OBJ to Pats—what do we think?

[libra957]

He just signed a massive contract with the giants, highly unlikely to happen.

 

[edkk323]

If the team trades for OBJ, they obviously are not concerned about his personality. Fans should be elated if it happens.

 

[Love The Drake]

What if we believe Lock has Mahommes potential?
I feel that you need to have a guy ready to go and I think Bill will agree.

 

[SBLIII]

What if we believe Lock has Mahommes potential?
I feel that you need to have a guy ready to go and I think Bill will agree.

Drew is going top 10. Plus he would have to sit 3 years. Not resourcefulness nowadays.

 

[Love The Drake]

Drew is going top 10. Plus he would have to sit 3 years. Not resourcefulness nowadays.

Let's see.
We find so many good players late the franchise QBS aside from Romo Brady are almost always top 10 picks if we feel we need to have that and the amount of picks we have this maybe the best time to move for that guy.
I don't pretend to know what Bill is thinking but a player like Lock with 2 to 3 years in the system to be ready to go Aaron Rodgers situation again maybe more valuable.
It all comes down to the draft board and where Bill sees value and the trade partners.
All very exciting stuff.
Let's say Gronk straps up for 2 more seasons and Devin gives it another 1 to 2 years, then I feel like receiver Tight end and D line are the biggest needs.
Jamison Crowder looks like a perfect fit for this offense.
Beckham maybe but I don't like his attitude and I don't like him for a role model for Gordon.
We need to be very careful who we bring around that man.
So I say get a stud QB to sit it will motivate Tom even more.
Sign Crowder and Conley to fill in receivers.
If you cant sign Flowers tag and trade maybe?
Obviously yes he should be team captain and if you aren't going to pay Flowers who do you pay?
However Tre isn't worth top 5 defender money.
I'd argue top 20.

 

[SBLIII]

If you cant sign Flowers tag and trade maybe?
Obviously yes he should be team captain and if you aren't going to pay Flowers who do you pay?
However Tre isn't worth top 5 defender money.
I'd argue top 20.

I wouldn't expect us to be just set on TF no matter what. Set a max what we are willing to pay like 15 APY and if it gets beyond that let him go, collect the 2020 3rd round pick. Then lookout for other edge options on the market; Zadarius Smith, Preston Smith, Shaquill Barrett etc. Plus draft a DE relatively early.

But I am gonna trust BB no matter what. We were fine without Chandler Jones (plus Jamie Collins) and people expected us to be in trouble. Sheard and Chris Long stepped up. I expect us to be fine with and without Flowers. A plan will be in place. Hope we re-sign him though.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Edelman is 33 in May.

Are we really arguing that adding an elite receiver is a bad thing because we already have JE11? This offense is very close to being among the worst in the league when it comes to skill players. Edelman, Gronkowski, Gordon. Amendola (if he came back), and Hogan (if he came back) all have significant doubts about their long-term and even short-term effectiveness. Of all those players, I don’t think any are in the NFL in 2021.

The Patriots don’t like to invest high picks at WR because their offense is difficult to understand intellectually, so there’s a much bigger bust rate. I call it the Chad Jackson Effect.

This would be the time when some of these fantasy trades would actually make sense. AJ Green, OBJ, Julio Jones, Mike Evans...I think these, and some others, are all players the Patriots would be willing to pay a lot of draft capital for. Targeting guys in their second contract (contracts are reasonable because original team still pays signing bonus) whose teams need massive rebuilds.

 

[Love The Drake]

I wouldn't expect us to be just set on TF no matter what. Set a max what we are willing to pay like 15 APY and if it gets beyond that let him go, collect the 2020 3rd round pick. Then lookout for other edge options on the market; Zadarius Smith, Preston Smith, Shaquill Barrett etc. Plus draft a DE relatively early.

But I am gonna trust BB no matter what. We were fine without Chandler Jones (plus Jamie Collins) and people expected us to be in trouble. Sheard and Chris Long stepped up. I expect us to be fine with and without Flowers. A plan will be in place. Hope we re-sign him though.[/QUOTE
I 100 percent agree.
Then there is the Schiano and Biliemma factor the defense will have new voices and how will the players respond to that?
I am excited about our secondary is Devin and to a lesser extent Jason comes back it is elite.
I'm excited about the backers all of a sudden BB looks crazy like a fox for sticking with Roberts.
Van Noy is perfect for the D and a healthy Hightower is a difference maker.
D line we could be without Brown,Shelton,Flowers potentially.
That's alot of holes to fill.
DeMarcus Lawrence is not leaving Dallas which makes Clowney and Flowers the two top players at that position.
We know the dumb money that is thrown around on d line.
I love the idea of Zadarius Smith.
I like bringing back Shelton as a space eater but no more than 2.5 mill if so the league is full of fatty d line waiting by their phone to ring.
Would Beckham be quiet if he feels he is open Brady goes elsewhere with the ball pass is incomplete and we lose?
Or will he open his mouth when mics go in his face?
How many people have been friends with someone then had them as a co-worker and or boss and go man that guy is a prick?
It happens because they see each other as friends dont mean Odell is ready to put the work in be humble when it calls for it.
Be a leader when the team is down.
Maybe Tom Rob and Jules can bring that out of him but it is a huge gamble with a 1st rounder and realatively high cap number.
I'm not 100 percent comfortable with that.
In BB we trust when it comes to this team.

