Training camp starts Thursday!

[Wordsmyth]

This delivery dude i know from work...his son's going. Trying not to be envious.

 

[Huckleberry1]

While its true that BB's winning % with Patriots w/o TB is only slightly above .500 (19-18) the 5-11 was in his first year when new culture was only being introduced..

Belichick restructured the team's personnel department in the offseason, and later proclaimed that the team "could not win with 40 good players while the other team has 53," after a number of players showed up out of shape for the start of training camp.

From 2001 Pats are 14-7 w/o Brady . which is not too far from their average win % in last 16 yrs. That doesn't take anything away from Brady's GOAT record but to suggest that BB would never win anything without a player he drafted in the 6th round and then made him the player (and somewhat the person) he is (according to TB himself) and made him part of the teams he created year after year is really excessive and futile.

Calling somebody stupid for contributing his own thoughts on subjective matters . and simply arguing team records are more about team than individuals (which again TB would be the first to say so himself) in the ultimate team sport ..?

Calling Brady a JAG is stupid, and that's exactly what he did. Furthermore he said I was "full of sh.t" if I thought Belichick was an under .500 coach without Brady, and guess what?, Belichick is an under .500 coach without Brady. Cherry pick all you want but that is a fact.

I believe Belichick is the GOAT, and Brady is as well, but remove either one and the dynasty is over. That's not saying either couldn't be successful without the other, only that the Dynasty requires the presence of both. And for anyone to pretend that either is incidental to their success is monumental stupidity, and that is exactly what I was addressing.

 

[PatsWSB47]

Calling Brady a JAG is stupid, and that's exactly what he did. Furthermore he said I was "full of sh.t" if I thought Belichick was an under .500 coach without Brady, and guess what?, Belichick is an under .500 coach without Brady. Cherry pick all you want but that is a fact.

I believe Belichick is the GOAT, and Brady is as well, but remove either one and the dynasty is over. That's not saying either couldn't be successful without the other, only that the Dynasty requires the presence of both. And for anyone to pretend that either is incidental to their success is monumental stupidity, and that is exactly what I was addressing.

So I agree with you that both probably wouldn't have the same success without the other but being a 500 coach with only a 38 game sample size, most from his early years as a head coach, is kind if misleading. It takes the focus away from your argument. Both have gotten better over time.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I'm not pretending he's JAG any more than any other player in the league ever. .

That's the definition of JAG

 

[Huckleberry1]

So I agree with you that both probably wouldn't have the same success without the other but being a 500 coach with only a 38 game sample size, most from his early years as a head coach, is kind if misleading. It takes the focus away from your argument. Both have gotten better over time.

I don't disagree, however my initial response came when "miloofcroton" said I was "full of sh.t" if I thought Belichick was an under .500 coach without Brady," and the fact of the matter is that he is.

 

[Huckleberry1]

To be fair I think 2008 is a better estimate of where this team would be without Brady than using Belichick's career stats in Cleveland.

I don't disagree with that, but my response was to a poster saying "you are full of sh.t if you think Belichick is an under .500 coach without Belichick." Fact-Belichick is under .500 without Brady.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I don't think anyone's legacy is locked in by a championship (or group of them). Following first principles, the legacy belongs to the team. Everyone else merely has a legacy by association.

Tom Brady is the only player in NFL history to win two Super Bowl's with 52 different player's around him.

Bill Belichick is the only coach to win two Super Bowl's with a QB with 52 separate player's around him.

Bill Belichick and Tom Brady are the only coach and QB to win Super Bowl's 10 year's apart.

Bill Belichick and Tom Brady are the primary reasons for the Patriots Dynasty,

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

I remember what,.. 2-3 years ago? Joint practices with the Eagles. The place was mobbed! Half were Eagle fans. I had a hard time finding a spot even on the little hill

If you want a good football movie, check out The Junction Boys.

I like Trouble Along the Way with the Duke

 

[PatsBoy12]

What an exciting time indeed!

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

TOMORROW

 

[Ring 6]

Meh, the only football thing that would be worthy of a hallelujah is if the NYJFL* imploded and the corrupt 32 and NYJFL* office were imprisoned for life.

Then there would be no patriots.

 

[Ring 6]

I don't think anyone's legacy is locked in by a championship (or group of them). Following first principles, the legacy belongs to the team. Everyone else merely has a legacy by association.

If you asked Belichick, I bet he'd say something similar.

That said, I am stoked for this year!

You can't change the rules by adding "following first principles" as if everyone much less anyone does that.


The franchise has a legacy. The coach had a legacy. Each player has their own legacy.
Tom Brady has the greatest legacy but even Ryan leaf had one as well. It's just a very bad one.

 

[FCB02062]

Can't wait for the "insert player who will be cut in 2 weeks" looked great in 7 on 7 drills and really could challenge "insert recent high draft pick or established veteran" reports from Mike Giardi....

 

[Wheelman]

Then there would be no patriots.

I don't care, some things are just more important. I've said it before If we just all(the whole world) agree to stop watching the NYJFL* I'd do it in a heartbeat. I wouldn't care if Brady only won 3 super bowls. They're such a corrupt organization they need to fall.

 

[Ring 6]

I don't care, some things are just more important. I've said it before If we just all(the whole world) agree to stop watching the NYJFL* I'd do it in a heartbeat. I wouldn't care if Brady only won 3 super bowls. They're such a corrupt organization they need to fall.

So why are you here?
You are happy if everyone gives it up but won't give it up unless everyone does?
If I understood you right that is a very curious attitude.

 

[Wheelman]

So why are you here?
You are happy if everyone gives it up but won't give it up unless everyone does?
If I understood you right that is a very curious attitude.

I'm just here to watch the two GOATS. Then I'm gone. If only I stop it won't do any damage to them. But if everyone does together it will.