OT: Official 2020 Tompa Bay Gronkaneers Thread

[SHOWTIME15]

However, it was a colossal mistake by Bill the GM to treat Brady like a JAG. All he had to do was offer a modest multiyear deal in the $25mil per year range. This is still a steal considering guys like JG averages $30mil.

With what salary cap could Bill have done that? WIthout Brady, they were already near the cap limit before all the Covid opt-outs. Keeping Brady here and adding a bunch of weapons would have been near impossible to do in march.

 

[203Pat]

With what salary cap could Bill have done that? WIthout Brady, they were already near the cap limit before all the Covid opt-outs. Keeping Brady here and adding a bunch of weapons would have been near impossible to do in march.

And who's fault is that?

 

[XLIX]

With what salary cap could Bill have done that? WIthout Brady, they were already near the cap limit before all the Covid opt-outs. Keeping Brady here and adding a bunch of weapons would have been near impossible to do in march.

What are you talking about? Keeping Brady, had they done it soon enough, would have resulted in a lower cap hit than the one they had to take. An entirely new deal could have easily been structured with a very low year-1 cap hit.

 

[1960Pats]

I appreciate both too and seeing how Tampa is struggling to reach their potential due to coaching makes me appreciate BB as a coach more.

However, it was a colossal mistake by Bill the GM to treat Brady like a JAG. All he had to do was offer a modest multiyear deal in the $25mil per year range. This is still a steal considering guys like JG averages $30mil.

Even after going to 9 SB, I still underestimated NE coaching staff as they are making this no talent NE team competitive. If the Pat's still had Brady, they lwould be going to the playoffs this year.

A team cannot take for granted the opportunity to get in the playoff and compete for a SB. Bill the GM made this mistake and arrogantly thought that a playoff birth is automatic.

So I appreciate BB the coach more and Bill the GM seriously needs his hands slapped

NE and TB are great examples of the axiom that coaches don't win games, players do. Coaches can only lose them. Bill puts players in a better position to win than Arians.

What would happen if the two teams had swapped HCs? My guess is that TB would be in the hunt for the NFCS with NO and NE would have been eliminated already.

As for Bill the GM it's possible that Brady caught him off guard when he left.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

And who's fault is that?

Bill did everything he could to put together 3 super bowl winning teams from 2014-2018, and like most dynasties, it ran it's course. The Pats were stacked with older veterans in 2018/2019 who were drafted after 2009 that made a lot of money.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

What are you talking about? Keeping Brady, had they done it soon enough, would have resulted in a lower cap hit than the one they had to take. An entirely new deal could have easily been structured with a very low year-1 cap hit.

Oh I forgot you're an accountant and cap specialist.

 

[XLIX]

Oh I forgot you're an accountant and cap specialist.

Now now... no need to be so pissy just because I called out an inaccurate statement. I know the cap baffles you, but it really doesn't take a genius to understand the basic mechanics of how it works.

Just man up and admit you made an honest mistake. It was both widely reported and discussed in this forum that Brady's cap hit accelerated to this season since he left. It would have been easy to keep him and have a lower cap hit in 2020 than the one they took with him leaving.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Now now... no need to be so pissy just because I called out an inaccurate statement. I know the cap baffles you, but it really doesn't take a genius to understand the basic mechanics of how it works.

Just man up and admit you made an honest mistake. It was both widely reported and discussed in this forum that Brady's cap hit accelerated to this season since he left. It would have been easy to keep him and have a lower cap hit in 2020 than the one they took with him leaving.

I said it would have been impossible to resign him in MARCH given our cap constraints at the time

 

[lancerman]

Almost zero chance of either of those happening. Eli will get in due to his wins against the Pats and the fact he's top 10 in TDs and yards. And no chance that they will bypass the 5 year waiting period for Brady.

Eli already has enough voters saying they wouldn’t vote for him to keep him out. They polled like half the the hall and just that small sample size would keep him out without even considering the other half or the undecided folks

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Eli already has enough voters saying they wouldn’t vote for him to keep him out. They polled like half the the hall and just that small sample size would keep him out without even considering the other half or the undecided folks

LOL, if Ken Stabler got into the HOF, ELi's getting in...besides, it's better for NE fans that Eli is a HOFer so that they can at least say they lost twice to a HOF QB.

 

[203Pat]

Bill did everything he could to put together 3 super bowl winning teams from 2014-2018, and like most dynasties, it ran it's course. The Pats were stacked with older veterans in 2018/2019 who were drafted after 2009 that made a lot of money.

And had he drafted better in the last 5 years he would have had cheap talent. Instead he drafted poorly and had to sign/trade for people and hope it worked. When it didn't he claimed he "sold out" for rings.

 

[carmelo15]

Great players need great coaches and great coaches need great players.
- Tom Brady

That makes a lot of sense to me. We're seeing the results of Bill with crap QB play but I think Bill with a good QB not named Brady could have won a title or two and same with Brady the other way. Not 6 though. One of the best parts of 6 is it shut Steeler fan chest thumping right down.

