Mac Jones - Thats my QB poll

[Ian]

I’m on that train until he’s not the guy, then I’ll be rooting for the next guy. I care about wins and losses and if he can get back to where he was in 2021 with this defense, I like their chances. If not, Zappe’s under contract for multiple seasons and we’ll see how that goes or they’ll draft another guy. “It is what it is.”

 

[n1997y]

I think the question is if our QB makes our offense suck will we still cheer for that to be the QB my answer is no.

Except no one is saying that. There are some rooting for Jones to fail, simply because being right is more important to them that the team’s success does. Other than that most here, myself included, are rooting for any QB on the field to succeed.

Anyone who is on Team This QB (whoever that might be) instead of being on Team Patriots is saying that they want This QB to play even if Some Other QB plays better and is better for the team.

To me that’s also the real problem polling the locker room, because it divides the players and undermines the T E A M by placing loyalty to their chosen QB foremost, when loyalty to the TEAM should be primary.

 

[Ian]

Anyone who is on Team This QB (whoever that might be) instead of being on Team Patriots is saying that they want This QB to play even if Some Other QB plays better and is better for the team.

You sort of have to be on team “this QB” (if it’s the current starter) because in theory, that’s who the coach put in charge of the team in terms of leading the offense.

So you root for that person to help the team win until the coach - ie: Belichick - decides he’s not the guy. I do agree with what you’re saying, the coach should be starting the guy he believes gives the club the best chance to win, so that’s why you’d root for that person, until obviously, he’s replaced.

 

[Sect140]

I’m on team Patriot. If Bill chooses Mac I‘m rooting for Mac if he chooses Zappe or someone else I will root for that QB.
Believe it or not this forum will not have a say in who the starting QB is.

 

[Ian]

there ya go... a little Van Hagar to explain where i am


as for mac, until we get someone better, im in
.as for

Great album.

 

[Triumph]

Right on the money. Triumph has replaced DropKickFlutie as the primary forum troll, starting threads on Mac Jones weekly to beat the drum on his agenda. It’s annoying and obnoxious, but I guess he can’t help himself from being that way.

Igor

You'll always be Igor to me.

 

[Tunescribe]

Igor

You'll always be Igor to me.

You better do your chores, the sun will be down before you know it.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I think Mac has a consuming drive. I agree with the rest but think Mac will only get part way there this year. I think he will get there, but he is still developing, physically and skills wise, that it is going to take a few years. That is not to say he shouldn't take a huge leap this year.

I think Belichick’s decision to go with Patricia and Judge last season makes it almost impossible to gauge Jones play last season, but I was really concerned with one aspect of his play, and I felt like it was an area he could have improved on from his rookie year, that was his inability to extend plays. As soon as the pocket started to break down Jones was falling apart. His decision making was slow, and the play was blown up. If he doesn’t show a dramatic improvement in this area this season then it’s hard to see how he gets to the next level as a QB, let alone the levels above that.

 

[Ross12]

I think Belichick’s decision to go with Patricia and Judge last season makes it almost impossible to gauge Jones play last season, but I was really concerned with one aspect of his play, and I felt like it was an area he could have improved on from his rookie year, that was his inability to extend plays. As soon as the pocket started to break down Jones was falling apart. His decision making was slow, and the play was blown up. If he doesn’t show a dramatic improvement in this area this season then it’s hard to see how he gets to the next level as a QB, let alone the levels above that.

This is the single biggest thing that stood out between Zappe and Mac to me. When the pocket tightened, Mac went down or otherwise got erratic; Zappe just slid in the pocket wherever he needed to go and kept his eyes downfield going through his progressions. If Mac can learn to play in the pocket like Zappe then he'll be in a much better spot.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Mac is on a one year tryout. If he doesn’t play well or worse, gets beat out by Zappe, he will miss out on a projected $30M 5th year option Bill has to decide to pick up after this upcoming season.

 

[Huckleberry1]

This is the single biggest thing that stood out between Zappe and Mac to me. When the pocket tightened, Mac went down or otherwise got erratic; Zappe just slid in the pocket wherever he needed to go and kept his eyes downfield going through his progressions. If Mac can learn to play in the pocket like Zappe then he'll be in a much better spot.

