Moss's ex coaches rip him...

[mgcolby]

Obviously I dont know more about talent evaluation than BB or Pioli do or I would not be working as an Engineer I would be working as a Scout/Coach.


With that said I can question the percieved lack of talent behind the starting 4...

Thats all I am doing.

Plus its a message board and there isnt much else to talk about.

That is what makes this place great. But some people (not neccassarily you) come across with the attitude that they know more about football than our FO does. Stick around for a while you will see who and what, I and others are often refering to. The post earlier in this thread is a good starting point.

I understand some people's dislike or even hatred for a certain player or coach. Rob is a perfect example of that in this thread, no matter what he won't like Moss, I understand that and accept it. Heck, I hate Mike Martz and there is nothing anyone could ever say to change my opinion of him. People constantly looking for something to ***** about year after year gets old and makes them look foolish given this team's/FO track record. I guess that is my point in a nutshell.

 

[Kdo5]

Yeah, Art...what was your teams record last year. Talk about old and washed up. The guy sucked last year. I dont think he is in any position to start blaming people and dissing a player.

 

[fgssand]

Well I dont spend too much time on this site but I can see that posters here tend to jump all over people for questioning anything the Pats do.

I find it a little unneccesary to rip into people for expressing an opinion.

How dare you come in here and think of trashing us when we are trashing a poster that dares question the Patriots...just who do you think you are??

Only kidding dude...but I do think the Captain was very stoned when he wrote that because he is way off base..

Of course that rolling Stone will not catch any Moss....

 

[bakes781]

We're getting OT here, but my theory on why the Pats refuse to use a day one draft pick on a LB is they simply don't have the patience to teach guys who are used to playing in a 4-3 scheme. Just a guess on my part, but it seems they'd rather get a FA who's had time to develop in a similar system. When you select a guy on day one you generally expect him to start right away unless he's a QB.

 

[zippo59]

We're getting OT here, but my theory on why the Pats refuse to use a day one draft pick on a LB is they simply don't have the patience to teach guys who are used to playing in a 4-3 scheme. Just a guess on my part, but it seems they'd rather get a FA who's had time to develop in a similar system. When you select a guy on day one you generally expect him to start right away unless he's a QB.

It does seem that they would rather supplement their linebacking corps with free agents (Vrabel, Cox, Phifer, Thomas, Seau) than spend a pick on one. Perhaps they feel it is too hard to project LBs from college into their pro system that at least when you pick up free agents you have seen them play in the pros and know much more of what they can do at this level.

Also this system requires knowledge, discipline, and intelligence which primarily come from experience so in order to get the kind of player you want you have to committ extensive growing time, which they might not want to do.

That being said, I wouldn't be shocked if they picked a linebacker high next year simply because of the fact that you just never know what Belichick will do and you can't really make blanket statements about his tendincies.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Well, last year people were concerned about the future of OLB and ILB and they addressed OLB with Thomas. Now we have Thomas and Colvin outside with Vrabel and Thomas able to play both ILB and OLB. I don't think Vrabel is near the end, but that is just my opinion. The key replacement is for Bruschi and who knows what the future is. It could be Woods, Alexander or a FA next year or a First Round pick in 2008.

The fact is neither of us know what the coaching staff knows/believes about what they have for young talent. We can only speculate on the limited contributions by those players during last year's TC, Pre-Season, regular season and post season. But the coaches see them everyday and monitor their progress or lack thereof. For all we know they didn't consider anyone that was available as an upgrade over what they have. I just find it a little pompous for people to believe they know more about the depth at LB, player evaluation etc.. than BB and Pioli do. And that is how the majority of people who are "unbiased" on this board usually present their "concerns".

How about Lua and Rogers? If they make the roster there's a good chance they will contribute to the LB corps.

 

[mgcolby]

How about Lua and Rogers? If they make the roster there's a good chance they will contribute to the LB corps.

Good point, I guess I focused in on the vets. In an earlier post I did refer to Lua as intriguing, if that counts for anything?

 

[VJCPatriot]

Good point, I guess I focused in on the vets. In an earlier post I did refer to Lua as intriguing, if that counts for anything?

Hehe, it does. Don't worry. I'm just tired of guys going ballistic over our perceived lack of linebackers. They never seem to realize that we drafted two new LBs, added AD, and reportedly will add Seau as soon as he passes his physical.

 

[njpatsfan]

The title of this thread should be, "Ex-Raider coaches rip Moss". Much more accurate. Of course, in today's age of "Dan Rather" journalism, sensationalism trumps the facts every time.

R

 

[PatsSteve1]

I've lived about 35 miles from Oakland for a little over 3 years and what Shell and the OC said about Moss is largely true except maybe the skilled diminishing part. It was written about out here all the time in the local paper, the Contra Costa Times. Moss somtimes didn't even move when the ball was snapped and just stood there and watched the play. ther times just too a few steps downfield. Maybe tried on 1 in 3 or 4 plays. So how would the OC know if his skills wewre going downhill if he waqsn't trying 75% of the time? But he did quit on teh team and really only he and Porter did that.
I give picking up Moss a 50-50 chance and hope at the first sign of loafing they cut him and chock it up to one that didn't work out. It'd be nice if it worked out, but if it doesn't it doesn't and move on.

