Guregian on the Gronk/Belichick "beef".

[PP2]

Let's see what he's done to alter Tom's behavior:

He drinks two and a half gallons of filtered water per day and claims he’s so well hydrated his skin cannot be sunburned. Maybe it’s because every glass comes carefully laced with TB12 electrolytes, containing “72 trace minerals extracted from sea water” and available for just $15 per bottle.

Got that? His skin CANNOT be sunburned.

He sleeps in a pair of his own line of pyjamas that have print technology inside them reflecting “far infrared” which, somehow, promotes deeper sleep and simultaneously helps your body recover faster. Just $200 from Under Armour, as it happens.

Only $200. A steal!

Back to our friend Alex:

In 2004, back when he was styling himself Dr Alejandro Guerrero on infomercials, he was flogging Supreme Greens, a nutritional supplement he announced had cured 192 people of cancer and prevented arthritis, MS, Parkinson’s and even Aids. When the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) investigated it discovered none of the claims had any basis in scientific fact and, for good measure, Guerrero had only a masters in Chinese medicine from a defunct California school. He was banned for life from promoting supplements or calling himself a doctor.

Wow, he cured 192 people of cancer!!!

Ok, so he was a quack who preyed on cancer and AIDS victims who was convicted of fraud. But let's move on.

Then he came up with NeuroSafe, (that he sucked Tom into lending his name to), a wondrous concoction that Guerrero invented and marketed as “a seatbelt for the brain” because it contained minerals that allegedly promoted speedy recovery from concussion. A fantastic idea in a league with a brain injury problem except the FTC quickly forced them to withdraw it from sale because the ingredients did no such thing.

Sorry if I'm a little leery of our All World QB (who is miraculously defying time) paling around with this clown. The guy has ALL the hallmarks of a fraud and a conman, right down to insinuating himself into Brady's own family. He's practically his own cult.

So you think Guerrero has nothing to do with Brady's ability to play into his 40's?

 

[Sicilian]

So you think Guerrero has nothing to do with Brady's ability to play into his 40's?

I wouldn't say it's done "nothing", but Brady has been one of the hardest working, most driven athletes in the sport since he came into the league. Couple that with a highly protected position that can often times be more about mental preparation and aptitude, and I don't think playing consistently well in is 40's is something impossible without having to reinvent a training regimen.

I also think there's tremendous value to Tom BELIEVING it works. Whether it does or not, the placebo effect is a scientifically accepted phenomenon. If he thinks this method is making him play better, longer, then he'll be more willing to ignore or fight through the pains of the work he has to put in. Breaking down mentally is half of getting old.

 

[Kontradiction]

We know that BB banned Guerrero from the NE sideline because of conflicts with the Pats medical and training staff. Belichick is trying to keep him from the team. There is nothing that BB can say or do about Brady.

Gronk may be following the Pats medical advice, but is also still seeing Guerrero who has undermined the Pats training staff before.

Gronk looked very light last season and I wonder how that effected his blocking. Was he as good a blocker as in years past?

I didn’t see any evidence that Gronk’s blocking took a step back. Perhaps one of the all-22 guys can weigh in such as @luuked or @Tony2046? I would look at games in which the Pats rushed for 100+ yards and heavy formations (13, 12, and 22 personnel).

 

[Kontradiction]

Love that song. I was telling my far more musically adept nephew about it a few years back, and he was certain that that was Michelle Branch!! I was like: No. Perfectly understandable mistake ~ same Food Group, and all that ~ but it's Vanessa Carlton, I swear!!

The only reason I posted that is because it seemed like something that someone more interested in the “soap opera” would listen to. Maybe I should have posted this instead...

 

[luuked]

I didn’t see any evidence that Gronk’s blocking took a step back. Perhaps one of the all-22 guys can weigh in such as @luuked or @Tony2046? I would look at games in which the Pats rushed for 100+ yards and heavy formations (13, 12, and 22 personnel).

Definitely not from mid October onwards. Before the entire OL seemed out of sync at times and Brady was getting hit a lot. But I can’t remember Gronk standing out at all. He had that pretty bad KC game where people were wondering if the back surgery might have been too much.

