Irsay takes a bit of a shot a Manning.....

[Uncle Rico]

Irsay's statements are not fair. His only ring came courtesy Manning.

Well, mostly from a post-season Run D that came from out of nowhere. But, yeah.

 

[JMC00]

Irsay's statements are not fair. His only ring came courtesy Manning.

Or was it more of a Patriots defensive breakdown in the 2nd half of the '06 AFCC game and a Reche Caldwell drop?

 

[Deus Irae]

Irsay's statements are not fair. His only ring came courtesy Manning.

His statement is perfectly fair. He'd rather have SB wins rather than gaudy stats.

Hell, people on this site have been saying that for a long, long time.

 

[cmc0605]

Counting rings has always been one of the most useless stats to gauge how good of a QB someone is. It's an intellectually bankrupt argument.

Fact is Manning gives no worse of a shot at the playoffs/SB than Brady, and he gives a better shot than Luck, at least right now. I agree with the decision to move from Manning to Luck, but for entirely different reasons (age primarily); I'm not sure why this shot was necessary. The timing is obviously not coincidental, but I'm not sure why you'd elect to tick of Peyton.

 

[Deus Irae]

Counting rings has always been one of the most useless stats to gauge how good of a QB someone is. It's an intellectually bankrupt argument.

Fact is Manning gives no worse of a shot at the playoffs/SB than Brady, and he gives a better shot than Luck, at least right now. I agree with the decision to move from Manning to Luck, but for entirely different reasons (age primarily); I'm not sure why this shot was necessary. The timing is obviously not coincidental, but I'm not sure why you'd elect to tick of Peyton.

You're completely wrong, but welcome to the board.

 

[mosi]

Re: Irsay is an idiot(Incase anyone wasn't convinced)

Damn right. Just like his old dad. A bunch of losers. Will never forget what they did to the Colts. The Baltimore Colts.

 

[olschool]

Or was it more of a Patriots defensive breakdown in the 2nd half of the '06 AFCC game and a Reche Caldwell drop?

And playing against that all time great quarterback Rex Grossman in the Superbowl ?

 

[cmc0605]

You're completely wrong, but welcome to the board.

Thanks!!

I maintain my argument.

 

[Deus Irae]

Thanks!!

I maintain my argument.

Maintain it all you want. History has already proven you wrong.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Counting rings has always been one of the most useless stats to gauge how good of a QB someone is. It's an intellectually bankrupt argument.

Fact is Manning gives no worse of a shot at the playoffs/SB than Brady, and he gives a better shot than Luck, at least right now. I agree with the decision to move from Manning to Luck, but for entirely different reasons (age primarily); I'm not sure why this shot was necessary. The timing is obviously not coincidental, but I'm not sure why you'd elect to tick of Peyton.

How do you figure? We have almost a decade and a half of precedent that pretty clearly illustrates otherwise.

The one ring that Manning has came from a playoff run in which he didn't even play well.



For all that Brady gets discounted for having a good defense in his Super Bowl runs, Manning threw 1 TD and 5 picks in the first two rounds of the 2006 playoffs. He was terrible. He had a 39.6 rating against Baltimore. Luckily for him, his defense held the Chiefs and Ravens to a combined 14 points. Based on that alone, no Manning fan should ever use the "but Brady had a strong defense" excuse again. Brady never had a QB rating of less than 70 in any of the Super Bowl years, and even that was in the Snow Bowl.

Manning in Super Bowl-winning playoff runs: 3 touchdowns and 7 interception

Brady in Super Bowl-winning playoff runs: 11 touchdowns and 3 interceptions

 

[patsinthesnow]

Re: Irsay is an idiot(Incase anyone wasn't convinced)

Is this new model part of them trading away a first round pick for an overrated back up RB? That Trent Richardson trade is working out well for them. I think they are going to learn quickly that Trent Richardson was nothing special in Cleveland, not because teams put 9 in the box against them every play, but because he is nothing special.

Agreed. Alabama RBs are BJGEs that somehow get drafted in rounds 1-2.

 

[cmc0605]

Maintain it all you want. History has already proven you wrong.

History is not a relevant metric here. You would need to construct an alternative reality in which Brady was a Colt and Manning was a Patriot in order to fully satisfy people's theories. Unfortunately, we cannot do that experiment.

The "ring only" argument leads to absurdities like Eli better than Peyton, and Trent Dilfer just as good as him. It's an irritatingly off-base position that confuses the ultimate team goal with something else entirely. Left guards have rings too. The QB is a bit more disproportionate in importance, but not enough to make this a relevant point of comparison, given how much defense/run game/coaching, etc factor into team success.

