Pats - Titans postgame thread

[JayNM]

With the amount of pieces we've got, with so many young players rising up in so many position that we are aging...

I think there's a good chance we end up with some decent veterans getting cut (Or traded, but it's not as easy as some might think)... Rex, Duron Harmon, Pennel/Shelton/Butler...

My mentality is simply to maximize long term with the depth of the team. Next year we've got a lot of players going into FA AND our core is aging, with most of them going over 30 now. Perhaps would be wiser to lose a bit of current capacity on our Backups and 3rd stringers to make sure we can properly replace parts in the future.

Are we really comfortable releasing young players who are showing promise only to get 1 or 2 years of OK playing by guys who aren't on the field all that much?

me thinks this year's cuts are going to be very hard. In more recent ears, it was clear cut which players were deserving to continue because we haven't been having a huuuge success drafting. This year is completely different.

PS - BB proves time and time again that he uses a lot of Economics' thought in his roster mgmt. Not long ago he had a draft with 4 picks or so it was because he knew he could ride the roster he had for some years. This year he went with more picks and I don't think that's a coincidence.

He knows he needs to start thinking about 2020 and beyond now.

 

[RobertWeathers]

With the amount of pieces we've got, with so many young players rising up in so many position that we are aging...

I think there's a good chance we end up with some decent veterans getting cut (Or traded, but it's not as easy as some might think)... Rex, Duron Harmon, Pennel/Shelton/Butler...

My mentality is simply to maximize long term with the depth of the team. Next year we've got a lot of players going into FA AND our core is aging, with most of them going over 30 now. Perhaps would be wiser to lose a bit of current capacity on our Backups and 3rd stringers to make sure we can properly replace parts in the future.

Are we really comfortable releasing young players who are showing promise only to get 1 or 2 years of OK playing by guys who aren't on the field all that much?

me thinks this year's cuts are going to be very hard. It finally seems like there is a chance for us to start planning for the future with a bunch of keepers and that means some hard releases could happen.

Pernell?
For some of them I'm not.

We aren't talking about Bru and Rodney from the 07 team.

The vets they have are all performing at a high level still.

The Pats' main advantage over the other pretenders is playoff and championship experience.

I do think this is the last hurrah for some.

 

[JayNM]

Pernell?
For some of them I'm not.

We aren't talking about Bru and Rodney from the 07 team.

The vets they have are all performing at a high level still.

The Pats' main advantage over the other pretenders is playoff and championship experience.

I do think this is the last hurrah for some.

I definitely don't mean to cut any Starter - by starter i mean the top players, snap wise, in each position - just so Im clear. I agree that they are still producing

 

[RobertWeathers]

I definitely don't mean to cut any Starter - by starter i mean the top players, snap wise, in each position - just so Im clear. I agree that they are still producing

I can see High and DMC not in NEP uniforms next year.

 

[JayNM]

I can see High and DMC not in NEP uniforms next year.

Yep, me too. That's why some guys might have to foot a bill this year, so we don't risk losing potential replacements for our starters in the future

 

[patchick]

Yep, me too. That's why some guys might have to foot a bill this year, so we don't risk losing potential replacements for our starters in the future

At safety in particular, does anybody see young prospects with enough starting potential to be worth depriving this year's team of Duron Harmon? I really don't.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Yep, me too. That's why some guys might have to foot a bill this year, so we don't risk losing potential replacements for our starters in the future

We'll see. I'm not expecting a Mankins, Sey or Milloy move this year.

..but I've said that before

 

[Vatahala]

I know hindsight is 20/20 but why did Chase Winovich last to the 3rd round?

 

[JayNM]

At safety in particular, does anybody see young prospects with enough starting potential to be worth depriving this year's team of Duron Harmon? I really don't.

For this year, maybe putting J. Jones more as the 3rd S, which could translate to one more open spot for another CB. Maybe even try Brooks as the last safety (his 40 yard dash numbers is 4.37, so he can be fast...). But i get your point, there isn't a clear cut substitute

Tbh, I don't like Harmon as much as some. His biggest trait is that he is clutch, but some of his most memorable interceptions are result of deflections by someone and he was in the area.

Don't get me wrong, he needs to put himself in good positions for that, but i don't think it's deniable that there's some luck envolved (ex. Bounce of the ball) and perhaps, just perhaps, the fact that he was close to where the ball is, means that he was late to get to the ball itself!

The biggest problem is that I think Harmon gets beat way more often that most remember, but because he seems to show up in end, we never get a bad taste about him. I honestly don't think replacing him would be too hard or, better yet, I don't think he's undeniably a lock

 

[n6249c]

Meyers >>> Harmon
Stidham >>> Haskins

Where is the “well, DUH!” icon?

 

[n6249c]

Look at the organizations, from ownership on down...one is a model to be emulated and the other is a poster child for what not to do........

Another post where I need the “well, duh!” Icon.

 

[Ring 6]

With the amount of pieces we've got, with so many young players rising up in so many position that we are aging...

I think there's a good chance we end up with some decent veterans getting cut (Or traded, but it's not as easy as some might think)... Rex, Duron Harmon, Pennel/Shelton/Butler...