But since he finished strong and was used the same way he has been used the years before I honestly don’t think it mattered at all. That doesn’t mean that the reports saying he was ineffective at times at camp are wrong though.

 

[borg]

Brady should just give Grumpy Bill some TB12 coupons for free massages and let the magic hands of Alex Guerrero .........

 

[Jackson 2]

I didn’t see any evidence that Gronk’s blocking took a step back. Perhaps one of the all-22 guys can weigh in such as @luuked or @Tony2046? I would look at games in which the Pats rushed for 100+ yards and heavy formations (13, 12, and 22 personnel).

I didn't see any evidence of a drop in his blocking effectiveness, either. I don't watch the all 22, but I do dvr every game and watch them all a second time. The second time, I try to watch stuff away from the ball, such as line play. He looked as good as ever blocking, to me.

 

[Triumph]

I didn’t see any evidence that Gronk’s blocking took a step back. Perhaps one of the all-22 guys can weigh in such as @luuked or @Tony2046? I would look at games in which the Pats rushed for 100+ yards and heavy formations (13, 12, and 22 personnel).

I would interested with their take if they know the plays called and blocking schemes.

 

[Kontradiction]

I would interested with their take if they know the plays called and blocking schemes.

You don’t need to know either of those two things to discern whether or not a guy has PHYSICALLY taken a step back as a blocker.

 

[rochrist]

So you think Guerrero has nothing to do with Brady's ability to play into his 40's?

Nobody knows. Certainly he isn't keeping every Pats player he's working with healthy. But in point of fact, the stuff that he does that is legitimate could be done with a thousand other trainers who aren't as shady as this guys is. And no, I don't think AG's concussion juice is keeping Brady healthy. Nor do I believe that AG has come up with a special formula of water that keeps Brady from getting sunburned. Resistance training isn't something Guerrero invented you know. This whole thing smells of an infomercial I'd see on TV at 3AM.

 

[Kdo5]

While I think it is reasonable for Bill to be bothered by some aspects of this issue, the way he seems to have gone about it was very poor. Calling Gronk out for that specifically in front of the team is just dumb and I hardly blame him if he has stewed about it.

 

[Triumph]

You don’t need to know either of those two things to discern whether or not a guy has PHYSICALLY taken a step back as a blocker.

Its time for you to come clean and let us all know what happened between BB and Gronk. Why does BB want Gronk to stay away from Guerrero?

You dont have to reveal sources inside the walls of Gillette..

 

[Jackson 2]

While I think it is reasonable for Bill to be bothered by some aspects of this issue, the way he seems to have gone about it was very poor. Calling Gronk out for that specifically in front of the team is just dumb and I hardly blame him if he has stewed about it.

Since August?

 

[Pats2000]

It’s not exactly a perfect record. Both Hightower and Edelman worked with Guerrero and ended up on IR.

Not much you can do with a weakened ACL like that. As hard as they cut and plant, if its partially torn or weakened and you don't know about it to fix it, it's going to tear.

 

[Kontradiction]

Its time for you to come clean and let us all know what happened between BB and Gronk. Why does BB want Gronk to stay away from Guerrero?

You dont have to reveal sources inside the walls of Gillette..

Hitting up a meth wake and bake again, are we?

 

[luuked]

While I think it is reasonable for Bill to be bothered by some aspects of this issue, the way he seems to have gone about it was very poor. Calling Gronk out for that specifically in front of the team is just dumb and I hardly blame him if he has stewed about it.

I completely disagree with this. Chewing leaders out in front of the team has been BBs MO for his entire tenure with the team. The daily sessions of "low lights" each morning of training camp in front of the entire team are pretty much legendary at this point. It sets a tone of accountability in the locker room and nobody had any issue with it so far but instead most fans were jerking off about how much of a leader Brady is for accepting this kind of hard coaching.

If the reports that Gronk was ineffective early in camp are true -- and is no reason to doubt them given that they come from the best beat people -- then I am not surprised it happened and more annoyed that Gronk had an issue with it after observing stuff like that occurring repeatedly over the last years. You would expect a bit more mental toughness from someone like him.

 

[zoostation]

Poor Gwonky got his feewing hurt by mean old BB.

What a bunch of crap. Is this a sewing bee or a football team.

