What will the NFL do about the pats

[danny88]

I am going to go slowly here.
1) You posted something ridiculous
2) I pointed that out
3) You insulted me, saying I cannot read, when my response was tailored to EXACTLY what you said
4) You cut and pasted my comment made in response to your insult
5) The above comment is considered hyperbole.
6) Maybe sacracm, or exaggeration is a word you can understand
7) The exaggeration had nothing to do with the original argument.

To summarize,
You said IF...
I said EVEN IF....
You responded by saying I cant read because you said IF.
And on and on we go.
Give it up, you are wrong, and you are plssing me off even more by not just manning up and admitting your insult was both wrong and childish.

"your projection that the rest of the league is going to give up and hand us the next 5 Lomabardis".

 

[Ring 6]

"your projection that the rest of the league is going to give up and hand us the next 5 Lomabardis".

Is that your way of saying you refuse to man up?

 

[PatsFanInVa]

PWP and Pujo, I heartily concur on every grounds except the evidence. So we have evidence, but our argument about motive is shaky. Unfortunately we can't send that Eliot guy from Law and Order to hold Goodell's head in a toilet until he fesses up, and we don't have a contract with Blackwater. But as (usually) a voice of reason guy myself, I have to question wtf was going on with the officiating in the Colts game myself. It started with the flipping (no pun intended) coin toss. Then the first "completion" -- which was overturned -- seems like it couldn't be anything other than "let's throw this at the wall and see if it sticks." By the time there's a Colts DB anally raping Moss, and Moss is getting called for pass interference, the game's already become a joke.

Here's another theory for you: It just takes one official writing one tell-all book in the immediate temporal vicinity of the event. Let's say there's a tell-all book about the 91 Bills-Giants Super Bowl. Let's say there were some calls that shoulda gone the Bills' way. Does anybody care except a Buffalo fan?

A 15 year NDA should take care of that... although I betcha refs sign in-perpetuity NDAs.

Okay, so I'm paranoid. But in that Colts' game, I feel like Occam's Razor brings us to that explanation. All the other ones involve multiple parties all behaving irrationally for too little reason (such as "they were cowed into blindness by the home dome," etc.)

I think this team has to play under the premise that they might have to beat the refs as well as a given team on any given Sunday... luckily, it appears they have the firepower to do just that.

PFnV

 

[eric5280]

I think the league likes us. I mean the lore of the NFL isn't parity. It's the building of dynasties. What do people like to talk about more? the dynasties of the Steelers, 49ers and Cowboys or one hit wonders like the 2002 Bucs who then proceed to fall into obscurity?

 

[Pujo]

Here's another theory for you: It just takes one official writing one tell-all book in the immediate temporal vicinity of the event. Let's say there's a tell-all book about the 91 Bills-Giants Super Bowl. Let's say there were some calls that shoulda gone the Bills' way. Does anybody care except a Buffalo fan?

Not sure, but it's interesting that we haven't seen any blasts from the past. Is Goodell the first commissioner to fix games, or was Tags doing it too? Rozelle? Does the ownership know, or on who's behalf is Goodell doing this? Is he betting on the games?

A 15 year NDA should take care of that... although I betcha refs sign in-perpetuity NDAs.

Fixing sporting events being a crime, the NFL would be in the position of asking a judge to enforce an NDA against a whistleblower. One thing's certain in any case: the money made from such a book would be more than enough to tie the case up in the courts for years. The NFL would go out of business before it came to trial.

Okay, so I'm paranoid. But in that Colts' game, I feel like Occam's Razor brings us to that explanation. All the other ones involve multiple parties all behaving irrationally for too little reason (such as "they were cowed into blindness by the home dome," etc.)

I think Occam's Razor brings us to the conclusion that strange things happen, albeit not terribly frequently. Winning $100,000,000 in the lottery is a very unusual event, but it happens. Some games are just going to get called poorly.

 

[groundgame]

Maybe the 2008 NFL Annual Meetings Accept a Proposal to amend the Refereeing Covenants as proposed by Competition Committee Member Polian:

Section 2214, Paragraph C (a,) Amended as follows:
....."We hereby enact on this said day, that the required majority of duly authorized National Football League owners have approved the amendment
herein mandating that from this date forward, all New England Patriots games which undertake play in away venues shall be refereed by the most junior head referee in our League. Furthermore, if the aforesaid rookie referee is ill at that time, or unable to travel to the subject site, the NFL hereby further mandates that the referee next selected shall be the last head referee demoted to a lesser position, or preferred, fired, due to a graded incompetency or officiating malpractice. This motion is hereby approved by a super majority vote of 9-1."

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Not sure, but it's interesting that we haven't seen any blasts from the past. Is Goodell the first commissioner to fix games, or was Tags doing it too? Rozelle? Does the ownership know, or on who's behalf is Goodell doing this? Is he betting on the games?

I think the Colts game would have pleased him and America more if Good had defeated Evil. But a case can be made that the soap opera gets richer and richer every week.

