J.C. Jackson - "It's time to get Mr. INT paid."

[Pape]

But when you say 42 million guaranteed, does that include the 25 million sign on bonus? If that's the case can't I technically get 3 years of Jackson at 42 million and cut him ?

its 67 million of the 80 guaranteed... the 25 million is the signing bonus... and because its 4 years, he gets a crack at fa again

 

[venecol]

Typically, guaranteed money incl. signing bonus. $42M is only 53% of total, whereas 60% is more likely, so $48M. $67M would be outrageous.

 

[Toofy]

Typically, guaranteed money incl. signing bonus. $42M is only 53% of total, whereas 60% is more likely, so $48M. $67M would be outrageous.

Yup that was my understanding as well.
More like 5 year 95, 68 guaranteed and 20 sign on .

 

[skinnydog]

Exactly. The Pats need pressure, not better coverage. They also need to be better against the run.

I always thought Bill‘s defenses brought more pressure when he was confident in the coverage. When he doesn’t trust the coverage the defense doesn’t bring the pressure.

 

[DaBruinz]

JC Jackson was our number 1 corner last season. That said the Patriots have a history of not paying top dollar to retain their own players - see Asante Samuel, Darius Butler, etc.

I expect a Tag and Trade move. The question is how much compensation can Bill get out of moving Jackson on to his next team.

My personal preference would be to keep JC Jackson, and he's just entering his prime at age 26, but I've got to be realistic -- Mr. Kraft is cheap and BB rarely pays top dollars to retain veterans.

The other factor that goes against keeping JC in New England is that we badly overpaid in last year's free agency period. The bad contracts/overpays given to guys like Jhonnu Smith and Agholor will make it harder to keep one of the best young CB talents developed by the team in recent years.

I believe you mean Malcolm Butler. And he wasn't the team's #1 Corner. You're also ignoring that they paid the Likes of Matt Light, Randy Moss, Tom Brady, Vince Wilfork, Logan Mankins, Devin McCourty, Dont'a Hightower, etc, etc.

 

[DaBruinz]

Exactly. The Pats need pressure, not better coverage. They also need to be better against the run.

But reducing the coverage (as we saw with the loss of Jones) in the loss of Jackson doesn't help matters either.

 

[DaBruinz]

Last time I checked, RT was the empty space

RT is only empty if the Pats don't slot Onwenu there. And that is more likely than a return of Trent Brown.

 

[DaBruinz]

But when you say 42 million guaranteed, does that include the 25 million sign on bonus? If that's the case can't I technically get 3 years of Jackson at 42 million and cut him ?

No because you are going to have to have Salary in there for the 3rd year. And that's NOT going to be $4-$5M. In fact, it's likely to be $15-25M.

 

[DaBruinz]

Yup that was my understanding as well.
More like 5 year 95, 68 guaranteed and 20 sign on .

The 20M signing bonus is part of the 68M guaranteed.

 

[ralmat55]

I believe you mean Malcolm Butler. And he wasn't the team's #1 Corner. You're also ignoring that they paid the Likes of Matt Light, Randy Moss, Tom Brady, Vince Wilfork, Logan Mankins, Devin McCourty, Dont'a Hightower, etc, etc.

All the players you mentioned other than Mankins never were paid their market value. Each took less for their own reasons to stay with the Patriots. Both McCourty and Hightower reportedly got bigger offers when they were free agents from other teams and returned anyway.

Mankins got a top of the market deal as a side agreement to the 2011 CBA negotiations. And, Bill wasted no time trading him and his big contract once it was no longer cap prohibitive to do so.

I agree with Belichick’s philosophy in this regard. Most players are fungible and replaceable. Three years ago many here were upset the Pats didn’t pay to keep Trey Flowers and Trent Brown. In retrospect, that looks like a pretty good decision.

My problem with Bill in this regard is that not all players are replaceable. Ty Law, Richard Seymour, Rob Gronkowski, and Tom Brady were special players and HOFers and not easily replaceable. Belichick’s intransigence to not recognize that and pay them what was needed to keep them has cost the Patriots dearly.

JC Jackson is not a special player. He a poorer tackling, rich man’s Malcolm Butler. In the free agent/salary cap era, there’s nothing wrong with drafting for need. This draft has 4 or 5 CBs who with the right coaching and system will be as good as Jackson for whole lot less money over the next 5 seasons.

 

[1960Pats]

All the players you mentioned other than Mankins never were paid their market value. Each took less for their own reasons to stay with the Patriots. Both McCourty and Hightower reportedly got bigger offers when they were free agents from other teams and returned anyway.

