Pre Game Thread- Pats @ Jets

[jimnance]

How come only one mod and one poster have caught onto @BB8XSBW style of posts?

The signature insults of that poster are pretty funny though.

Not just one. Pretty obvious troll job with his ridiculously over-the -top shtick.
He's too lame to respond to

 

[TomPatriot]

No shocker here. Hoping he plays really well and the line gives him protection.

Something tells me Bill stepped in and put down a couple of coaches. It's the right call.

 

[catent]

Something tells me Bill stepped in and put down a couple of coaches. It's the right call.

Huh? Can you elaborate on this.

What does putting down coaches have to do with the Zappe-Jones situation?

We'll find out if it's the right call.

 

[TomPatriot]

Huh? Can you elaborate on this.

What does putting down coaches have to do with the Zappe-Jones situation?

We'll find out if it's the right call.

Zappe has his supporters. Bill wants Mac. Let‘s just say that’s how I see it, fwiw.

 

[catent]

Zappe has his supporters. Bill wants Mac. Let‘s just say that’s how I see it, fwiw.

If Belichick wants Jones, I can't imagine having sat him like he did against Chicago, or splitting the reps with Zappe last week, or constructing a plan that potentially involved both QBs playing.

Do you think one of Belichick's subordinates has been driving the Zappe bus internally and pushed for him to play against Chicago like he did, and Belichick was just along for the ride, only to put folks in their place today?

I haven't seen any evidence of anything like this (unless you buy Volin's report).

 

[RIpats88]

If Belichick wanted Jones, I can't imagine having sat him like he did against Chicago, or splitting the reps with Zappe last week, or constructing a plan that potentially involved both QBs playing.

Do you think one of Belichick's subordinates has been driving the Zappe bus internally and made the decision for him to play against Chicago like he did? I haven't seen any evidence of that, unless you buy Volin's report ... and I shouldn't have to tell you that's not accurate.

If Bill wanted zappe he also wouldn't have Mac take 90% of the reps this week with the starters.

There's a long term look to this. No team gives up on their 1st round QB in their second season. As much as the fans want them to go with zappe.

Hey may see in practice that he feels Mac has higher upside.

 

[Dingleberry]

If Belichick wants Jones, I can't imagine having sat him like he did against Chicago, or splitting the reps with Zappe last week, or constructing a plan that potentially involved both QBs playing.

Do you think one of Belichick's subordinates has been driving the Zappe bus internally and made pushed for him to play against Chicago like he did, and Belichick was just along for the ride, only to put folks in their place today?

I haven't seen any evidence of anything like this (unless you buy Volin's report).

I am thinking Bill is giving Mac his "first round pick" chance.

Mac is off the injury report, so no more excuses. He will play the entire game against the Jets, even if he bombs. The excuse makers will say he was rusty. He will be the starter at home against the Colts. If he still sucks, that might be it. The bye would be the perfect time to go all in with the better performing QB.

Or maybe Bill is 100% bought into Mac. As you stated, his actions cast doubt on that.

 

[catent]

If Bill wanted zappe he also wouldn't have Mac take 90% of the reps this week with the starters.

There's a long term look to this. No team gives up on their 1st round QB in their second season. As much as the fans want them to go with zappe.

Hey may see in practice that he feels Mac has higher upside.

I never said Belichick wants Zappe. I was replying to the claim that Belichick wants Jones.

I'm not sure he really "wants" either one any more than the other.

 

[RIpats88]

I never said Belichick wants Zappe. I was replying to the claim that Belichick wants Jones.

I'm not sure he really "wants" either one any more than the other.

There's also the possibility he feels Mac has more upside. And is using zappe to motivate him to snap out of whatever struggles he is having.

But he clearly has not given up on Mac as many of the "go with zappe" crowd have.

 

[catent]

I am thinking Bill is giving Mac his "first round pick" chance.

Mac is off the injury report, so no more excuses. He will play the entire game against the Jets, even if he bombs. The excuse makers will say he was rusty. He will be the starter at home against the Colts. If he still sucks, that might be it. The bye would be the perfect time to go all in with the better performing QB.