We're back to motive. How about:
1) Goodell really, really hated the Pats creating an "is the NFL clean" controversy
2) It's the public knowledge of a "dirty" NFL that bugged him -- stated in anticipation of a consistency argument. Take into account for hypocrisy.
3) Dincha ever see Rollerball? The original one with James Caan I mean.
4) What happens to parity when nobody can beat 1 franchise? It becomes "on any given Sunday, any given team can be beaten by the New England Patriots." Not as exciting.
5) But the simplest explanation is the hype around the Colts game, and the knowledge that they were the "last, best hope" of the rest of the league.

None of these is incredibly strong, I have to admit. I just find a pissed or scheming Goodell easier to believe than an entire game of horrendous calls, all against one team.

Fixing sporting events being a crime, the NFL would be in the position of asking a judge to enforce an NDA against a whistleblower. One thing's certain in any case: the money made from such a book would be more than enough to tie the case up in the courts for years. The NFL would go out of business before it came to trial.

All refs are whistleblowers.

Okay pun aside, enforcement of an NDA would depend on no evidence existing of a fix, other than the game tape itself.

Putting on my tinfoil helmet and going into conspiracy mode: IF this is what happened, it's a matter of "I want those *****s to lose" said out loud, not even in front of the officials, but to an intermediary. This conveniently obviates the need to show a meeting of Goodell and THAT crew.

I think Occam's Razor brings us to the conclusion that strange things happen, albeit not terribly frequently. Winning $100,000,000 in the lottery is a very unusual event, but it happens. Some games are just going to get called poorly.

Another Black Swan fan! That's two this week, on two utterly unrelated subjects. A recursive loop of Black Swans! They're becoming downright common!

You're right, someone has to fill in the low probability cells. And I guess the best time for that to happen is in the most hyped regular season game ever played.

I do believe that unlikely outcomes are, over time, not only likely but certain to happen. But I'm not sure all the monkeys would get together and write Shakespeare's plays precisely on the birthday of the 17th Earl of Oxford, if you get my meaning, which is yet another terribly unlikely event, since I am rambling.

I just don't like that much coincidence befalling my team. And I only see weak explanations.

PFnV

 

[tombonneau]

They won't do anything, nor should they.

The Pats potentially going 19-0 is the best thing to happen to the NFL in years. If not for NE, what would people be talking about? Favre?

You really think the NFL doesn't want 15-0 NE @ the NYG in Week 17 on the NFL Network?

You don't think they want them going 19-0 and winning the SB, having record ratings for each playoff games and surely the record rating for a SB with 18-0 NE vs. Dallas/GB?

You don't think they want people tuning in on ESPN to watch the biggest draft story of all-time as 19-0 SB Champs pick #2 in the draft?

And then have people tuning in every week in the 2008 season to see if NE "can finally lose"?

I haven't read this whole thread, so maybe my viewpoint has been discussed, but frankly, I think the NFL is quite happy with what the Patriots are doing.

 

[danny88]

All the things you are saying make perfect sense.

But how does Roger really feel? What will people say if he has to hand the trophy to Bill after the supwerbowl?

Does the fact the pats are kicking the crap out of everyone in a leauge with a salery cap make the NFL look bad?

 

[Snake]

Enjoy the ride, boys...it won't last forever. People retire, get hurt, move to other teams, and other teams get better. That's simply the nature of the beast. The Packers were once pretty much unbeatable, as were the Steelers, the 49ers, the Broncos, and now the Pats.

Are any of you guys old enough to remember that great Celtic ride of the 50's, 60's, 70's and 80's? What a run that was.

 

[Ring 6]

I think we are getting a bit out of control here.
The Pats were caught violating a rule. They were punished. Was it a fair punishment? Honestly, we are biased in answering that.
To build that into a conspiracy theory that the league has told referees to make calls against us (the havent done a very good job if thats true since we are undefeated) is extreme.

If the argument is that the refs called the Colts game so we would lose, we would have lost. Its ignorant to assume that they tried to influence the game with calls in the Colts favor, but after doing it all day long, they couldn't come up with anything to call in the last 9 minutes to take away our TDs.
If the fix was in, we would have had holding calls on every positive play once the game got close.

 

[Snake]

I think we are getting a bit out of control here.
The Pats were caught violating a rule. They were punished. Was it a fair punishment? Honestly, we are biased in answering that.
To build that into a conspiracy theory that the league has told referees to make calls against us (the havent done a very good job if thats true since we are undefeated) is extreme.

If the argument is that the refs called the Colts game so we would lose, we would have lost. Its ignorant to assume that they tried to influence the game with calls in the Colts favor, but after doing it all day long, they couldn't come up with anything to call in the last 9 minutes to take away our TDs.
If the fix was in, we would have had holding calls on every positive play once the game got close.

I agree...and last Sunday night there weren't many penalties at all.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

I think we are getting a bit out of control here.
The Pats were caught violating a rule. They were punished. Was it a fair punishment? Honestly, we are biased in answering that.
To build that into a conspiracy theory that the league has told referees to make calls against us (the havent done a very good job if thats true since we are undefeated) is extreme.