I couldn't agree more. STFU and get your ass back in the huddle Gwonk. Am I missing something??? This is still football right? Awww no fun. Please

 

[PP2]

I wouldn't say it's done "nothing", but Brady has been one of the hardest working, most driven athletes in the sport since he came into the league. Couple that with a highly protected position that can often times be more about mental preparation and aptitude, and I don't think playing consistently well in is 40's is something impossible without having to reinvent a training regimen.

I also think there's tremendous value to Tom BELIEVING it works. Whether it does or not, the placebo effect is a scientifically accepted phenomenon. If he thinks this method is making him play better, longer, then he'll be more willing to ignore or fight through the pains of the work he has to put in. Breaking down mentally is half of getting old.

Well that's what real life is- nothing is ever truly black or white. That's what you're confronted with. Guerrero may or may not have anything to do with extending Brady's career although there is a preponderance of evidence pointing that way.

So do you try and mess that up, or just leave it be? You have a conflict of philosophy in the weight room- more than one way to deal with that effectively, and the worse thing you can do is call someone out in front of the team and in a derisive manner.

It's one thing to call someone out for making a mental mistake on the field or underachieving, but to call someone out derisively is bad management 101. It achieves absolutely nothing, but you can bet that people don't forget slights like that.

 

[luuked]

You don’t need to know either of those two things to discern whether or not a guy has PHYSICALLY taken a step back as a blocker.

Just FYI in the most current QuickSlants (podcast) episode Perry and Curran both are on the record that Gronk looked embarrassing during the early portions of camp. According to Curran Gronk even confirmed that wording during their December interview. Our TE was getting pancaked during run blocking consistently.

And this ended up on the lowlights tape that the players all get to see each morning of camp. BB chewed Gronk out over this.

I fail to see what BB did wrong. You have a TE that was the best blocker and receiving option in the league for many years. He changes his entire approach to strength training and suddenly becomes useless in blocking. Criticizing that new way is absolutely fair game.

Now I also get Gronks initial frustration over it because reportedly he felt a lot better physically and thought that he was still transitioning to get back to being himself. But he has to understand that the bottomline is that there was never any guarantee that he would actually return to being his dominant self using only the Guerrero bands and whatever weight work he allows. And the coaching staff has to manage the full team and do what is best for this entire group and not just the feelings of a single player.

As we have been discussing for 4-5 months now this entire Guerrero thing is all about authority. People around here seem to focus too much on that "he is a quack" angle or how it all works for Brady.

And to get back to the QuickSlants episode (which is absolutely worth a listen).. Mayo said that you can't possible do both: the classic BB/Cabrera weight approach and the Guerrero bands approach at the same time with a full buy in. And if you see your 9M TE getting pancaked during runblocking repeatedly after he changed his routine away from the classic way which you have been preaching forever you will bring this up.

 

[PP2]

Nobody knows. Certainly he isn't keeping every Pats player he's working with healthy. But in point of fact, the stuff that he does that is legitimate could be done with a thousand other trainers who aren't as shady as this guys is. And no, I don't think AG's concussion juice is keeping Brady healthy. Nor do I believe that AG has come up with a special formula of water that keeps Brady from getting sunburned. Resistance training isn't something Guerrero invented you know. This whole thing smells of an infomercial I'd see on TV at 3AM.

So do you throw out the baby with the bathwater? How do you know where one thing ends and another begins?

As it is, although Gronk began TC poorly, he ended the season on a high note and his highlight catches are stuff he would not have done without an increased degree of flexibility.

And just so you know, that ******** claim about drinking water to avoid sunburn comes from the ESPN profile on Brady.

Yes, that's right. ESPN.

As in the same ESPN with a personal vendetta against Brady.

Every day, he wakes up at 6 in the morning and immediately drinks 20 ounces of purified water, augmented with TB12 electrolytes, which, as he tells us, contain the "72 trace minerals" generally lost in perspiration. As a result, he says, he is so well-hydrated that "even with adequate exposure to the sun, I won't get sunburned," and he presumes that the muscles under his skin look like "beautiful tenderloins" instead of "shriveled jerky."

Beautiful tenderloins? ************ almighty.