wouldn’t traveling to Germany be a “mental reset”??

You'd figure. But his infraction was being late to the team hotel in America. Lord knows what he'd do in Germany with the time change. You'd have to assign someone to babysit him.

 

[upstater1]

It's not where you pick, it's who you pick.

???

If it's not WHERE you pick, then explain the great hit rate on earlier picks.

Not only for the Patriots, but the entire league.

Seymour, Warren, Wilfork, Mayo, Solder, Chandler Jones, Gonzalez. Of all the guys going 21 or above, Maroney was the only bust. Now Mac Jones joins the bust list, but it wasn't a bad pick when it was made. Not like Maroney.

If you're picking in the upper half of the 1st rd, you have a much better chance of finding a good player than the 2nd half where the players are more interchangeable with 2nd rders. Just like Keion White this year, there's little appreciable difference between him and the players who went in the 2nd half of the 1st rd.

I bet you Belichick's record in the upper half of the 1st is better than the vast majority of teams drafting up there.

 

[archstanton543]

???

If it's not WHERE you pick, then explain the great hit rate on earlier picks.

Not only for the Patriots, but the entire league.

Seymour, Warren, Wilfork, Mayo, Solder, Chandler Jones, Gonzalez. Of all the guys going 21 or above, Maroney was the only bust. Now Mac Jones joins the bust list, but it wasn't a bad pick when it was made. Not like Maroney.

If you're picking in the upper half of the 1st rd, you have a much better chance of finding a good player than the 2nd half where the players are more interchangeable with 2nd rders. Just like Keion White this year, there's little appreciable difference between him and the players who went in the 2nd half of the 1st rd.

I bet you Belichick's record in the upper half of the 1st is better than the vast majority of teams drafting up there.

All those guys you listed were drafted ages ago except for Gonzo. BB likes to trade down for vue and then takes guys like Strange (not a terrible player...but not great either).

 

[upstater1]

All those guys you listed were drafted ages ago except for Gonzo. BB likes to trade down for vue and then takes guys like Strange (not a terrible player...but not great either).

I'm not sure why this is so difficult to understand. I wrote that the early drafts had much higher picks. Yes, everyone knows we haven't been drafting in the top 10 for well over a decade now.

All I said is that when we draft high, we do well. This year we'll be drafting high.

And, I note that we rarely trade down when we draft high. Not for Seymour, Warren, Mayo or Jones. We did a little bit for Gonzalez because we risked ending up with Forbes (who, by the way, looks like a stud CB). In fact, we actually traded UP for Chandler Jones.

 

[JayNM]

Regardless, finally a Andrews thread

I do not worry about being hater #1 of Andrews. Lucky for him, Im a very lenient critic

he is a good player. Great, amazing intangibles, decent if not unespectular athetlic capacities, albeit a bit small at their size. Problem is, athletic ability counts for A LOT in today's NFL. And there, another word for those attributes: Mediocre.

Then he is made captain... I don't mind it. like I said, those intangible are hard to come by. It deserves rewarding. But it also says that mediocre athletic abilities are not as looked favorably. The Oline gets the mentality, but the rest of the team? You think WRs understand this message?

I don't think so. then there is everything else.

Also, and TOTALLY UNRELATED to anything he proposed to his gj in the Gillettes stadium field. That's corny and Im not jealous

 

[archstanton543]

I'm not sure why this is so difficult to understand. I wrote that the early drafts had much higher picks. Yes, everyone knows we haven't been drafting in the top 10 for well over a decade now.

All I said is that when we draft high, we do well. This year we'll be drafting high.

And, I note that we rarely trade down when we draft high. Not for Seymour, Warren, Mayo or Jones. We did a little bit for Gonzalez because we risked ending up with Forbes (who, by the way, looks like a stud CB). In fact, we actually traded UP for Chandler Jones.

If they have so much success higher up in the draft why keep trading down? Especially with the dearth of high level talent on the team at virtually every spot on it. Other teams trade up. The Pats are content to sit back or drop back and see what shakes out.

 

[Toofy]

Enough of this crap. We have not drafted well and our draft position is not to blame. Chiefs have drafted Kelce, hill, creed Humphrey with lower round picks.

Name even 1 pick in last 6 years who is close to one of those 3.

 

[upstater1]

If they have so much success higher up in the draft why keep trading down? Especially with the dearth of high level talent on the team at virtually every spot on it. Other teams trade up. The Pats are content to sit back or drop back and see what shakes out.

We don't trade down when we draft high. You responded to my post by claiming I wrote the opposite of what I wrote.

 

[1960Pats]

We had this experience before when the Patriots rejoiced in having a kinder coach when moving from Parcells to Carrol. Let's see if this can produce a playoff contender here. Hasn't really yet but we all live in a fantasy world now, so let's go for it.

Pete Carrol was more successful here than Tuna and he wasn't negotiating with one of our division rivals while coaching the Pats. He also didn't steal one of our best players. Give me Pete any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

 

[1960Pats]

Enough of this crap. We have not drafted well and our draft position is not to blame. Chiefs have drafted Kelce, hill, creed Humphrey with lower round picks.

Name even 1 pick in last 6 years who is close to one of those 3.

They seem to have really improved their DBs.

 

[1960Pats]

We don't trade down when we draft high. You responded to my post by claiming I wrote the opposite of what I wrote.

Didn't they drop down in the last draft? I remember Pats fans discussing how Bill got back at the Jets by trading back with Pitt, who wanted the same player as the Jets.

I always like more draft picks because it's a crap shoot and more picks gives you more chances, but when the Pats move back it can also allow rival teams to get players they wouldn't normally have a chance at getting.