 

[DefenseRules]

I've lived about 35 miles from Oakland for a little over 3 years and what Shell and the OC said about Moss is largely true except maybe the skilled diminishing part. It was written about out here all the time in the local paper, the Contra Costa Times. Moss somtimes didn't even move when the ball was snapped and just stood there and watched the play. ther times just too a few steps downfield. Maybe tried on 1 in 3 or 4 plays. So how would the OC know if his skills wewre going downhill if he waqsn't trying 75% of the time? But he did quit on teh team and really only he and Porter did that.
I give picking up Moss a 50-50 chance and hope at the first sign of loafing they cut him and chock it up to one that didn't work out. It'd be nice if it worked out, but if it doesn't it doesn't and move on.

This is exactly why I was not crazy about this signing. I never wanted the guy here, and I'm still stunned that the Pats would make a move like this.
Like you said, we'll see how things work out, but I'm not optimistic.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Randy Moss = cancer.

Meriweather = fragile punk.

2nd-day picks = total garbage.

Still no help at ILB.

Morris is the backup RB.

Undependable Safeties.

Samuel, Troy Brown = unsigned.

No true #2 CB.

Except for AT, absolutely nothing else done to help a defense that allowed 32 points during the last half of football it played. (Thanks also to Skippy's playcalling and Bledsoe's, er, Brady's "execution" on the first, and last, series of that half.)

Disgraceful.

I suggest you stop following the Pats and adopt a winner more to your liking... say the Houston Texans... or the Boston Bruins

 

[Rob0729]

All Moss critics will join the ranks of Moss fanatics come football time when he starts dominating for us. By then this thread will have died a slow death and be long gone to the archives.

I am a Moss critic. I was a Dillon critic too. I never liked Dillon (and still don't), but I appreciated what he did for us in 2004. I will do the same if Moss performs.

I wonder more about the Moss fanatics. What if he doesn't perform up to a lot of people's lofty expectations. Is this going to be another Bledsoe situation when he didn't live up to his "Next Dan Marino" hype?

I hope I am wrong. There are a lot of question marks about this guy that concerns me. He may be able to overcome them, but I am not sure he will. Let's hope he turns into another Rodney Harrison or Corey Dillon type of move rather than a Donald Hayes or Monty Beisel type of move.

 

[TheSeymonsta]

They never seem to realize that we drafted two new LBs

Yes, Its lovely that we spent a 7th round pick and picked up a UDFA. I realise that everyone is of the opinion that these guys will make an immediate impact if needed but I think with our only glaring need being LB's and DB's for the draft it would have been nice to maybe use a 1st day pick.

JMO

 

[Fantasic4x50x54x59x55]

This is exactly why I was not crazy about this signing. I never wanted the guy here, and I'm still stunned that the Pats would make a move like this.
Like you said, we'll see how things work out, but I'm not optimistic.

stunned? why? They give up a 4th in a draft they didnt think was deep, and picked up etheir A) Randy Moss = Elite WR or B) Randy Moss = Lazy WR.. the latter gets cut they dont loose much money, its a high reward/low risk move..typical patriots.

 

[Bobs My Uncle]

All Moss critics will join the ranks of Moss fanatics come football time when he starts dominating for us. By then this thread will have died a slow death and be long gone to the archives.

 

[Born_a_Patriot]

All Moss critics will join the ranks of Moss fanatics come football time when he starts dominating for us. By then this thread will have died a slow death and be long gone to the archives.

I hope so. If he proves my ideas of him wrong than that means he will help the Patriots.

 

[DaBruinz]

Yes, Its lovely that we spent a 7th round pick and picked up a UDFA. I realise that everyone is of the opinion that these guys will make an immediate impact if needed but I think with our only glaring need being LB's and DB's for the draft it would have been nice to maybe use a 1st day pick.

JMO

Meriweather IS a DB. So the Pats DID use a day 1 pick for one. The Pats were PLANNING on using their 3rd round pick of Stewart Bradley. Unfortunately, he wasn't available because the Eagles took him at 85. What should they do? WASTE a pick on players they don't feel offer the value for the pick? If that's the sort of management you are looking for, go follow the Phins or something.

NO ONE is of the opinion that Lua (7th round)and Rogers (6th round) are going to be immediate impacts. And no one has said such. That is you making up things that just haven't been said by other people. What other people have said is that the Pats added Adalius Thomas and will be adding Junior Seau to give the Pats 5 deep at the starting LB positions. They also still have Woods, Alexander and Mays. Woods has the most talent of the 3 and could see time at OLB this year. Lua and Rogers both have talent. They are rookies and, as Belichick has said, it usually takes 2-3 years for a LB to develop in this system.

You sit there and preach about the Pats not adding talent, yet you refuse to acknowledge what they have done and that they have talent on the team. Just because its not the Big name recognition talent YOU want, doesn't mean its not talent.

 

[mossisboss]

Randy will have a great year.

Art Shell and Tom Walsh are spilling their sour grapes. They had a high school offensive scheme last year and they want to make Randy the ultimate scapegoat.

If Randy was the problem, how come the offensive production in the last 3 games of the season went from 12 ppg to under 10 ppg, when he was sidelined with the leg injury?

Art Shell was the 4th choice of Al Davis last year behind Al Saunders, Bobby Petrino, and Ken Whisenhunt...

 

[miDeuce]

I think, and given the fact that Moss has shown up in NE two weeks early supports me, that all this negativity is just becoming fuel for the fire that he's about to unleash this season. I am reserving judgement on Moss until I see what he does for the Patriots. If he comes here, shuts up, works hard and performs I will really enjoy watching him play every weekend. If he doesn't he'll be on the street and we will still be pretty nasty with Stallworth/Welker/Caldwell/etc...