By the numbers: Patricia's offense downright offensive

[captain stone]

Really starting to wonder if Bourne is still on the team by the end of the year.

He absolutely will NOT be on the team next year; of that we are certain.

 

[ashley]

He absolutely will NOT be on the team next year; of that we are certain.

He has one more year left on his contract, do you think we are cutting him at a reasonable price?

 

[crawhammer]

Strange69 is healthy, but in No way, shape or form was he worth THE ****ING 29TH ****ING OVERALL ****ING PICK IN THE ENTIRE ****ING DRAFT...

People got on my case for grading him out around a C earlier in the season. Still seems accurate. But no, he's definitely not grading out as a 1st round talent. The 2nd round pick is contributing nothing. If not for Jones, and most specifically Marcus, this draft class would look rather unimpressive. The two RBs sandwiched around Zappe, completely useless.

 

[RobertWeathers]

It's funny because I was reading a transcript from Bourne and he basically blamed the O-line...interesting to see what happens going forward.

The days of players keeping their issues and concerns in house are over.

Times are changing.

 

[crawhammer]

He has one more year left on his contract, do you think we are cutting him at a reasonable price?

What a complete waste. I liked Bourne last season. And I've been advocating for him this entire season. He's got talent, that's not the issue, and it's still not clear to me what the issue is exactly, but I don't believe it's an on-field problem. The coaching staff soured on Bourne, for his attitude or outspokenness, and basically cast him aside. To the detriment of the team in my opinion.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

The days of players keeping their issues and concerns in house are over.

Times are changing.

if works when you are winning…

 

[TheRainMaker]

He has one more year left on his contract, do you think we are cutting him at a reasonable price?

The cap savings is $5.5M by releasing him. Dead money is only $1.4M.

Keeping a player that doesn't want to be in NE is not "doing what's best for the team".

 

[ashley]

What a complete waste. I liked Bourne last season. And I've been advocating for him this entire season. He's got talent, that's not the issue, and it's still not clear to me what the issue is exactly, but I don't believe it's an on-field problem. The coaching staff soured on Bourne, for his attitude or outspokenness, and basically cast him aside. To the detriment of the team in my opinion.

We kind of need him though. He is on a cheap contract, we know Agholor is gone, we're not sure about Meyers, that leaves us with Tyquan, Davante, Bourne and if we don't resign Meyers, we'll have to get another wr and this is a weak free agent class and if we're drafting, we're going to have to use a high pick/picks on OT..... I know Steuber should be healthy next year, they are high on Hines but other than Cajuste and possibly Brown, we have nothing else at the position.

 

[venecol]

Geno Smith: OC: Shane Waldrom a guy who has coached offenses for 15 years. WR: Metcalf and Lockett.

Tua: OC: Frank Smith who has a decade of offensive experience on top of an offensively minded HC. WR: Hill and Waddle.

Mac: OC Matt Patricia a guy who has been an offensive coach for like 2 years over 15 years ago, mostly has been on defense and is very suspect. WR: Meyers and.... Bourne/Agholor/Parker. Either way the best of those wouldn't have a spot on those other teams.

Hmmmmm

Correct, but who selected those players? Who decided to have Patricia & Judge coach the offense?

Bill is getting a huge pass here. Everything that's happened this season, from the lack of OL/RB depth, poor FA signings, poor drafts, to the coaches selected is 100% on Bill. I'm not sure if it's just arrogance from his part or that the game has passed him by, but he's managed to undo any progress made in the last 3 seasons, screwing up a 1st Rd QB, and possibly losing the locker room. What a disaster.

If this was happening with any other team, we would honestly be making fun of that team. It's almost Jete-like. There's a reason there's so few coaches that make it after 70+, none of them successfully.

 

[Rob0729]

Somehow the zappe crowd believes that Mac is holding back Patricias brilliance. Despite so much evidence to the contrary.

I have yet to see evidence that this offense is amazing and just Mac is holding it back. Maybe Zappe is better. But the offenses problems are systemic and largely due to poor coaching.

When the receiver says they don't know what the opposing defense tendencies are that is bad. They are just calling random plays

Didn't Thanksgiving show that Patricia can coach fairly well against bad defenses? Maybe that is why Patricia looked so good with Zappe under center. Besides, against the Lions, Zappe was more of a passenger on the offense and it was Harris and Stevenson who did all the heavy lifting.