Mankins got a top of the market deal as a side agreement to the 2011 CBA negotiations. And, Bill wasted no time trading him and his big contract once it was no longer cap prohibitive to do so.

I agree with Belichick’s philosophy in this regard. Most players are fungible and replaceable. Three years ago many here were upset the Pats didn’t pay to keep Trey Flowers and Trent Brown. In retrospect, that looks like a pretty good decision.

My problem with Bill in this regard is that not all players are replaceable. Ty Law, Richard Seymour, Rob Gronkowski, and Tom Brady were special players and HOFers and not easily replaceable. Belichick’s intransigence to not recognize that and pay them what was needed to keep them has cost the Patriots dearly.

JC Jackson is not a special player. He a poorer tackling, rich man’s Malcolm Butler. In the free agent/salary cap era, there’s nothing wrong with drafting for need. This draft has 4 or 5 CBs who with the right coaching and system will be as good as Jackson for whole lot less money over the next 5 seasons.

Yup. When you have special players you should try to keep them, not bring them down to everyone else's level. After all, it's the players that we pay to see.

 

[DaBruinz]

All the players you mentioned other than Mankins never were paid their market value. Each took less for their own reasons to stay with the Patriots. Both McCourty and Hightower reportedly got bigger offers when they were free agents from other teams and returned anyway.

Mankins got a top of the market deal as a side agreement to the 2011 CBA negotiations. And, Bill wasted no time trading him and his big contract once it was no longer cap prohibitive to do so.

I agree with Belichick’s philosophy in this regard. Most players are fungible and replaceable. Three years ago many here were upset the Pats didn’t pay to keep Trey Flowers and Trent Brown. In retrospect, that looks like a pretty good decision.

My problem with Bill in this regard is that not all players are replaceable. Ty Law, Richard Seymour, Rob Gronkowski, and Tom Brady were special players and HOFers and not easily replaceable. Belichick’s intransigence to not recognize that and pay them what was needed to keep them has cost the Patriots dearly.

JC Jackson is not a special player. He a poorer tackling, rich man’s Malcolm Butler. In the free agent/salary cap era, there’s nothing wrong with drafting for need. This draft has 4 or 5 CBs who with the right coaching and system will be as good as Jackson for whole lot less money over the next 5 seasons.

This shows you're talking out your rear. Miguel has shown that Brady was paid Market value and that the idea he wasn't is false. Brady played for 20 years with New England. To claim that BB didn't pay them what was needed to keep him is ridiculous. BTW, you seem to have forgotten that the Pats were willing to give brady a 1yr/$25M deal before he chose to go to Tampa. BRADY CHOSE TO LEAVE.

Bill jettisoned Mankins when it was no longer cap prohibitive? Yeah.. Makes total sense give the guy top dollar because you hate to do so? You make ZERO sense.. Mankins was traded 3 years into the deal. Why even give him the money to begin with? Hmm?

Gronkowski was paid TOP DOLLAR 2 years prior to his contract expiring. As was Hernandez. You forget that.

You're claim that Jackson is poor at tackling is laughable as is your pathetic comparison of him to Butler. Butler was never EVER close to being a #1 CB. EVER. Jackson is amongst the top CBs in the league currently.

The "right coaching and system"? How many of those players will end up in that "right coaching and system" environment? Clearly you don't understand the meaning of "A bird in the hand is worth more than 2 in the bush".

 

[Toofy]

The 20M signing bonus is part of the 68M guaranteed.

Yeah that was what I implied. 68 guaranteed including 20 sign on bonus.

 

[Love The Drake]

Yeah that was what I implied. 68 guaranteed including 20 sign on bonus.

Raiders are ESPNs favorite to sign Jackson.
Only thing that is odd he’s stated following Raiders and their players on social media.

 

[ralmat55]

Probably just speculation. But, I was watching Scott Pioli on the NFL network and he seemed to think the Pats were not out on Jackson. Said the Patriots were letting Jackson find his market. Just thought I’d share. I had closed the books on the possibility.

 

[venecol]

Probably just speculation. But, I was watching Scott Pioli on the NFL network and he seemed to think the Pats were not out on Jackson. Said the Patriots were letting Jackson find his market. Just thought I’d share. I had closed the books on the possibility.

He gone.

 

[patfanken]

When people are talking about the cap they often forget the most important aspect of the cap's very nature. That is, "that for EVERY dollar you give one player, there is one less dollar for everyone else." The FACT is that for the last 23 years of the Pats management of the cap is that they have generally spent to the cap limits every year, and rarely entered any of those off seasons with a top 10 cap space designation.