I thought Zappe handled the pressure he saw better as well, but he was also running a simpler offense. I think Belichick is going to go into the off-season camps with both QB’s on even footing, but with the expectations even as well, so both will be expected to run the full offense as it’s installed. May the better player win.

 

[NormZauchin]

I was on team N'Keal Harry, but that didn't work out.

 

[Ian]

This is the single biggest thing that stood out between Zappe and Mac to me. When the pocket tightened, Mac went down or otherwise got erratic; Zappe just slid in the pocket wherever he needed to go and kept his eyes downfield going through his progressions. If Mac can learn to play in the pocket like Zappe then he'll be in a much better spot.

It's funny, Mac was good at that his rookie year. He hung in, looked downfield, and stood in until the last minute on a bunch of plays early on and wasn't afraid of taking a shot. Something changed along the way, and he seemed far more hesitant at the end of the season and was obviously also like that throughout most of this past year, especially after week one when he hurt his back at the end.

I 100% agree with you, though, Zappe was pretty fearless, and he was definitely better about sliding up. Mac moves well laterally, but he's not big on climbing the pocket. He tends to sit at the back of the pocket and doesn't really slide up, or at least not as well as Zappe does.

I recall us having similar conversations between Drew and Brady, as Brady was also better in that regard but also got the ball out of his hands faster than Drew did. We've talked about arm strength with Mac and even though his arm is a little stronger than Zappe's, the Bledsoe/Brady comparison sort of proves that part doesn't necessarily mean much.

Honestly, the only thing Zappe needs to do is get a little stronger, which I'm sure is a jump he's going to make this offseason the same way Mac did. He also does need to work on his arm angle, as well as continue getting better at diagnosing defenses as well as Mac. If he does those things, and gets to a point where he doesn't need to stride as much to throw, it's going to close the gap between the two and make the situation interesting, depending on how this year plays out.

Mac needs to separate himself a little more and show a lot more of the touch and accuracy he had in his rookie year. Really hoping to see him thrive under O'Brien, so fingers crossed there. But I am looking forward to seeing Zappe's growth. Again, always a good problem to have when you have two solid young guys who can play.

 

[Love The Drake]

It's funny, Mac was good at that his rookie year. He hung in, looked downfield, and stood in until the last minute on a bunch of plays early on and wasn't afraid of taking a shot. Something changed along the way, and he seemed far more hesitant at the end of the season and was obviously also like that throughout most of this past year, especially after week one when he hurt his back at the end.

I 100% agree with you, though, Zappe was pretty fearless, and he was definitely better about sliding up. Mac moves well laterally, but he's not big on climbing the pocket. He tends to sit at the back of the pocket and doesn't really slide up, or at least not as well as Zappe does.

I recall us having similar conversations between Drew and Brady, as Brady was also better in that regard but also got the ball out of his hands faster than Drew did. We've talked about arm strength with Mac and even though his arm is a little stronger than Zappe's, the Bledsoe/Brady comparison sort of proves that part doesn't necessarily mean much.

Honestly, the only thing Zappe needs to do is get a little stronger, which I'm sure is a jump he's going to make this offseason the same way Mac did. He also does need to work on his arm angle, as well as continue getting better at diagnosing defenses as well as Mac. If he does those things, and gets to a point where he doesn't need to stride as much to throw, it's going to close the gap between the two and make the situation interesting, depending on how this year plays out.

Mac needs to separate himself a little more and show a lot more of the touch and accuracy he had in his rookie year. Really hoping to see him thrive under O'Brien, so fingers crossed there. But I am looking forward to seeing Zappe's growth. Again, always a good problem to have when you have two solid young guys who can play.

How do you feel about Drafting a rookie QB in the first 3 rounds?

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Except no one is saying that. There are some rooting for Jones to fail, simply because being right is more important to them that the team’s success does. Other than that most here, myself included, are rooting for any QB on the field to succeed.

As far as Jones goes there is legitimate cause for concern, and there are some reasons to believe in him, but most here believe that he isn’t above having to win the competition for the QB position to start for them next season. And while that may piss Jones off he was perfectly fine with taking the job from Cam Newton when he beat him out to become the starter, so he has no legitimate *****. Belichick was right to put Jones on notice that he will have to win the job, and he would have been wrong to tell the media that it’s Jones job, and then making Zappe the starter after the competition.

