Not to make another Brady v Rodgers thread but

[bormio]

Its crazy because Brady actually did win 5 SBs

Who is better? The guy who could have won 5 SBs? Or the guy who did?

Manning got 1 of his SB solely due to the quality of his defense.

 

[robbomango]

Rodgers had a down year in 2015, his offense ranked 15th in scoring, Brady's offense over the last 7 years has ranked no lower than 4th in scoring and that was once, in 2013 with a ravage of injuries they were 3rd in scoring while the pack were at 8th.

QB's need to score points and win games, statistically over the years the Pats have been better in both categories than the Packers at that.

 

[doesntmatter1]

Brady is the only qb that has shown the ability to win without a running game whatsoever or just abandon it from the start. Rodgers struggles like most qbs when the ground game isn't working. Rodgers sb run came at a time when James Starks was very hot. I don't want to be an Aaron Rodgers hater, but I think he just isn't mentally elite.

 

[Ring 6]

Its crazy because Brady actually did win 5 SBs

Who is better? The guy who could have won 5 SBs? Or the guy who did?

Exactly. He is right it's the madden era.
People actually want to rate players by how they think they would do in a made up world.

 

[Joker]

Exactly. He is right it's the madden era.
People actually want to rate players by how they think they would do in a made up world.

been beating this dead horse since the turn of the century....call me a dinosaur but I cannot stand "fantasy" anything...it's pure narcissism afaic...

 

[TennisBallHead]

Brady has never lost a playoff game where he's played great (like Rodgers 09 game against ARI). That's the only playoff "edge" I'd give Rodgers. Brady's come back from absurd deficits, won close games, thrown 50+ times and won (unlike any other QB, EVER).

Just look at 2014. You think Rodgers would come back in either the BAL or SEA games?

 

[Nehalem]

Exactly. He is right it's the madden era.
People actually want to rate players by how they think they would do in a made up world.

The funny thing is that even imaginary land Manning is only as good as actual Brady.

Imaginary land Brady pretty easily has additional rings for 2006, 2007, 2011, 2015. And really you should probably throw in 2010 that was de-railed by the brainfart Jets game.

10 imaginary rings > 5 imaginary rings

Note: In the world in which Brady has 10 rings, manning has 0. Whereas when Manning has 5, Brady still at least has 2001 and 2016, since Manning wasn't even in the playoffs in those years.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Rodgers is becoming like Manning in some ways. If he is so good, why don't the Packers cut loose these elite receivers, invest in defense, and let Rodgers spin gold? We've seen the Patriots walk away from so many skill position players over the years, preferring to take lower cost players and make them better due to their quarterback. Rodgers, like Manning, gets everything he wants in order to maintain his statistical dominance.

Rodgers - $22M (and publicly stating he will get more)
Nelson - 12.5M
Cobb - 11.5M
Bennett - $7M

So $52M, roughly 1/3 of the salary cap, invested in Aaron Rodgers and his glamorous statistics. And plenty of complaints from Green Bay fans about the organization' failure to also field an elite defense. Rodgers won't take a pay cut. The Packers won't part with elite skill players. This is the salary cap era. Peyton Manning's Colts 2.0.

 

[Tony2046]

I just spoke with Joe Buck. He said "The Great" Aaron Rodgers is the best. "He once threw a pass to a wide open guy twenty yards downfield that no other QB in NFL history could have made."

The Great Aaron Rodgers was one of the league leaders in Time to Throw.



WR: "What's the play"
Aaron: "You go get open, I'll run around back here and throw it"


Don't get me wrong. Aaron Rodgers is a great QB and is fun to watch but just not better than Brady.

 

[Tony2046]

Found this breakdown by a Patsfan. What's interesting are the comments. Some guy under the name of "James White" goes to town.

 

[Ring 6]

Rodgers is becoming like Manning in some ways. If he is so good, why don't the Packers cut loose these elite receivers, invest in defense, and let Rodgers spin gold? We've seen the Patriots walk away from so many skill position players over the years, preferring to take lower cost players and make them better due to their quarterback. Rodgers, like Manning, gets everything he wants in order to maintain his statistical dominance.