 

[TheRainMaker]

We kind of need him though. He is on a cheap contract, we know Agholor is gone, we're not sure about Meyers, that leaves us with Tyquan, Davante, Bourne and if we don't resign Meyers, we'll have to get another wr and this is a weak free agent class and if we're drafting, we're going to have to use a high pick/picks on OT..... I know Steuber should be healthy next year, they are high on Hines but other than Cajuste and possibly Brown, we have nothing else at the position.

Parker was a low risk trade and is a decent player, but I could see him gone too as I don't think he fits in with the offense/Mac. His cap savings is $6.3M.

 

[Rob0729]

Correct, but who selected those players? Who decided to have Patricia & Judge coach the offense?

Bill is getting a huge pass here. Everything that's happened this season, from the lack of OL/RB depth, poor FA signings, poor drafts, to the coaches selected is 100% on Bill. I'm not sure if it's just arrogance from his part or that the game has passed him by, but he's managed to undo any progress made in the last 3 seasons, screwing up a 1st Rd QB, and possibly losing the locker room. What a disaster.

If this was happening with any other team, we would honestly be making fun of that team. It's almost Jete-like. There's a reason there's so few coaches that make it after 70+, none of them successfully.

This is easily Belichick's worst year as a coach. Probably not a GM though (I put coaching personnel decisions solely on his head coaching hat). Although he made some bad personnel decisions.

Belichick is making decisions that he would never make 10-20 years ago. No way would he have had Patricia or Judge running the offense during the Dynasty years or have Patricia do double duties with the play calling and coaching the o-line. Even when he put the offense in the hands of an inexperienced McDaniels, they had a lot of good offensive coaching talent around him to help out.

I have questioned Belichick's general manager side many times over the years. This is the first time I really question how is running the coaching side of things. He is certainly not getting a free pass from me. My criticism of Patricia extends to Belichick.

 

[lancerman]

Correct, but who selected those players? Who decided to have Patricia & Judge coach the offense?

Bill is getting a huge pass here. Everything that's happened this season, from the lack of OL/RB depth, poor FA signings, poor drafts, to the coaches selected is 100% on Bill. I'm not sure if it's just arrogance from his part or that the game has passed him by, but he's managed to undo any progress made in the last 3 seasons, screwing up a 1st Rd QB, and possibly losing the locker room. What a disaster.

If this was happening with any other team, we would honestly be making fun of that team. It's almost Jete-like. There's a reason there's so few coaches that make it after 70+, none of them successfully.

I agree. Bill is getting a giant pass because everyone knows he's a good coach but he is making dumb personnel decisions and worse staff decisions and nobody is willing to risk him to fix it.

 

[RobertWeathers]

if works when you are winning…

Which we ain't with any consistency.

 

[ashley]

Here is the Bourne quote:

 

[venecol]

My memory may need refreshing. I do not recall Matt's defense being remarkable so putting him in charge of the offense was never a great idea.

His defense was known for bend but don't break, limiting TDs in the RZ.

Now that he's on the other side of the ball, he's switched to break but don't bend but still no TDs in the RZ.

It's a brilliant strategy if you really think about it. He's been voted #1 OC by the DCs in the league.

 

[Vindicate]

Sometimes I wonder if the issue with Matt Patricia, and maybe where Bill has made a huge mistake, is the difference between good playcalling and good coaching. I can imagine there are some minds that could do very well just writing up plays and schemes.

However, that doesn't mean they're good coaches. Drawing a gameplan is just one step. Getting players familiar in comfortable is the next. Adjusting plays according to player and peer input is another. Unscripted cadence is another. Motivating team is another.

I've seen folks say Patricia is calling good plays and I haven't seen a lot that I hate (now, I don't have an acute eye that can discern if he's not drawing matchups right or something) but let's be real. The defense seems "happy" - they seem like professionals who know what they're doing and they maintain a strong spirit. The offense looks completely in disarray. Beyond output, there is just a weird, noncohesive spirit about the offense.

Patrici might be good at playcalling but his ability to lead is a huge question mark. And hell, I'd rather have a fair playcaller but great leader. Personally. Young, inexperienced, new teams NEED good leadership. Period.

 

[captain stone]

He has one more year left on his contract, do you think we are cutting him at a reasonable price?

No doubt whatsoever... Lil' Billy doesn't like his kind of player... Heck the dude might not last the rest of this season...

 

[signbabybrady]

Here is the Bourne quote:

 

[captain stone]

The days of players keeping their issues and concerns in house are over.

Times are changing.

It's what happens when players (deservedly) don't respect their coaches.