First off when did your 360 change happen.
But I agree somewhat, I think BB would get one ring with a decent QB two max. You’d have to remember if said QB won a ring he’d get paid too 8 QB money and BB wouldn’t have the luxury have surrounding him with good players. If we go by history we’d have decent weapons and a good defense that’s not winning multiple Super Bowls if the QB is average

 

[SHOWTIME15]

And had he drafted better in the last 5 years he would have had cheap talent. Instead he drafted poorly and had to sign/trade for people and hope it worked. When it didn't he claimed he "sold out" for rings.

I know tell me about. Bill should be roasted for not helping Tommy get 9 rings instead of 6.

 

[sb1]

LOL, if Ken Stabler got into the HOF, ELi's getting in...besides, it's better for NE fans that Eli is a HOFer so that they can at least say they lost twice to a HOF QB.

Doubt Eli is first ballot but he'll get in.

As for waiving the waiting period for Brady - that won't happen nor should it. Unless he has some terminal illness and will not live to see his induction, it shouldn't happen. Nobody else has gotten that privilege.

 

[amfootball]

Doubt Eli is first ballot but he'll get in.

As for waiving the waiting period for Brady - that won't happen nor should it. Unless he has some terminal illness and will not live to see his induction, it shouldn't happen. Nobody else has gotten that privilege.

I agree about Brady but Kraft and Bill should be in the Hall right now.

 

[sb1]

First off when did your 360 change happen.
But I agree somewhat, I think BB would get one ring with a decent QB two max. You’d have to remember if said QB won a ring he’d get paid too 8 QB money and BB wouldn’t have the luxury have surrounding him with good players. If we go by history we’d have decent weapons and a good defense that’s not winning multiple Super Bowls if the QB is average

That's a good point. I agree that QB whoever he is wouldn't give the Patriots or whatever team Bill is coaching a break like Brady has over the years on his contract.

I always appreciated what Brady meant to this team. I didn't care at all for his play last year nor his attitude but it wasn't more than that. Admit I was probably a bit douchey at times arguing about it. I predicted he would do well in Tampa. Thought the Pats would be a playoff team without him but I guess I really overestimated what we would get from our QB this year.

 

[sb1]

I agree about Brady but Kraft and Bill should be in the Hall right now.

I wonder how much Spygate will hurt Bill in voting. I bet there will be one of "that guy" who won't vote for him on the first ballot for that reason. Hopefully I'm wrong. It was a boneheaded and arrogant thing to do but Bill is not a cheater.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

I wonder how much Spygate will hurt Bill in voting. I bet there will be one of "that guy" who won't vote for him on the first ballot for that reason. Hopefully I'm wrong. It was a boneheaded and arrogant thing to do but Bill is not a cheater.

If they are going to consider Spygate for Bill, then some voters will undoubtedly consider Deflategate for Brady. Neither would be a concern if I were a voter, but I don't have that privilege. I know Woody Paige of the Denver Post said years ago he wouldn't vote for Brady to get in the HOF because of Deflategate, but that was back in 2015 and things may have cooled down for him since then.

 

[sb1]

If they are going to consider Spygate for Bill, then some voters will undoubtedly consider Deflategate for Brady. Neither would be a concern if I were a voter, but I don't have that privilege. I know Woody Paige of the Denver Post said years ago he wouldn't vote for Brady to get in the HOF because of Deflategate, but that was back in 2015 and things may have cooled down for him since then.

Now that the facts are out about what happened I doubt anyone would have that same opinion about that now. I guess you never know though.

I think Spygate was more egregious in the eyes of the general NFL fan. Much easier to say it was cheating tbh. Bill as usual wanting to be smarter than everyone else in the room.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Doubt Eli is first ballot but he'll get in.

As for waiving the waiting period for Brady - that won't happen nor should it. Unless he has some terminal illness and will not live to see his induction, it shouldn't happen. Nobody else has gotten that privilege.

He has little competition in the class of 2025. If Brees had retired last year, then yeah, he'd be in trouble. Other than Keuchly, who else gets in ahead of him? I know Pats fans hate Eli, but the facts are he's a 2 time SB winner, 2 time SB MVP, 8th in the league in TDs, and top 10 in yards thrown. He ended up with two dogs of a coach after Coughlin left with McAdoo and Shurmur, which should be taken into account.

-- LB Lorenzo Alexander (2005-19). Two Pro Bowler. Second-team All-Pro.

-- TE Vernon Davis (2006-19). Two-time Pro Bowler. Second-team All-Pro. Super Bowl champion.

-- C Travis Frederick (2013-19). Five-time Pro Bowler. First-team All-Pro. Two-time second-team All-Pro.

-- LB Luke Kuechly (2012-19). Seven-time Pro Bowler. Five-time first-team All-Pro. Two-time second-team All-Pro. NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year (2012). NFL Defensive Player of the Year (2013).

-- QB Eli Manning (2004-19). Four-time Pro Bowler. Two-time Super Bowl champion. Two-time Super Bowl MVP.

-- S Eric Weddle (2007-19). Six-time Pro Bowler. Two-time first-team All-Pro. Three-time second-team All-Pro.

-- G Marshal Yanda (2007-19). Eight-time Pro Bowler. Two-time first-team All-Pro. Five-time second-team All-Pro. Super Bowl champion.