Butler & Saints working towards finalizing a deal (Thread now UFC Pats Fans Event)

[BradyFTW!]

Since when is Sherman available?

Just listened to the podcast - he's saying that if you're okay with paying a corner a bunch $10M+, you're okay with him being age 27-28, and you're willing to give up a first rounder to get the deal done, you're better off making an offer for Sherman (who makes ~$13M per year for the next two years).

 

[RobertWeathers]

Opinions are like...

... Everybody's got one.

Whats Lombardi doing? Calling Payton and suggesting he not to do the deal and mucking up the works for BB?

This doesn't make sense.

 

[Mack Herron]

Whats Lombardi doing? Calling Payton and suggesting he not to do the deal and mucking up the works for BB?

This doesn't make sense.

My takeaway is nobody knows.

 

[RobertWeathers]

My takeaway is nobody knows.

He must be drunk tweeting

 

[TommyD4207]

13.6M in 2017
13.2M in 2018
If the saints are struggling to fit Butler, that's really gonna be tough.
If true though #11 would probably do it.

That's not a terrible number for 2 years.

 

[Mack Herron]

He must be drunk tweeting

Podcast actually.
The Ringer Podcast Network

 

[Froob]

Whats Lombardi doing? Calling Payton and suggesting he not to do the deal and mucking up the works for BB?

This doesn't make sense.

I just listened to this actually. Lombardi says he believes Butler signs the tender and plays. Lombardi personally does not believe this is a good trade/signing for the Saints because the strength of the Seahawks style defense that the Saints want to emulate is from the front 7 of the defense not the corners. Seahawks ended up feeling pressured to pay Sherman after the SB and ultimately they ended up in some cap trouble now (and he believes Seahawks would trade Sherman for the right price) but, the strength of that defense is the front 7. So if the Saints want to emulate that style of defense, why would they pay a premium for Butler especially in a cornerback heavy draft? He also mentioned how the Saints keep changing up their defensive scheme so often that it's been even harder to settle into a good defense.

 

[slash83]

KEEP BUTLER HOME

 

[RobertWeathers]

I just listened to this actually. Lombardi says he believes Butler signs the tender and plays. Lombardi personally does not believe this is a good trade/signing for the Saints because the strength of the Seahawks style defense that the Saints want to emulate is from the front 7 of the defense not the corners. Seahawks ended up feeling pressured to pay Sherman after the SB and ultimately they ended up in some cap trouble now (and he believes Seahawks would trade Sherman for the right price) but, the strength of that defense is the front 7. So if the Saints want to emulate that style of defense, why would they pay a premium for Butler especially in a cornerback heavy draft? He also mentioned how the Saints keep changing up their defensive scheme so often that it's been even harder to settle into a good defense.

I just posted an article in the Sherman thread from a SEA beatwriter. His contention is that SEAs front 7 is not what it used to be and need Sherman....as long as he isn't divisive.

 

[Mack Herron]

That's not a terrible number for 2 years.

Saints have $12.5M cap space.

Estimating the New Orleans Saints' remaining salary cap space

 

[neuronet]

Saints have $12.5M cap space.

Estimating the New Orleans Saints' remaining salary cap space

Like I said. We have the leverage.

 

[jah]

And Emmanuel Sanders went back to Pitt when we underbid. People are only presuming the agent screwed up, maybe it works out.

What could have been...

 

[RobertWeathers]

What could have been...

Its not like we had consecutive 6-10 seasons...

 

[Froob]

What could have been...

Would have been nice if he at least stayed in Kansas City. I wouldn't change anything since we brought two Lombardis home but, Sanders is a literally perfect fit for everything we do.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

Regarding cap space.... Teams aren't allowed to trade cap space, of course, yet Cleveland and Houston essentially did just that in the Ossweiler deal. Pats currently have ~$27.5m in cap space per Miguel.

Hypothetically the Saints agree to a 5 year, 60m deal for Butler, but aren't willing to give up #11 for that. They would be willing to give up #32 for it. However, what actually happens is -

- Butler signs that extension with the Pats instead of the Saints
- it's structured as 10m in signing bonus, and annual salaries of 1, 10, 12, 13, 14m respectively.
- pats immediately trade him to the Saints
- saints cap hits only equal the base salaries shown above.
- Pats take a 2m dead money hit in 2017 for the signing bonus and an 8m hit in 2018.
- Saints are now willing to give up #11.

Would that be worth it? It essentially would cost 10m in cap space to move up 21 spots in the first round. Or is this explicitly not allowed, or something that would launch a Goodell assault even if it isn't explicitly banned?

Interesting idea. I'm not a cap expert, but doesn't the dead money accelerate onto the current year cap, so we'd eat $10M this year?

And it is perfectly fine to do...for Cleveland. Yes, we're toast and might as well give up that #1 if we do it. Herr Goodell would absolutely nail us to the wall for it.

 

[Froob]

I just posted an article in the Sherman thread from a SEA beatwriter. His contention is that SEAs front 7 is not what it used to be and need Sherman....as long as he isn't divisive.

They really blew it not winning 49. Now that they are paying guys it's tough to manage. Need to draft well again.

 

[Mack Herron]

Like I said. We have the leverage.

And BB has been firing nothing but bull's eyes since free agency opened.

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

And BB has been firing nothing but bull's eyes since free agency opened.

See below...exact wording from NFL CBA. It does NOT say that team that signs an RFA to an offer sheet must give their original first round draft pick (#11), it just states they must give one first round selection. Therefore, it may be OK for Saints to give #32 after Butler signs offer sheet, although there is no precedent..so if the Patriots and Saints disagreed on this point Goodell would have to arbitrate. Since he hates both teams I wonder who he would rule for????


(4) Right of First Refusal and One First Round Draft Selection: one year Player Contract with a Paragraph 5 Salary of at least (a) $2,611,000, or (b) 110% of the player’s prior year’s Paragraph 5 Salary, whichever is greater; in addition, if option (b) applies, all other terms of the player’s prior year contract are carried forward unchanged.

 

[Froob]

KEEP BUTLER HOME

 

[RobertWeathers]

And BB has been firing nothing but bull's eyes since free agency opened.

Completely and thoroughly accurate.