How Can the Pats Stop the Ravens?

[fightingirish595]

Found something that pretty much shows exactly what I’m talking about. Watch the last defender come down and then bite on the QB who doesn’t have the ball. Pulling blocker takes him where he wanted to go. Big gain

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

My new favorite thread

Found something that pretty much shows exactly what I’m talking about. Watch the last defender come down and then bite on the QB who doesn’t have the ball. Pulling blocker takes him where he wanted to go. Big gain

GT Counter

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Are you sure the offense was the same ?

I'd assume that Mornhinweg and Roman would leave their own unique signatures on the offense.

Mornhiweg called the plays while Roman has been building, tinkering w the offense since his 49er days.

They were running a small sample w Flacko lol.

Roman is the man behind the curtain here but again MM did call the plays.

 

[fightingirish595]

My new favorite thread


GT Counter

cant tell if you’re agreeing with me or not.

Edit: just realized I could swipe through different plays. That one Houston ran was nice!!!

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

cant tell if you’re agreeing with me or not

cant tell if you’re agreeing with me or not.

Edit: just realized I could swipe through different plays. That one Houston ran was nice!!!

Pretty much same play. Thought one of the points was abt same side c.

I confess I haven't read 99% of the debate tho.

*Edit*
Army, MTST & Memphis all sweet too.

Looks familiar..

GT Counter tried getting the Memphis one out of wing.

 

[fightingirish595]

Pretty much same play. Thought one of the points was abt same side c.

I confess I haven't read 99% of the debate tho

I’m not a coach or a player. Never played in HS. It wasn’t my sport. But I come from a football family and probably know more than a lot of people my age that never played past middle school.

did the best I could to explain what I meant. Pretty sure it’s possible that these teams can run option and same side counters from the same formations and looks. But I’m being told it’s physically impossible to run a counter off the guy who is being optioned, but I think the play I posted pretty much disproves that’s claim

 

[scout]

Can the Ravens stop the Patriots. If there is a rematch, my money is on the Patriots whatever field. Although, like the noise better at Gillette.

 

[fightingirish595]

There is a point about same side. My point was that if the unblocked end or whoever is unblocked crashes on the QB which he suggests he should do everytime against lamar, he could potentially get sucked into crashing on the qb on a play like this if left unblocked.

he seems to be assuming that the unblocked player will be able to know if a counter or option is coming based on where the action is going.

and like I said previously that may not neccessarily be the case. Players fall for things sometimes. The unblocked player went to Haskins who didn’t have the ball. And the counter worked

 

[Ring 6]

Found something that pretty much shows exactly what I’m talking about. Watch the last defender come down and then bite on the QB who doesn’t have the ball. Pulling blocker takes him where he wanted to go. Big gain

That is not what we are talking about because they did not run option at the player.
That play would not be part of option defense.

 

[Ring 6]

He wrote like 1,000,000 words in 3 pages to explain a scheme no one's ever heard of. ************ good luck explaining that a bunch of different kids/people.

Football is complex but not rocket science. Any coach I've ever talked to or been around wants to simplify things bc again you're explaining this to 20+ different people, who all don't learn the same way. The game is extremely fast. You have to quick, smart, decisive decisions on the fly while communicating to your teammates.

My entire point was that the man they are optioning off should be assigned taking the keeper.

 

[Ring 6]

There is a point about same side. My point was that if the unblocked end or whoever is unblocked crashes on the QB which he suggests he should do everytime against lamar, he could potentially get sucked into crashing on the qb on a play like this if left unblocked.

he seems to be assuming that the unblocked player will be able to know if a counter or option is coming based on where the action is going.

and like I said previously that may not neccessarily be the case. Players fall for things sometimes. The unblocked player went to Haskins who didn’t have the ball. And the counter worked

On the play you showed, had the end crashed down he would have had a chance to make the play. But it’s still irrelevant. Counter trey has nothing to do with defending the option.