I'm of course looking forward to the end of this subject and getting on with the business of football.

Jones never should have seen the field after getting injured. Zappe would have gained important, valuable experience, the team would have at least made the playoffs and we'd have something to build on.

Patricia is no worse than the vast majority of OC's in the league. Judge may not be great but he's not going to sabotage a Super Bowl run all by himself.

 

[Tunescribe]

This is the single biggest thing that stood out between Zappe and Mac to me. When the pocket tightened, Mac went down or otherwise got erratic; Zappe just slid in the pocket wherever he needed to go and kept his eyes downfield going through his progressions. If Mac can learn to play in the pocket like Zappe then he'll be in a much better spot.

Ross, this is getting embarrassing. That simply was not the case. You can't objectively draw such a conclusion from the widely disparate sampling of their respective circumstances and playing time last season. Zappe was very tightly scripted throwing primarily to open first reads vs. soft bottom-of-the-league zone defenses (Detroit, Cleveland) with a relatively intact OL handling minimal pressure. I like what Zappe did for sure, but some of that was fool's gold. If you think he could have "just slid in the pocket wherever he needed to go and kept his eyes downfield going through his progressions" against tight coverage and a potent front seven like the Jete and others Mac faced, you're dreaming. He likely would've turtled and phoned 911.

Mac's pocket presence is just fine given halfway reliable protection plus an in-sync offense where timing actually works and he knows where people will be. He doesn't need to "learn to play in the pocket like Zappe." I could go on about this but am tired of the revisionist history and selective recency bias from Zappe bandwagoners who disregard things like what Mac showed in 2021, his (not minor) injury and the burden of compensating for offensive dysfunction under Patricia/Judge. Run this mistaken conclusion of yours by someone else if you feel like doubling down on it.

Come training camp we'll see if Bailey has what it takes to push for the starting nod; if he does, I'll be surprised but not at all disappointed. Until then I hope you'll do a better job of owning your preference than what you shared last time.

 

[Ian]

How do you feel about Drafting a rookie QB in the first 3 rounds?

I don't know ... that's a risk. They need talent on both sides of the ball and guys who can hopefully contribute this year, especially along the offensive line and/or at receiver. I could see them taking a developmental pick at QB in rounds 4-7, but I feel like offensive tackle is a big need and it does start to feel like they could finally follow the lead of other teams and grab an impact WR to help whoever is ultimately under center. That's not something they normally do, but it is starting to feel like that's potentially how it could play out. It also wouldn't stun me if they try and add someone next to Barmore and build a formidable duo inside.

But, I think this is Mac's make-or-break year and that they'll be comfortable with turning to Zappe if Mac isn't going to be their guy. However, I just can't see them muddying the water and not improving depth where they need it in the early rounds, especially this year.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

It's funny, Mac was good at that his rookie year. He hung in, looked downfield, and stood in until the last minute on a bunch of plays early on and wasn't afraid of taking a shot. Something changed along the way, and he seemed far more hesitant at the end of the season and was obviously also like that throughout most of this past year, especially after week one when he hurt his back at the end.

I 100% agree with you, though, Zappe was pretty fearless, and he was definitely better about sliding up. Mac moves well laterally, but he's not big on climbing the pocket. He tends to sit at the back of the pocket and doesn't really slide up, or at least not as well as Zappe does.

I recall us having similar conversations between Drew and Brady, as Brady was also better in that regard but also got the ball out of his hands faster than Drew did. We've talked about arm strength with Mac and even though his arm is a little stronger than Zappe's, the Bledsoe/Brady comparison sort of proves that part doesn't necessarily mean much.

Honestly, the only thing Zappe needs to do is get a little stronger, which I'm sure is a jump he's going to make this offseason the same way Mac did. He also does need to work on his arm angle, as well as continue getting better at diagnosing defenses as well as Mac. If he does those things, and gets to a point where he doesn't need to stride as much to throw, it's going to close the gap between the two and make the situation interesting, depending on how this year plays out.

Mac needs to separate himself a little more and show a lot more of the touch and accuracy he had in his rookie year. Really hoping to see him thrive under O'Brien, so fingers crossed there. But I am looking forward to seeing Zappe's growth. Again, always a good problem to have when you have two solid young guys who can play.