Rodgers - $22M (and publicly stating he will get more)
Nelson - 12.5M
Cobb - 11.5M
Bennett - $7M

So $52M, roughly 1/3 of the salary cap, invested in Aaron Rodgers and his glamorous statistics. And plenty of complaints from Green Bay fans about the organization' failure to also field an elite defense. Rodgers won't take a pay cut. The Packers won't part with elite skill players. This is the salary cap era. Peyton Manning's Colts 2.0.

This is a great point.
By and large the patriots have tended to devote few resources (picks, cap space) to surrounding Brady with weapons. The obvious reason being that Brady is so good he gives you an elite offense by elevating decent weapons, so let's devote more resources to the positions Brady cannot impact, such as defense.

So to argue Brady's value should be diminished because of the defenses on his team is wrong. The patriots were able to use high picks and big cap space on defense BECAUSE OF BRADY. Had Manning or Rodgers been as able to be so great without being surrounded by exceptional skill
position players, there teams could have invested in defense.

Since Brady has become QB the patriots have had 14 first round picks. They have also had 4 years without a #1 so I will consider the first choice that year to be "their 1".
13 of the 18 were defensive players.
2 were OL
2 were TE
1 was a RB

The TE and RB were in 2002,2004,and 2006.
The patriots have not drafted a skill position player in round 1, or with their first pick since 2006, and in those 11 years the only first pick on the offensive did of the ball was nate solder.
So please try to use the defense against Brady because he himself is the primary reason they are able to built a good defense.

 

[Joker]

You are an NFL football fan. Ostensibly you are in it to see your team win Super Bowls. YOU prefer Manning over Brady. YOU are a SUB-MORON. I'm getting sick of all these idiots with next to zero capability to see the obvious constantly making these dumb, ridiculous rationalizations.

 

[borg]

Norv turner rated manning ahead of Brady because he thinks there might be a way that manning could have won 5 or6 SBs.
Crazy.

I love when "experts" give credit to their binkies for games they "would have" dominated in
Then there's the....
"If only Manning had more number ones on offense"

 

[RhodyPatriot]

Not like we have all that much to talk about for a week anyways.
A friend (who doesn't have bias against Brady) sent me the following text- how would you guys combat this? It certainly doesn't always work to say "5 rings" so...

"Look up his postseason stats he's not even a top 10 postseason QB. The ones that say he's pretty low in TDs/drive, pretty high in 3 and outs/drive, pretty high in punts/drive.

Yards per attempt career wise he's 28th.

Higher DVOA, DYAR

Rodgers ranks higher than him in all of the above. Plus, even the stats that he's really good at (like TD/INT ratio) Rodgers blows him out of the water "
While some of these are more "team" stats, Rodgers does appear to have the edge in most statistical categories. Game winning drives is not one of those though [/QUOTE

It's all about what you do when the game is on the line. Brady's SB stats in the 4th qtr are utterly ridiculous.
Beyond clutch!!
Another example: when all is said and done LeBron James will surpass Michael Jordan statistically in just about every area.
Yet Jordan is and will remain the gold standard. Jordan was big game, big moment clutch, ring winning clutch. James is not.
Same for Brady. He is the gold standard. He's clutch and he has the rings.
Aaron Rodgers is not even in the discussion as far as I'm concerned. Not even in the discussion.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

How many of these same blogs/articles can you have from Packers fans who pretend to be journalists. There's a new one every day and they say the same thing. This article is a real gem...it ignores that Brady was rated the best deep passer in the entire NFL last season, ignores that the Packers have $24M invested in outside receivers (Nelson and Cobb), and ignores that Rodgers ranks around 30th in the NFL in time to release the ball. Other than that, though, it is clear Rodgers is "the best" because of Brady's deficiencies with the deep ball,

Aaron Rodgers vs. Tom Brady: How the Patriots play to Brady’s strengths

They must have very short-term memories in Wisconsin. Now Aaron Rodgers is a superhuman idol who can do wrong. In October, he had played a 16 game stretch where he cracked a 100 passer rating just once and had a worse QB rating than Blake Bortles. But, hey, he said "run the table" before being almost as good as Brady the rest of the way.