 

[fightingirish595]

On the play you showed, had the end crashed down he would have had a chance to make the play. But it’s still irrelevant. Counter trey has nothing to do with defending the option.

And I’m literally trying to tell you that they ran the counter out of an option look. Look what the unblocked player does. He bites on Haskins going to the edge. It’s clear as day. Helped spring the counter.

 

[Ring 6]

I’m not a coach or a player. Never played in HS. It wasn’t my sport. But I come from a football family and probably know more than a lot of people my age that never played past middle school.

did the best I could to explain what I meant. Pretty sure it’s possible that these teams can run option and same side counters from the same formations and looks. But I’m being told it’s physically impossible to run a counter off the guy who is being optioned, but I think the play I posted pretty much disproves that’s claim

No you are being told it’s physically impossible to show option and run a counter to the same side.
Running a counter on a different play than the option has nothing to do with option rules.

 

[Ring 6]

And I’m literally trying to tell you that they ran the counter out of an option look. Look what the unblocked player does. He bites on Haskins going to the edge. It’s clear as day. Helped spring the counter.

He is not the player being option. The okay isn’t an option.
You might as well show a pass play.

 

[fightingirish595]

He is not the player being option. The okay isn’t an option.
You might as well show a pass play.

why does the player unblocked initially bite on Haskins going to the edge as if Haskins might be carrying the ball

 

[Ring 6]

By the way the unblocked guy in that play wasn’t the issue he had contain.
players have assignments.

I’ll ask again when an option is run what do you want the unblocked player to do?
What he does on plays that aren’t options are irrelevant to your scheme to defend the option

 

[Ring 6]

why does the player unblocked initially bite on Haskins going to the edge as if Haskins might be carrying the ball

Because he has contain. He isn’t defending an option he is defending a bootleg.

 

[Ring 6]

why does the player unblocked initially bite on Haskins going to the edge as if Haskins might be carrying the ball

Players that are not being OPTIONED AT are irrelevant to what a player being optioned at should do.

 

[fightingirish595]

Players that are not being OPTIONED AT are irrelevant to what a player being optioned at should do.

they could option at that player in that same look! That’s the entire point. If he’s overly agressive at playing the QB, it opens up plays like that. Clearly it wasn’t a bootleg. It was a goddamn counter and the unblocked player didn’t know who had the ball. Players make mistakes. The ball can go to a lot of places. It’s what makes these offenses hard to stop

 

[Ring 6]

they could option at that player in that same look! That’s the entire point. If he’s overly agressive at playing the QB, it opens up plays like that. Clearly it wasn’t a bootleg. It was a goddamn counter and the unblocked player didn’t know who had the ball. Players make mistakes. The ball can go to a lot of places. It’s what makes these offenses hard to stop

If the QB kept that ball it would have been a bootleg.
The unblocked player had contain. He wasn’t he reason the defense failed, the entire middle of the defense was.

I think I finally see your confusion.
Just stop and read this

I am saying WHEN YOU ARE OPTIONED AT , on those option plays only, the defense must have a rule of who takes QB and who takes RB. Against the old triple option you had to hand a plaster rim to the pitch man. Otherwise everyone converged on the qb because he has the ball. It’s TEAM DEFENSE. So there are option rules. The basic rule vs the old option was first man had an 2nd nan has pitch.
In Baltimore’s offense if you do not assign a player to ignore the RB on an option look then Jackson keeps and runs wild.
My suggestion is vs Baltimore first man has qb, with first man being the one they leave to option off of

if you run a play that isn’t an option it doesn’t matter what the player would have done if it wasn’t an option.
Running action away and countering back is not a play where option rules apply. Simply being unblocked does not mean you are being optioned. In the play you cited he was being trapped. But that player would never employ option rules.
In this case he has contain so he must play bootleg or reverse, which is 99% of the time what an offside edge player does.

so it sounds like you are arguing that if the optioned player takes ban on options they will run non option plays to exploit it. that makes no sense because he is only taking qb because it was an option. If it’s not an option he has normal responsibilities.