 

[varjao]

I don't.

The Patriots have successfully shifted towards a power running / playaction football team and the NFL isn't ready for it.

In the last 5 games NE has averaged 178 rushing yards, 439 yards of offense and outgained opponents by 176 yards per game.

Michel will be a beast next year, they'll add another power RB and a deep threat for PA. Pats will also add some nice DL talent through the draft.

I see a good 3 year window.

I agree with this. I don't think it would be absurd to think BB will draft another RB higher in the draft (not 1st though) to pair with Michel and have a RBBC system composed by elite backs. The Patriots ignored the position for too many years and I think BB knows that, fortunately, that didn't cost SB wins since we won 2 in that time span (Seahawks and Falcons) with mediocre RB play from a rushing standpoint, I know Shane Vereen and James White balled the hell out in those games but as receivers.

But now times are different, about Brady, in my opinion there's been a decline, and if the deep ball wasn't a strength in this offense in recent years, there's no point in changing that mindset now. I say dink and dunk the hell out of them and run the ball all over them.

I think the Patriots are pretty well setup for this draft, like they haven't been in years. Solid roster, rookies that didn't play last year coming back and good draft ammo. I thought this was the year to spend a 1st on a WR or maybe two 2nds, or a 2nd and a 3rd and double dip in the position. I still think they should do something on these lines but given the way the offense is playing, I changed my mind.

I think the Patriots should trade up and get the best TE in the draft, and I think Gronk will be back. If they can agree to limit his role to stay more as a blocker and catch a pass here and there just like it happened in this playoff run, it reduces the beating he takes and kind of compensates for his contract not being what he deserves. I know BB doesn't "save" players once they are on the field they are there to play 100% but Gronk is special and BB is always trying to find that 2nd TE to revive the 2TE offense and failing, because no one can play like Hernandez did in this offense. So keep Gronk even in a reduced role.

A RBBC with Michel, Rookie, White and Burkhead is great. Jeremy Hill won't make the roster I think, given the way his knee bent I think he's on Stevan Ridley post surgery territory.

The Pats will probably spend a pick in a receiver and sign middle of the pack free agents, maybe trade for one. Bring Dola back and that's it.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Edelman is 33 in May.

Are we really arguing that adding an elite receiver is a bad thing because we already have JE11? This offense is very close to being among the worst in the league when it comes to skill players. Edelman, Gronkowski, Gordon. Amendola (if he came back), and Hogan (if he came back) all have significant doubts about their long-term and even short-term effectiveness. Of all those players, I don’t think any are in the NFL in 2021.

This would be the time when some of these fantasy trades would actually make sense. AJ Green, OBJ, Julio Jones, Mike Evans...I think these, and some others, are all players the Patriots would be willing to pay a lot of draft capital for. Targeting guys in their second contract (contracts are reasonable because original team still pays signing bonus) whose teams need massive rebuilds.

I am thinking opposite. I would prefer to get the next Julian Edelman rather than OBJ, Jones, etc. I don’t know if this offense is really suited to those types.

 

[SBLIII]

I agree with this. I don't think it would be absurd to think BB will draft another RB higher in the draft (not 1st though) to pair with Michel and have a RBBC system composed by elite backs. The Patriots ignored the position for too many years and I think BB knows that, fortunately, that didn't cost SB wins since we won 2 in that time span (Seahawks and Falcons) with mediocre RB play from a rushing standpoint, I know Shane Vereen and James White balled the hell out in those games but as receivers.

But now times are different, about Brady, in my opinion there's been a decline, and if the deep ball wasn't a strength in this offense in recent years, there's no point in changing that mindset now. I say dink and dunk the hell out of them and run the ball all over them.

I think the Patriots are pretty well setup for this draft, like they haven't been in years. Solid roster, rookies that didn't play last year coming back and good draft ammo. I thought this was the year to spend a 1st on a WR or maybe two 2nds, or a 2nd and a 3rd and double dip in the position. I still think they should do something on these lines but given the way the offense is playing, I changed my mind.