If the argument is that the refs called the Colts game so we would lose, we would have lost. Its ignorant to assume that they tried to influence the game with calls in the Colts favor, but after doing it all day long, they couldn't come up with anything to call in the last 9 minutes to take away our TDs.
If the fix was in, we would have had holding calls on every positive play once the game got close.

Actually, I was a voice of reason on the subject of crime and punishment. I believe we were, in fact, caught cheating. I believe the punishment, though unprecedented and perhaps a tad on the harsh side, was absolutely within the commish's discretion. I also believe the rest of the league took a massive "get out of sucking free" card, especially the Steelers, Eagles, and Panthers' players. How predictable.

Okay, you have a point about the eventual outcome of the game.

For the sake of argument, let's predicate it this way:

"All I'm saying is if anything's even close to a call for the Colts, call it. Call it if it could be a call. Call it if it's a bad call you can explain away... call everything you can think of to call if there's even a shred of a call to call..."

I don't have the game on tape. Are there "maybe you could call something" moments you have in mind?

I'm only half-serious here, given that I recognize in myself all the signs of conspiracy theorizing. But again, competing explanations seem weak.

I know you have a reason -- the game's outcome -- that you believe this can not be the case. I see your reasoning, and Pujo's for that matter, as exactly the road I usually take... but for some reason, I just can't get past that game's officiating. I mean I've seen badly called games, but this was a constant onslaught.

Anyway, I suppose it amounts to venting. As I constantly remind others, the beauty of a conspiracy theory is that any proof just proves "the conspiracy" is really good at what they do. Pretty neat.

Still, the problem with a bunch of evidence and no plausible explanation, is that it positively invites conspiracy theory.

I'm left with that and black swans dude.

Just waiting for the History Channel to do a show on it, so I know it's all true.

PFnV

 

[BingoBrown]

Pats fans want to see this team win and fans of other teams want
to see them lose.

See=Ratings and NFL popularity=$$$

 

[FrontSeven]

The NFL Soclialist Act of 2008 will take of this problem.

Section D, clause 4 states that "No team shall attempt to Moss another team under penalty of fine, imprisonment and whatever else we can pile on at the last second to satisfy anti-Patriots fans."

 

[80Brown]

What?!?! They're decided beforehand?!?

Next thing you know, you'll be trying to spoil the rest of my day and tell us all that there's no Santa Claus!!!!!!!!

Jeez....

Of course there is a Santa Claus Virginia. But about the Easter Bunny and Tooth Fairy....

 

[ATippett56]

Of course there is a Santa Claus Virginia. But about the Easter Bunny and Tooth Fairy....

Unfortunately, there is Bill Polian and the competition committee .........

 

[National Sports Advisors]

If we win the superbowl then come back stronger next year. Brady will have had a whole year and a another camp to gel with Moss and co. Morris will be back.

We have the SECOND pick in the draft right now that will surely be turned into a slew of 2008 and 2009 picks.

We can restock this roster and come out stronger then ever. The core of the team is locked up and young ( the lines)

Will the NFL have to do something? Will we be punished for simply being better than everyone else at drafting and free agency? Will the NFL have to step in and help the idiots who cannot run there teams?

Funny thing is the pats dominate in a salery capped sport. They are just better then everyone else.

Edit I know the colts are good to , but this year lack of depth finally caught up to them. The pats can still win with injury.

Watch these knuckleheads invoke a rule that prohibits teams from trading future 1st Rd Picks to playoff teams or stipulate that any future 1st rd pick traded is "Top 5" protected so that they never have to have egg on their face again when the defending super bowl champs end up drafting #2 in the draft. There will be a big uproar after the season is over and the media needs something to write about. There will be relentless stories about the Pats drafting #2 and how it is unfair. It will be nauseating.

 

[QuiGon]

I think we are getting a bit out of control here.
The Pats were caught violating a rule. They were punished. Was it a fair punishment? Honestly, we are biased in answering that.
To build that into a conspiracy theory that the league has told referees to make calls against us (the havent done a very good job if thats true since we are undefeated) is extreme.

I have to agree with Andy. There is a certain segment of Patriots fans that are getting a wee bit caught up in the paranoia. The Patriots got caught violating the rules and they got punished. That does not indicate a league-wide conspiracy to attack and assault them for their successes.

 

[QuiGon]

The one thing that the NFL will never do is "underhanded" officiating. I guarantee you Goodell doesn't take officials aside and whisper, "Help the Colts win this one, would ya?" in their ears.

It would only take one retired official writing one tell-all book to sink the entire NFL, no way is Goodell going to risk it.

Once again my good friend Pujo, as he so often does, speaks both wisdom and truth..!! Fact is a Patriots dynasty of domination will last a couple years... an officiating scandal that was orchestrated by league HQ would do extremely serious and long lasting damage to the league for decades to come and would arguably be the biggest sports scandal of our lifetime.