My mentality is simply to maximize long term with the depth of the team. Next year we've got a lot of players going into FA AND our core is aging, with most of them going over 30 now. Perhaps would be wiser to lose a bit of current capacity on our Backups and 3rd stringers to make sure we can properly replace parts in the future.

Are we really comfortable releasing young players who are showing promise only to get 1 or 2 years of OK playing by guys who aren't on the field all that much?

me thinks this year's cuts are going to be very hard. In more recent ears, it was clear cut which players were deserving to continue because we haven't been having a huuuge success drafting. This year is completely different.

PS - BB proves time and time again that he uses a lot of Economics' thought in his roster mgmt. Not long ago he had a draft with 4 picks or so it was because he knew he could ride the roster he had for some years. This year he went with more picks and I don't think that's a coincidence.

He knows he needs to start thinking about 2020 and beyond now.

It’s very rare that young players who aren’t good enough to contribute ever develop into good players.
I read your post as if to say keep a guy who can’t play today because in the future he could become a star.
We have a very good case study in practice squads. Largely practice squad players never really contribute or at best become JAGs.
There could be an outlier but it sounds like you are suggesting a pattern and multiple players. I wouldn’t diminish this years team for that long shot, at least outside of a special individual case.

 

[Ring 6]

At safety in particular, does anybody see young prospects with enough starting potential to be worth depriving this year's team of Duron Harmon? I really don't.

I see reclamation projects. However some people think the unknown is always great potential. Obi and brooks have had opportunities in the NFL just like Harmon. Only one has been a good safety.

 

[Ring 6]

I definitely don't mean to cut any Starter - by starter i mean the top players, snap wise, in each position - just so Im clear. I agree that they are still producing

Can you give examples of players you think fit in to the category of making the roster due to potential despite not being one of the best 53 today, and examples of the veterans you feel should be considered among those that go to keep the youngsters?

 

[patchick]

Can you give examples of players you think fit in to the category of making the roster due to potential despite not being one of the best 53 today, and examples of the veterans you feel should be considered among those that go to keep the youngsters?

I think the likeliest example is keeping Cowart over Pennel or Butler. Cowart is very much about potential, IMO.

 

[1960Pats]

Who is Jakob Johnson? And who this linebacker Munson??

Since I don't follow college the rookies are all new to me. The Pats rookies look pretty good.

 

[ALP]

it seems meyers is the saints colston from years ago

i think colston went in 7th round, and right away the dude owned TC and PS, and by game 1 he was towards the top of the saints depth chart...we have more good WRs right now than the saints did then, but with how Meyers has played, i can see him being near the top of our depth chart too, which is almost unbelievable to think about

and as we know colston went to have like a 10 year career where he was a top 5 or so WR

 

[Ring 6]

I think the likeliest example is keeping Cowart over Pennel or Butler. Cowart is very much about potential, IMO.

Compared to butler I don’t think you are sacrificing anything for the role.
Compared to Pennel you can cut many other players in order to keep Cowart because even though they are listed at the same position on the roster sheet they truly play different positions.

I think we got lucky last year that guy stepped up playing a role that really isn’t what he is best suited for


As I see the DT roles we need:
1) A giant run stuffed (wilfork, Branch etc)(a double team eater)
2) a big more versatile DT better playing on the G than the C (not as adept at eating double teams)
3) a guy who backups up both 1 and 2, somewhat of each. This guy actually could end up playing the most snaps because he is playing both roles.
4) a smaller guy who can rush the passer but struggles in straight up run d

Last year Brown was 2. Guy is best as 3.
Shelton should have been 1.
Ultimately Guy and Brown shared 1 and 2, both not being used to their best ability. Butler was 3, also in the wrong role out if necessity.

I think this year Pennell and guy are 1 and 2. We don’t really have a 3 but Shelton is “backup 1” meaning we can play any 2 of the 3 together.

Butler and Cowart are in competition but could easily both make the team.

I would be very against eliminating one of the 3 true DTs to carry 2 “4s”.

 

[JayNM]

It’s very rare that young players who aren’t good enough to contribute ever develop into good players.
I read your post as if to say keep a guy who can’t play today because in the future he could become a star.
We have a very good case study in practice squads. Largely practice squad players never really contribute or at best become JAGs.
There could be an outlier but it sounds like you are suggesting a pattern and multiple players. I wouldn’t diminish this years team for that long shot, at least outside of a special individual case.

I guess we disagree on the bolded part. Like always, there is still 2 weeks of Pre-Season so much can change, but Im talking about guys that are showing enough to prove to me that they can play today. Some examples:

Brooks, Krossen/Dawson, Munson (after last game, at least), Calhoun/Rivers (Ive seen plenty of people putting one or another), Cowart, One Extra OL, Gunner (or Berrios, although I don't think he has the potential...). Obviosuly Im not including the rookies that have already showed enough to stick

Basically comes down to one question: From here on, which players can give the most return, not only this year, but on following years as well? That's the mentality Im going for

 

[Marqui]

I think this year Pennell and guy are 1 and 2

Pennels probably not even going to make the team.