Or maybe Bill is 100% bought into Mac. As you stated, his actions cast doubt on that.

Yeah, that's a good take.

My guess is Belichick feels he was unfair to Jones on MNF and wants to give him a proper opportunity to respond, especially since he's a team captain. He'll get at least a game, perhaps two, without intervention, and then they'll reevaluate. If he doesn't improve, it's likely Zappe time. If he starts to play better (and more importantly, show progress in the areas he has struggled), then he'll probably hold down the job through the end of the season.

I think this decision to start Jones is less about them saying, "Jones is our guy, we're settled on it" (because if that was the case, what happened against Chicago never goes down), and more about them saying "Jones deserves a proper opportunity to respond and we did not give him that on Monday night".

The fact Jones was benched against Chicago - and quickly - should be a pretty good indicator that he isn't viewed as the de facto starter by default moving forward. He'll have to earn it via his play the next couple weeks.

 

[catent]

There's also the possibility he feels Mac has more upside. And is using zappe to motivate him to snap out of whatever struggles he is having.

But he clearly has not given up on Mac as many of the "go with zappe" crowd have.

It has nothing to do with giving up on Jones from my perspective. It comes down to playing the guy who has earned the right to play, and IMO that is Zappe. Just my two cents, though, I'm not saying there aren't other considerations, I definitely am aware of that.

I really doubt Jones has the job by default right now, otherwise he would've played the entire game against Chicago. He's being given the opportunity to respond and elevate his play. They probably feel he deserves more time to respond than the three series he got against Chicago.

 

[jdlboot14]

From Mac's tone and presence at his presser today, it seems he's been given a vote of confidence from BB and coaches.
I wouldn't be surprised if BB had a private sit-down with Mac and "apologized" or at least set the record straight about the "plan" and process to date, and declared him the starter.
And I wouldn't be surprised if that came after 1 - Kraft made it clear to BB about Mac, 2 - team leaders expressed their concerns and vouched for Mac. Having heard from Meyers, Rham, Henry, Onwenu - who all directly conveyed being upset about it - I could see a captains meeting offering warnings about a locker room issue with this ridiculous college-level yo-yo game he's been playing with the QB's.
Go Mac!

 

[TomPatriot]

If Belichick wants Jones, I can't imagine having sat him like he did against Chicago, or splitting the reps with Zappe last week, or constructing a plan that potentially involved both QBs playing.

Do you think one of Belichick's subordinates has been driving the Zappe bus internally and pushed for him to play against Chicago like he did, and Belichick was just along for the ride, only to put folks in their place today?

I haven't seen any evidence of anything like this (unless you buy Volin's report).

He listened to others then. He saw the sh&tshow Monday night. Now he isn’t listening. He’s overruling them. I‘m guessing that Bill is going with Mac and steering the offense toward his strengths. This is a must win game.

I don’t like Patricia and Judge as coaches but I don’t think they are deliberately undermining Mac. I think they want Mac to progress but there’s a disconnect there. Mac has opinions and I suspect there are a lot of egos in the building. It's Bill‘s job to work that out and it seems like he’s trying to do that.

 

[catent]

From Mac's tone and presence at his presser today, it seems he's been given a vote of confidence from BB and coaches.
I wouldn't be surprised if BB had a private sit-down with Mac and "apologized" or at least set the record straight about the "plan" and process to date, and declared him the starter.
And I wouldn't be surprised if that came after 1 - Kraft made it clear to BB about Mac, 2 - team leaders expressed their concerns and vouched for Mac. Having heard from Meyers, Rham, Henry, Onwenu - who all directly conveyed being upset about it - I could see a captains meeting offering warnings about a locker room issue with this ridiculous college-level yo-yo game he's been playing with the QB's.
Go Mac!

If Belichick gave Jones an unconditional vote of confidence, “here’s the keys to car, kid. Your job is safe!” in light of how Jones has performed this season, he isn’t doing his job as a head coach well.