I think the Patriots should trade up and get the best TE in the draft, and I think Gronk will be back. If they can agree to limit his role to stay more as a blocker and catch a pass here and there just like it happened in this playoff run, it reduces the beating he takes and kind of compensates for his contract not being what he deserves. I know BB doesn't "save" players once they are on the field they are there to play 100% but Gronk is special and BB is always trying to find that 2nd TE to revive the 2TE offense and failing, because no one can play like Hernandez did in this offense. So keep Gronk even in a reduced role.

A RBBC with Michel, Rookie, White and Burkhead is great. Jeremy Hill won't make the roster I think, given the way his knee bent I think he's on Stevan Ridley post surgery territory.

The Pats will probably spend a pick in a receiver and sign middle of the pack free agents, maybe trade for one. Bring Dola back and that's it.

Great post. As far as decline from Brady, I don't necessarily see it. I think this past year was a combination of lack of weapons and some unlucky bounces as well as offseason controversies (not attending OTA's etc.).

I think it's smart to shift the offense to power running and playaction because it fits the roster/offense very well but even if it sounds absurd I think TB12 is capable of playing at an MVP level at age 42.

With Edelman back in the lineup he had a 99 passer rating. With Edelman and Gordon he had a passer rating of 100.

It also felt like an unusual high number of deflections resulted in interceptions this year.

That's the one thing I noticed. 6 interceptions came from throws 0-10 yards off the LOS. Not downfield, so that's correctable.

Upgrade WR/TE with some more playmakers and Brady can still play like the best QB (or 2nd best for that matter if Mahomes can keep up his torrid pace somehow).

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I am thinking opposite. I would prefer to get the next Julian Edelman rather than OBJ, Jones, etc. I don’t know if this offense is really suited to those types.

OBJ can do everything that Edelman can do, along with breakaway speed. If he lined up primarily in the slot as Edelman did in the Super Bowl, he would also be juking defenders out of their jockstraps. I think you are underestimating the Patriots offensive staff and think they would bring these guys in to run deep post routes all game. They would be highly effective on multiple levels on the field, just as they are now (even if those plays aren't on SportsCenter Top 10s.) Also, you are really limiting yourself if you are only open to "the next Edelman," whatever that actually is.

 

[Love The Drake]

I'd rather keep the pick and sign

 

[SBLIII]

OBJ can do everything that Edelman can do, along with breakaway speed. If he lined up primarily in the slot as Edelman did in the Super Bowl, he would also be juking defenders out of their jockstraps. I think you are underestimating the Patriots offensive staff and think they would bring these guys in to run deep post routes all game. They would be highly effective on multiple levels on the field, just as they are now (even if those plays aren't on SportsCenter Top 10s.) Also, you are really limiting yourself if you are only open to "the next Edelman," whatever that actually is.

Definitely an enticing thought.

 

[Love The Drake]

And

 

[Love The Drake]

Or

 

[Love The Drake]

Honorable mention

 

[The Brandon Five]

Great post. As far as decline from Brady, I don't necessarily see it. I think this past year was a combination of lack of weapons and some unlucky bounces as well as offseason controversies (not attending OTA's etc.).

I think it's smart to shift the offense to power running and playaction because it fits the roster/offense very well but even if it sounds absurd I think TB12 is capable of playing at an MVP level at age 42.

With Edelman back in the lineup he had a 99 passer rating. With Edelman and Gordon he had a passer rating of 100.

It also felt like an unusual high number of deflections resulted in interceptions this year.

That's the one thing I noticed. 6 interceptions came from throws 0-10 yards off the LOS. Not downfield, so that's correctable.

Upgrade WR/TE with some more playmakers and Brady can still play like the best QB (or 2nd best for that matter if Mahomes can keep up his torrid pace somehow).

Flowers + Brown >>>>> OBJ

 

[SBLIII]

Flowers + Brown >>>>> OBJ

Yeah but it's not the same cap number. 25+ million for both and only 14 for Odell. I doubt we can fit in Flowers and Brown.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Trade for a franchise QB? We have Tom Effing Brady! He is not going away!

OBJ's cap hit next year would be 14m guys, not 17m.

Odell Beckham, Jr.

He costs the Giants 17m, but not the team that trades for him.

Based on the link you provided, that is not the case. He has a $21m cap charge to the Giants this year (base salary, workout bonus, signing bonus prorated). If traded, the signing bonus stays with the Giants but the rest comes to the Pats, which totals $17m. His 2020 cap charge to the Pats would be $14.25m. Then it’s 15.75m, 15m, and 15m thereafter.