A lot goes into being a successful professional athlete. Much of it is physical, much is attitudinal, much has to do with maturity and growth. The pro game is just different from college. The pressures are physical and psychological. Some people can handle it, some can't. Being a high draft pick with the accompanying expectations is a distraction. For Brady, he didn't have that, but he didn't pay so much attention to keeping a job in the NFL as he did being pissed about being drafted so low and being determined to succeed - not in winning titles, but getting his offense to function effectively to make first downs, keep drives alive and get in scoring position.

 

[Ross12]

It's funny, Mac was good at that his rookie year. He hung in, looked downfield, and stood in until the last minute on a bunch of plays early on and wasn't afraid of taking a shot. Something changed along the way, and he seemed far more hesitant at the end of the season and was obviously also like that throughout most of this past year, especially after week one when he hurt his back at the end.

I 100% agree with you, though, Zappe was pretty fearless, and he was definitely better about sliding up. Mac moves well laterally, but he's not big on climbing the pocket. He tends to sit at the back of the pocket and doesn't really slide up, or at least not as well as Zappe does.

I recall us having similar conversations between Drew and Brady, as Brady was also better in that regard but also got the ball out of his hands faster than Drew did. We've talked about arm strength with Mac and even though his arm is a little stronger than Zappe's, the Bledsoe/Brady comparison sort of proves that part doesn't necessarily mean much.

Honestly, the only thing Zappe needs to do is get a little stronger, which I'm sure is a jump he's going to make this offseason the same way Mac did. He also does need to work on his arm angle, as well as continue getting better at diagnosing defenses as well as Mac. If he does those things, and gets to a point where he doesn't need to stride as much to throw, it's going to close the gap between the two and make the situation interesting, depending on how this year plays out.

Mac needs to separate himself a little more and show a lot more of the touch and accuracy he had in his rookie year. Really hoping to see him thrive under O'Brien, so fingers crossed there. But I am looking forward to seeing Zappe's growth. Again, always a good problem to have when you have two solid young guys who can play.

Well said Ian. I agree with pretty much everything you said. It is curious how Mac was better with pocket presence as a rookie early and then regressed as time went on. His pocket presence was widely considered a strength coming out of college so it’s definitely sort of strange. Maybe he is just not comfortable with getting hit? He’s been relatively sturdy despite the hits so I don’t consider him fragile but wonder if he’s mentally spooked a bit.

I’m definitely looking forward to seeing how things progress - Mac has the tools to be the overall better QB but Zappe can also close that gap entirely if Mac doesn’t take a big step forward. I’d also consider drafting a QB like Jake Haener in the 4th or later to add to the competition. I like his skillset even if he’s small and he’s a high character guy.

 

[Ross12]

Ross, this is getting embarrassing. That simply was not the case. You can't objectively draw such a conclusion from the widely disparate sampling of their respective circumstances and playing time last season. Zappe was very tightly scripted throwing primarily to open first reads vs. soft bottom-of-the-league zone defenses (Detroit, Cleveland) with a relatively intact OL handling minimal pressure. I like what Zappe did for sure, but some of that was fool's gold. If you think he could have "just slid in the pocket wherever he needed to go and kept his eyes downfield going through his progressions" against tight coverage and a potent front seven like the Jete and others Mac faced, you're dreaming. He likely would've turtled and phoned 911.

Mac's pocket presence is just fine given halfway reliable protection plus an in-sync offense where timing actually works and he knows where people will be. He doesn't need to "learn to play in the pocket like Zappe." I could go on about this but am tired of the revisionist history and selective recency bias from Zappe bandwagoners who disregard things like what Mac showed in 2021, his (not minor) injury and the burden of compensating for offensive dysfunction under Patricia/Judge. Run this mistaken conclusion of yours by someone else if you feel like doubling down on it.

Come training camp we'll see if Bailey has what it takes to push for the starting nod; if he does, I'll be surprised but not at all disappointed. Until then I hope you'll do a better job of owning your preference than what you shared last time.

Sorry I disappointed you…? Not sure what I said that was so hurtful. Several people including Ian have agreed with it already but I will try better next time I guess.