Next Stop, the Underwear Olympics

[DaBruinz]

Who are your 3-4 DE's? There's nobody on the roster with the 6'5" 315 size Bill likes for that role.

Everlong - Ty Warren was only 6'4 5/8" and 305.

Armond Armstead is 6'4 2/8" and around 300. He could easily be your LDE (thought there are questions about his run stopping) with someone like Tuitt as the RDE with Chandler Jones at the ROLB spot and Ninkovich/Collins/Hightower at the LOLB spot. The problem would be whether or not Wilfork is healthy enough to be your NT full time.

If you can find it, I suggest reading up on the 4-3 Under that the Pats have been using. It's a modified version of the 3-4 because it, essentially, brings the LOLB down onto the line giving the opposing team a 4 man look.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

It's probably BB telling Matt that he hitting on 1 of 3 1st round WRs means he doesn't know anything and should keep his mouth shut.. *LOL*

Or, "Hey, *I* found a 100-catch receiver in the seventh round."

 

[DaBruinz]

Given the current situation, you're looking at Mayo/Hightower as the other LBs and some combination of Kelly/Wilfork/Silaga along the line.




Jones isn't good taking on the run.
Collins is a disaster taking on the run.
Ninkovich can set the edge, but he can't really hold up taking on the run.
Armstead hasn't played in so long that counting on him is folly, especially since he's never done a thing in the NFL.
Gregory and McCourty are not a run tackling safety pair.

BB would basically be hoping that Hightower/Mayo/DT2 would be enough to make up for about 6 weak run defenders who can chase but can't really defend head on.

Most runs were away from Chandler Jones.
Jamie Collins was a disaster? So was Tedy Bruschi when a guard got his hands on him. Go back and watch the games and look at how often the OGs were getting to the second level to take on the ILB..
Ninkovich can and does hold up. The issue was no one to rotate with.

McCourty can tackle just fine. Gregory was OK, but can be improved upon. That being said, the biggest issue is at NT. The Pats need someone to play the 0-Tech behind Wilfork or instead of Wilfork. They you put Siliga at the 3-tech to solidify the line against the run. On passing downs, you bring on Chris Jones, you bump Chandler Jones inside, and you bring another CB onto the field.

 

[DaBruinz]

So you don't want Donald?

I don't want to return to a two gap 3-4, at all. If they wanted to go to more of a one gapping pressure 3-4 I could be convinced but what would be their 3-4 OLB's that are on the roster in Jones and Nink don't fit the mold.

Yeah.. why go back to something that works??

How do Jones and Ninkovich not fit the 3-4 OLB molds??? *grabs some popcorn to enjoy this explanation*

 

[everlong]

Yeah.. why go back to something that works??

How do Jones and Ninkovich not fit the 3-4 OLB molds??? *grabs some popcorn to enjoy this explanation*

It worked in a different era of the NFL. Bend but don't break is death by a thousand papercuts with the new rules.

First off there's no reason to be condescending. Second I said neither are one gap 3-4 OLB's and that they are 3-4 two gap OLB's. I think of guys like Demarcus Ware or Clay Mathews who are there to penetrate and get to the QB. That's not Jones or Nink's strength. With Jones if Bill unleashed him maybe it could be.

 

[DaBruinz]

Some unofficial RB 40's from Josh Norris:

- Dri Archer 4.29, 1.46 10 yard split.
- Devonta Freeman 4.50, 1.59 10 yard.
- Ka'deem Carey 4.65, 1.59 10 yard.
- Tyler Gaffney 4.43, 1.53 10 yard.
- Jeremy Hill 4.63.
- Carlos Hyde 4.62, 1.65 10 yard - hammy injury apparently.
- Storm Johnson 4.50.
- Jerrick Mackinnon 4.38, 1.46 10 yard. To go with 32 reps @ 225, 40.5" vertical and 11" broad jump. Wow.
- Tre Mason 4.44, 1.57 10 yard.

If Mackinnon ran a 4.38, then that is 2 tenths of a second better than anything anyone predicted and faster than any time he's ever run..

 

[VJCPatriot]

Interesting to note with Brandon Coleman throwing up a 4.5 today at 6'6" Rang prior to that time being run had him mocked to the Pats in the first round and Brugler had him in the first to the 49ers. Given that time after I wonder if he's moved into a top 40 lock.

Well Coleman went to Rutgers. Which means he is a lock for the Pats, by hook or by crook BB will get his Scarlet Knight!!

Oh yeah 6'6 225 size makes for a pretty good redzone threat!
http://www.nj.com/rutgersfootball/i...coleman_says_his_knee_feels_a_lot_better.html

video clip:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5TRgqXdqa0

a more in depth breakdown on coleman. sounds like an intriguing objection for round 3 or 4:
http://withthefirstpick.com/2014/02/02/2014-nfl-draft-scouting-report-brandon-coleman-wr-rutgers/

 

[DaBruinz]

It worked in a different era of the NFL. Bend but don't break is death by a thousand papercuts with the new rules.

First off there's no reason to be condescending. Second I said neither are one gap 3-4 OLB's and that they are 3-4 two gap OLB's. I think of guys like Demarcus Ware or Clay Mathews who are there to penetrate and get to the QB. That's not Jones or Nink's strength. With Jones if Bill unleashed him maybe it could be.

Like I said. I suggest you go and read up on the 4-3 UNDER which has been the defense the Pats (and Seahawks) have used for the past 2 years. The Pats defense is and will be a two gap defense because that is what BB feels works best. Going to one gap assignments leaves gaping holes for the offense to exploit.

Two Gap doesn't equal bend, don't break. It forces the other team to be one dimensional and try to beat you with that. I would have thought a seasoned poster like yourself would understand that by now.

