Guregian on the Gronk/Belichick "beef".

[rochrist]

I’ve been neutral on this forum to the whole Brady/Guerrero/Gronk v. BB. Hoping eventually story would just go away & football would be talked about more around here (Kudos to Mgteich for sparking football discussion).

Now I’m getting annoyed.

Brady may have had the best age-adjusted season in sports history. Gronk played the whole season and his circus ground catch vs. Pitt does not happen without Guerrero’s methods. Now Alex is attempting to save Malcolm Mitchell’s career.

Maybe just cool it Bill for a minute & let the trainer who’s assisting in us having the two best players on the best offense on the field playing at their best do his work with the offensive skill guys? Worry about the defense.

Assertion without facts in evidence. You have no idea whether Guerrero is responsible or not, and if he is to what degree. For that matter, you don't know that he isn't slipping them some illegal concoction that the league hasn't caught up with yet. The guy is a pretty shady character. If I were Kraft I'd think once, twice and three times before letting my name and the team's name get tied to him.

 

[Chevy]

Brady has been with Guerrero for a long time, and until recently there has been nothing from the media suggesting there is an issue with this. I wonder if, due to how well it has worked for Brady, Guerrero's influence over other players has grown to where he may be encouraging them to go against team protocol. It could be that banning him from team trips was a necessary step in maintaining the control and consistency BB values so much. Now, with a another marquis player joining the TB12 team, BB sees the good order and discipline of his team being threatened by an outside source he cannot control.

 

[TBR]

If I were Belichick, given the way the league is always eyeing them for anything that they can even pretend is shady, the last freaking guy in the world I'd want without a thousand light years of my team is that snake oil witch doctor.

He's not even selling a "snake oil" or unique product with magical claims any more.

That's irrelevant to everything else he does.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

He's not even selling a "snake oil" or unique product with magical claims any more.

True. He gets Tom to do that for him.

 

[ausbacker]

True. He gets Tom to do that for him.

I don't have a problem with TB12 and other athletes seeking external treatment and running with value add activities (on their own time) provided it doesn't interfere with the programs run by the people paying their salaries.

 

[rochrist]

He's not even selling a "snake oil" or unique product with magical claims any more.

That's irrelevant to everything else he does.

Once a grifter, always a grifter.

 

[TBR]

True. He gets Tom to do that for him.

Yikes. There's nothing proprietary about the "TB 12 method".

Sharing your eating and exercising habits doesn't qualify as "snake oil".

 

[TBR]

Once a grifter, always a grifter.

Sounds like you have a lack of an argument against his current practice.

 

[rochrist]

Let's see what he's done to alter Tom's behavior:

He drinks two and a half gallons of filtered water per day and claims he’s so well hydrated his skin cannot be sunburned. Maybe it’s because every glass comes carefully laced with TB12 electrolytes, containing “72 trace minerals extracted from sea water” and available for just $15 per bottle.

Got that? His skin CANNOT be sunburned.

He sleeps in a pair of his own line of pyjamas that have print technology inside them reflecting “far infrared” which, somehow, promotes deeper sleep and simultaneously helps your body recover faster. Just $200 from Under Armour, as it happens.

Only $200. A steal!

Back to our friend Alex:

In 2004, back when he was styling himself Dr Alejandro Guerrero on infomercials, he was flogging Supreme Greens, a nutritional supplement he announced had cured 192 people of cancer and prevented arthritis, MS, Parkinson’s and even Aids. When the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) investigated it discovered none of the claims had any basis in scientific fact and, for good measure, Guerrero had only a masters in Chinese medicine from a defunct California school. He was banned for life from promoting supplements or calling himself a doctor.

Wow, he cured 192 people of cancer!!!

Ok, so he was a quack who preyed on cancer and AIDS victims who was convicted of fraud. But let's move on.

Then he came up with NeuroSafe, (that he sucked Tom into lending his name to), a wondrous concoction that Guerrero invented and marketed as “a seatbelt for the brain” because it contained minerals that allegedly promoted speedy recovery from concussion. A fantastic idea in a league with a brain injury problem except the FTC quickly forced them to withdraw it from sale because the ingredients did no such thing.

Sorry if I'm a little leery of our All World QB (who is miraculously defying time) paling around with this clown. The guy has ALL the hallmarks of a fraud and a conman, right down to insinuating himself into Brady's own family. He's practically his own cult.