Also, the Packers fans are now fully on the "weak AFC East" bandwagon, even though the Patriots have a higher winning percentage outside the division. Lions, Vikings, and Bears. Wow.

 

[Wheelman]

Even Rodgers leading the tying FG drive was not all it seemed. GB actually got into Seattle territory very fast, then they played for the FG. No killer instinct to go for the TD.

That's because they thought they had won the game. I'll never forget when Wilson got picked off for the last time(I think?) and Julius Peppers is telling the guy to go down, go down, go down. What a loser attitude that team had. Acting like they had won.

Oh yeah and Aaron "We beat ourselves" Rodgers said after the Falcons beatdown last post season, "I feel like we kinda hurt ourselves in the 1st half more than they really stopped us". That's right, Rodgers making excuses again. No Aaron, they stopped you! You just can't accept that the Falcons beat your asses.

Is that how a GOAT responds to a loss? We beat ourselves? How can he possibly be the GOAT when he keeps making excuses for the other team beating him?

 

[borg]

Where do all of these revered QBs buy their teflon?

In the past 2 regular seasons, Green Bay has scored 19 or fewer points 8 times.
During that same time period, Brady led Pats offenses scored 19 or fewer points once...the meaningless last game of 2015 vs Miami.

Only plausible conclusion: Rogers awesome / Brady a systems QB

 

[Ring 6]

This is a great point.
By and large the patriots have tended to devote few resources (picks, cap space) to surrounding Brady with weapons. The obvious reason being that Brady is so good he gives you an elite offense by elevating decent weapons, so let's devote more resources to the positions Brady cannot impact, such as defense.

So to argue Brady's value should be diminished because of the defenses on his team is wrong. The patriots were able to use high picks and big cap space on defense BECAUSE OF BRADY. Had Manning or Rodgers been as able to be so great without being surrounded by exceptional skill
position players, there teams could have invested in defense.

Since Brady has become QB the patriots have had 14 first round picks. They have also had 4 years without a #1 so I will consider the first choice that year to be "their 1".
13 of the 18 were defensive players.
2 were OL
2 were TE
1 was a RB

The TE and RB were in 2002,2004,and 2006.
The patriots have not drafted a skill position player in round 1, or with their first pick since 2006, and in those 11 years the only first pick on the offensive did of the ball was nate solder.
So please try to use the defense against Brady because he himself is the primary reason they are able to built a good defense.

What to hell, let's look at the colts draft picks when manning was there.
13 years. 11 #1s plus 2 years without a 1 so we count the first pick they had.

Skill position 6 3rb 2wr 1te (it should be noted the #1wr Harrison and pro bowl lt Glenn were drafted the 2 years before manning)
OL. 2
Defense 5

 

[Nehalem]

I just spoke with Joe Buck. He said "The Great" Aaron Rodgers is the best. "He once threw a pass to a wide open guy twenty yards downfield that no other QB in NFL history could have made."

The Great Aaron Rodgers was one of the league leaders in Time to Throw.



WR: "What's the play"
Aaron: "You go get open, I'll run around back here and throw it"


Don't get me wrong. Aaron Rodgers is a great QB and is fun to watch but just not better than Brady.

I don't think that list is as damning as you think. I mean Russel Wilson is a pretty good QB. And Bridgewater wasn't a terrible one.

Really I think the list tells you that mobile non-pocket QBs will tend to wait longer before throwing it... not exactly a mind blowing observation.

 

[Nehalem]

Where do all of these revered QBs buy their teflon?

In the past 2 regular seasons, Green Bay has scored 19 or fewer points 8 times.
During that same time period, Brady led Pats offenses scored 19 or fewer points once...the meaningless last game of 2015 vs Miami.

Only plausible conclusion: Rogers awesome / Brady a systems QB

You mean the "meaningless" last game that cost the Pats HFA and likely a Super Bowl berth/championship?