 

[DaBruinz]

NFL posted on facebook that Dri Archer's official 40 time is 4.26..

 

[everlong]

Like I said. I suggest you go and read up on the 4-3 UNDER which has been the defense the Pats (and Seahawks) have used for the past 2 years. The Pats defense is and will be a two gap defense because that is what BB feels works best. Going to one gap assignments leaves gaping holes for the offense to exploit.

Two Gap doesn't equal bend, don't break. It forces the other team to be one dimensional and try to beat you with that. I would have thought a seasoned poster like yourself would understand that by now.

Seattle is not playing a read and react defense. They are using one gap techniques minus the nose and penetrating to cause disruptions.

Two gap per say doesn't equal bend but don't break but if you're playing a read and react defense you're not applying pressure. You're hoping to play a sound scheme and that the offense will eventually make a mistake. The problem is with the rules changes more often than not it's the defense making the mistake because the rules are so tilted in one direction.

We can go back and forth on this all day but in the end they need to be able to apply more pressure on the QB and by that I don't per say mean sacks. The Pats had 4 pressures on Manning all game long and never touched him. Seattle had constant pressure. IMO you have to play a pressure defense. Yes you'll give up some big plays but you'll force a lot more too.

 

[VJCPatriot]

NFL posted on facebook that Dri Archer's official 40 time is 4.26..

If Edelman leaves, Archer would make for an interesting option as a kick returner/wideout.

 

[Merril Hoge's Tie Knot]

per say

:ugh::bricks:

 

[Deus Irae]

Sorry, I'll just have to disagree and be on my way. You can't have 7 pro bowlers on your front 7 overnight. What I saw was an improvement in the run game towards the end of the season and that was without Wilfork, Mayo and Kelly in there. I don't see Jones and Ninkovich as poor run defenders nor are they great.

What film is this you have that Donald can't stop the run because I'd like to see it. He did stop it in college, now it's up to the scouts to determine whether he can do it at the next level at his size.

Still don't agree on the disaster label on Collins either. I've seen a lot worse. Seemed to be ok in the Indy game.

1.) The teams to beat are Seattle and San Francisco, and both have excellent run games.

2.) With regards to Collins, all it takes is watching him play to see it. It's not as if this was unknown prior to the draft, either.

3.) "What I saw was an improvement in the run game towards the end of the season and that was without Wilfork, Mayo and Kelly in there. I don't see Jones and Ninkovich as poor run defenders nor are they great. " Tells me all I need to know. I didn't ask for 7 pro bowlers. I noted that the group being mentioned would suck against the run. You changing the discussion makes it clear that we're not both looking at this with an equal, or even similar, level of dispassion.

 

[Brady6]

Janis with a 6.64 3-cone.

 

[everlong]

:ugh::bricks:

Ya I admit it was bad but in my defense the 16 month old was on my lap swatting at the keyboard.

 

[mayoclinic]

Some bench press numbers for the DLs from Steelers' Depot:

- Aaron Donald 35 reps @ 225
- Ra'Shede Hageman 32
- Timmy Jernigan 27
- Daniel McCullers 27
- Kelcey Quarles 27
- Dominique Easley 26
- Justin Ellis 25
- Ego Ferguson 24
- Scott Crichton 24
- Will Sutton 24
- Marcus Smith 23
- Will Clarke 22
- Kony Ealy 22
- Jadaveon Clowney 21
- Taylor Hart 21
- Da'Quan Jones 21
- Caraun Reid 20
- Michael Sam 17
- Larry Webster 17

2014 NFL Combine Results: Defensive Linemen | Steelers Depot

 

[Kontradiction]

Pats are meeting with Ha Ha Clinton-Dix. I'm not as high on him as some but it may indicate that the Pats are prioritizing safety in this draft. That makes me happy.

 

[Merril Hoge's Tie Knot]

Good day for Robinson

6025
220
9.5 Hands
4.56 40
39" Vertical
10'7" Broad
7.00 3-cone
4.00 SS

Physically similar to Alshon Jeffery -- about what I expected. Hopefully the average 40 time keeps him undervalued.

 

[mayoclinic]

Logan Thomas with a 35.5" vertical and 9'10" broad jump to go with his 4.60 40 and 1.59 10 yard split at 6'6" 248#.

Compare that with Jimmy Graham in 2010: 6' 6 1/4" 260#, 4.53 40, 1.53 10 yard split, 38" vertical, 10' broad jump. Not far off. Graham also had a 6.90 3-cone - it will be interesting to see Thomas' number.

Graham went in the late 3rd (#95 overall) as a raw TE with athletic upside. Mayock predicted at the time that it would take 2-3 years before he would be ready to contribute - he was slightly off on that one. Late 3rd/early 4th for Thomas doesn't seem ridiculous as a TE conversion, based on pure athleticism.

Thomas with a 7.05 3-cone and 4.18 short shuttle. Better short shuttle than Jimmy Graham (4.39), slightly slower 3-cone (6.90), but still respectable.

 

[Kontradiction]

Some bench press numbers for the DLs from Steelers' Depot:

- Aaron Donald 35 reps @ 225
- Ra'Shede Hageman 32
- Timmy Jernigan 27
- Daniel McCullers 27
- Kelcey Quarles 27
- Dominique Easley 26
- Justin Ellis 25
- Ego Ferguson 24
- Scott Crichton 24
- Will Sutton 24
- Marcus Smith 23
- Will Clarke 22
- Kony Ealy 22
- Jadaveon Clowney 21
- Taylor Hart 21
- Da'Quan Jones 21
- Caraun Reid 20
- Michael Sam 17
- Larry Webster 17

2014 NFL Combine Results: Defensive Linemen | Steelers Depot

Donald displaying some nice upper body strength. Surprised Clowney only put up 21.