 

[Off The Grid]

Again, the Herald article says, "according to a source".

Not questioning that BB called Gronk out, but I'd love to get some more context here...what exactly did BB say for instance....

I was wondering when someone was gonna bring that up!!

Bill II ain't Bill I.

Parcels berated people.

Mad Bill? He's far more likely to bust balls. "Way to compete." ~ to Welker, remember?

It's the difference between belittling people...and challenging them.

So say Gronk drops a couple Passes or something...

Mad Bill's less likely to dress Gronkowski down, a la Parcels, and far more likely to say "Nice hands, Gronk. That New Age training is doing you wonders."

Everyone has a chuckle, and they move on to the next play.

I think that it's very possible that Mad Bill ~ his genuine reservations about Guerrero's methodology not withstanding ~ was just busting balls, and that Gronk took it as just busting balls...but that some "source" lost the intention in translation.

 

[Off The Grid]

I was listening to this song when I posted the thread...

Love that song. I was telling my far more musically adept nephew about it a few years back, and he was certain that that was Michelle Branch!! I was like: No. Perfectly understandable mistake ~ same Food Group, and all that ~ but it's Vanessa Carlton, I swear!!

 

[primetime]

Hey you guys want some magical TB12 water

 

[Off The Grid]

Karen Guregian is solid, but I'm seeing a whole lotta folks take it for granted that Gronk is actually in a twist...Yet all we have is an allegation from an anonymous "source."

Does Gronk seem like the kind of guy to get in a twist about anything?

 

[RhodyPatriot]

When/if Gronk and Brady are gone we'll see who was behind the success. I trust Bill when he says that coaches don't win game, players do. He's right, especially in the case of Brady. Every win the Pats had in the SB was by the hair of their chinnie chin chins. Without Brady most of those wins wouldn't happen.

Without Adam Vinatieri most of those wins don't happen.
Without Malcolm Butler, without Julian Edelman, without James White...without, without, without......
This teams success has been about so much more than Tom Brady.

 

[Jackson 2]

Karen Guregian is solid, but I'm seeing a whole lotta folks take it for granted that Gronk is actually in a twist...Yet all we have is an allegation from an anonymous "source."

Does Gronk seem like the kind of guy to get in a twist about anything?

Until very recently, my response to your question would have been an emphatic "No!" Now, I'm not so sure. In fact, I'd now say, It sure seems that way. "

 

[Jackson 2]

Without Adam Vinatieri most of those wins don't happen.
Without Malcolm Butler, without Julian Edelman, without James White...without, without, without......
This teams success has been about so much more than Tom Brady.

To me, Brady has been more responsible than any other player, but you're correct in that the contributions of many others were essential to securing those wins.

 

[Soliel]

Guerro should run the whole league. Fire goodell

Everyone should be required to drink the magic water too

 

[Triumph]

I highly doubt Gronk did anything like that. Based on all reports, he’s been nothing but a consummate pro with this team.

We know that BB banned Guerrero from the NE sideline because of conflicts with the Pats medical and training staff. Belichick is trying to keep him from the team. There is nothing that BB can say or do about Brady.

Gronk may be following the Pats medical advice, but is also still seeing Guerrero who has undermined the Pats training staff before.

Gronk looked very light last season and I wonder how that effected his blocking. Was he as good a blocker as in years past?

 

[Sicilian]

I don't credit Bill with any blame in this. He was being true to his nature and his well proven philosophy of team building. Where I might offer some constructive criticism, if he is listening, is that I would have had a sit down with Gronk this off season to attempt to iron it out, man to man. OR at least tell him to toughen the f*ck up and stop being such a millennial.

And for all we know, they DID do that this offseason. I highly doubt that conversation would be transcripted and posted for public consumption. Every article I read on this subject, even from respected writers like Guregian and Curran, seem to point to incidents that happened early in the season. There's a lot that's probably happened since then.

 

[Triumph]

According to the Boston Sports Journal, Belichick wasn't happy with the fact that some players were taking Guerrero's training advice over the advice that they were being given by the Patriots' medical staff.

Things apparently got so bad this season that Belichick actually stripped trainer Guerrero of many of his team privileges. According to the Boston Globe, Guerrero has been banned "from boarding Patriots jets. His sideline access has been revoked. And he no longer is permitted to treat players other than Brady in his exclusive office at Gillette Stadium."

Tom Brady's controversial trainer releases statement, appears to snub Belichick