I absolutely believe Jones will get the opportunity to respond over the course of a full, uninterrupted game (or two), and that the team feels they mismanaged MNF and were unfair to Jones. I highly doubt, though, that he is the assured starter for the remainder of the season, regardless of performance.

And fwiw, if Slater’s remarks are any indication, it doesn’t sound like there was nearly the issue in the locker-room as it’s being made out to be.

 

[catent]

He listened to others then. He saw the sh&tshow Monday night. Now he isn’t listening. He’s overruling them. I‘m guessing that Bill is going with Mac and steering the offense toward his strengths. This is a must win game.

I don’t like Patricia and Judge as coaches but I don’t think they are deliberately undermining Mac. I think they want Mac to progress but there’s a disconnect there. Mac has opinions and I suspect there are a lot of egos in the building. It's Bill‘s job to work that out and it seems like he’s trying to do that.

I doubt the plan we saw on Monday night was crafted, implemented, and executed despite Belichick’s hesitation. That was his decision as the head coach, and he’d tell you as much.

For what it’s worth, the offense has been molded to Jones’ preferences since training camp - that wouldn’t be a new development at this point.

 

[PatsFan2]

There's also the possibility he feels Mac has more upside. And is using zappe to motivate him to snap out of whatever struggles he is having.

But he clearly has not given up on Mac as many of the "go with zappe" crowd have.

Now we are imagining how BB feels you would have a better chance getting blood from a stone. Mac and upside in the same sentence... How about Mac having a decent game for once: it's been a while.

 

[1960Pats]

I agree it should be Mac… I am curious what the Jets offense looks like without Breece Hall. Theoretically it should be pretty poor. The Jets defense is pretty decent though, if the Pats struggled against the Bears then this isn’t going to be any easier.

We caught a break with the Hall injury for sure. I started watching the Jets' games and they look pretty good, including former Patriot Braxton Berrios. It's been a very long time since the Jets had a better team than the Pats, but that's where we're at right now.

This game is huge for the Pats. Even this early in the season a loss would probably take them out of the playoff picture.

 

[1960Pats]

Pats have a history of making bum QBs have career nights. Hopefully, Wilson is still too bad to make for a repeat of last night. Fields at least has legs. I've seen Wilson scramble around the backfield but I'm not sure if he has the same mobility going forwards.

Wilson does have a fairly effective method of freezing the rushing defenders and then backing up a bit to get off his passes. He can be a little shifty at times.

As for the Pats history of making bum QBs have career nights, it's too bad that it hasn't worked for their own QBs.

 

[TomPatriot]

I doubt the plan we saw on Monday night was crafted, implemented, and executed despite Belichick’s hesitation. That was his decision as the head coach, and he’d tell you as much.

For what it’s worth, the offense has been molded to Jones’ preferences since training camp - that wouldn’t be a new development at this point.

I‘m not talking about Monday night. That’s ancient history in football terms. I’m talking now.

I don’t agree that the offense has been molded to Mac’s preferences since training camp. If that’s true, why isn't Mac succeeding?

The big difference between last year and this year is the coaching. I‘d go so far as to say the NEP‘s biggest weakness, with a few exceptions, is it's coaching staff, aside from BB.

 

[catent]

I‘m not talking about Monday night. That’s ancient history in football terms. I’m talking now.

I don’t agree that the offense has been molded to Mac’s preferences since training camp. If that’s true, why isn't Mac succeeding?

The big difference between last year and this year is the coaching. I‘d go so far as to say the NEP‘s biggest weakness, with a few exceptions, is it's coaching staff, aside from BB.

Yes, we are talking about Monday night, it’s pivotal to this conversation.

You said Jones is BB’s guy, so I asked how that squares with what happened on MNF, and you explained that must’ve been coming from others internally and BB now put his foot down … as if he wasn’t accountable for what happened on MNF?

It’s not ancient history - it’s absolutely relevant to this discussion.

Jones will have a game or two to respond. We’ll see how it goes.