Since the "elite" players number between 5-10% of any roster, the Pats have historically chosen to spend the bulk of their cap space on acquiring and paying a strong middle class, rather than building rosters that are top heavy with big money starters backed up by bargain basement reserves. We saw the results of the later strategy up close during the Pete Carroll years where we seemingly HAD a strong starting lineup, but little depth, and that strategy fails, as it must, because the football season is a war of attrition that is now 17-21 games long, and injuries happen.
Depth matters in all professional team sports, but NONE more so as football. There are so many moving parts and the game IS violent (though not nearly as much as when I played - pardon the old guy's aside).

So while you can jigger the cap and "create more space", the bill eventually has to come due, like it did for us in 2000, and again in 2009, and in 2020. Just as it will for the Bucs, and it will for the Rams, and any team they thinks they can use "void years" and "signing bonuses" to effectively keep creating immediate cap room forever. That works, as we all know, but only for a given cycle, and then the ultimate bill comes due and we see very good players being moved or cut simply as salary dumps, or moved because they were overpaid in the FA process in the first place.

JC Jackson is a very good player, and the Pats not be as good if he leaves. But he will likely be overpaid in FA, (through not fault of his own) just like most of the first day or two signing will be, because everyone will be trying to sign some shiny new toy for their fan bases. It's the nature of the marketplace. SO while it will be tough to say goodbye to a player of his caliber, we as fans HAVE to remember there would be consequences to keeping him. So keep that in mind as he walks out that door that with the same money that we might have spent to keep JC, the Pats COULD use that cap money to sign THREE solid pros who might not be as individually talented as Jackson, but might still have a more lasting impact over the course of an entire season.

Just a thought before tomorrow's auction begins.

 

[RIpats88]

When people are talking about the cap they often forget the most important aspect of the cap's very nature. That is, "that for EVERY dollar you give one player, there is one less dollar for everyone else." The FACT is that for the last 23 years of the Pats management of the cap is that they have generally spent to the cap limits every year, and rarely entered any of those off seasons with a top 10 cap space designation.

Since the "elite" players number between 5-10% of any roster, the Pats have historically chosen to spend the bulk of their cap space on acquiring and paying a strong middle class, rather than building rosters that are top heavy with big money starters backed up by bargain basement reserves. We saw the results of the later strategy up close during the Pete Carroll years where we seemingly HAD a strong starting lineup, but little depth, and that strategy fails, as it must, because the football season is a war of attrition that is now 17-21 games long, and injuries happen.
Depth matters in all professional team sports, but NONE more so as football. There are so many moving parts and the game IS violent (though not nearly as much as when I played - pardon the old guy's aside).

So while you can jigger the cap and "create more space", the bill eventually has to come due, like it did for us in 2000, and again in 2009, and in 2020. Just as it will for the Bucs, and it will for the Rams, and any team they thinks they can use "void years" and "signing bonuses" to effectively keep creating immediate cap room forever. That works, as we all know, but only for a given cycle, and then the ultimate bill comes due and we see very good players being moved or cut simply as salary dumps, or moved because they were overpaid in the FA process in the first place.

JC Jackson is a very good player, and the Pats not be as good if he leaves. But he will likely be overpaid in FA, (through not fault of his own) just like most of the first day or two signing will be, because everyone will be trying to sign some shiny new toy for their fan bases. It's the nature of the marketplace. SO while it will be tough to say goodbye to a player of his caliber, we as fans HAVE to remember there would be consequences to keeping him. So keep that in mind as he walks out that door that with the same money that we might have spent to keep JC, the Pats COULD use that cap money to sign THREE solid pros who might not be as individually talented as Jackson, but might still have a more lasting impact over the course of an entire season.

Just a thought before tomorrow's auction begins.

We may regret not paying him if teams are passing all over us next year and we don't have a replacement

 

[BritPat]

He gone.

That's my view too. Good luck JC!

 

[Username]

A name to watch:

Charvarius Ward

• 6’1 200 lbs
• Chiefs play the most press man in the NFL
• 51% comp. pct 4 TDs 2 INTs 73.6 rating
• Has kept Diggs in check back to back years

He’s been the CB1 of an underrated pass defense to past two years. He’s been burned at times due to blitzing (3rd & 20 vs. Chase) but is a pretty good CB & someone that could be better on his next team IMO.

I don't see the logic in paying someone who's not as good as JC Jackson slightly less than what it would take to keep JC here?