I appreciate your opinion though. For what it's worth, I think the Manning v. Brady arguments are silly, will never be settled, and are not really relevant. Brady and Manning both two of the best ever. I get that I'm on a Patriots forum and am under no illusion that this will be accepted. But the original point is on whether loosing Manning for Luck somehow shifts the balance from stats to a better shot at a ring. Why in the world anyone would support that argument right now, were you to give the two QBs identical teams, is beyond me.

 

[Ozymandias]

Did Irsay say all of this before or after he downed a bottle of Jim Beam?

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

Re: Irsay is an idiot(Incase anyone wasn't convinced)

Damn right. Just like his old dad. A bunch of losers. Will never forget what they did to the Colts. The Baltimore Colts.

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree......like father...like son.....both open their mouths and nothing comes out.....

 

[Deus Irae]

How do you figure?...

Just to add some notes:

Tom Brady has had only had 2 one-and-dones in 10 playoff seasons

Peyton Manning has had 8 one-and-dones in 12 playoff seasons

Tom Brady has thrown more INTs than TDs in only 1 playoff season, and that was a one-and-done.

Peyton has thrown more INTs than TDs in 2 playoff seasons, one that was a one-and-done and one that was his SB winning year.

Tom Brady's TD:INT ratio in the playoffs is 42:22
Peyton Manning's TD:INT ratio in the playoffs is 32:21

Tom Brady has the most postseason wins of any quarterback in NFL history.
Peyton Manning is sub .500 in the playoffs.

Brady's playoff opponents (.714) have had a higher winning regular season winning percentage than have Manning's playoff opponents (.699).

Manning's lost a playoff game to an 8-8 team (2008 SD)


It's easy to see why Irsay would be willing to move on from Manning in favor of a talent like Luck.

 

[Boogs]

I think Irsay is correct in his assessment, but you keep your mouth shut! You never give the opposing team billboard material! Cancel the pregame ceremony now. It could have been used to soften up Manning with praise. Not now.

 

[Uncle Rico]

A relevant tidbit from Breer on NFL.com:

Darius Butler has played with Andrew Luck and Tom Brady, and the similarity he's noticed in the quarterbacks is interesting, "Unselfishness," the cornerback said. "A lot of guys, especially a No. 1 pick, would want to come in and throw the ball 50 times a game, especially in the scheme we were in last year. But he doesn't have a problem handing it off and throwing for 175 yards if that's what it takes. And it was the same thing with Tom. If it was a team that we could line up, spread them out and run the ball, we would run the ball all the day." Luck threw for just 229 yards in the Colts' win over the Seahawks last week, but few would deny he was in complete command throughout the game. That's the whole idea here. I asked Colts owner Jim Irsay about it two days later. He showed me his Super Bowl XLI ring and said: "It's about world championships, and we have one. ... That really came down to inconsistent special teams, inconsistent defensive play, particularly against the run. So the vision when I brought (Ryan) Grigson and (Chuck) Pagano in was to have a really well-rounded team." And as Butler said, they do seem to have a quarterback who gets that philosophy.

 

[NENGFAN]

Irsay cheap shots on Manning....

Quite insulting comments by Irsay on Manning just a few days before Peyton's home coming. A lot of it true but not called for IMHO. Even heralding Brady over Manning.....ouch!

John Fox: Jim Irsay 'ungrateful'
Updated: October 15, 2013, 10:01 PM ET

John Fox said he thought Jim Irsay's comments on Peyton Manning were "a cheap shot."
"I saw the comments. And to be honest with you, I thought it was a bit of a cheap shot," Fox said during an interview on SiriusXM NFL Radio. "To me, in my opinion, they were disappointing and inappropriate.

"Peyton would never say anything. He's too classy to do that. They sounded a little ungrateful and unappreciative to me. For a guy who has set a standard, won a Super Bowl, won four MVP awards ... be thankful of that one Super Bowl ring, because a lot of people don't have one."

Irsay, in an interview with USA Today Sports, said the Colts have changed their model "a little bit" under Andrew Luck, because Irsay wants "more than one of these [rings]."

"[Tom] Brady never had consistent numbers, but he has three of these [rings]," Irsay told USA Today. "Pittsburgh had two, the Giants had two, Baltimore had two and we had one. That leaves you frustrated.

"You make the playoffs 11 times, and you're out in the first round seven out of 11 times. You love to have the 'Star Wars' numbers from Peyton and Marvin [Harrison] and Reggie [Wayne]. Mostly, you love this [ring]."

Irsay also told USA Today Sports that Manning thought the Colts could not pass up the chance to draft Luck.

The Colts have gone 15-7 since drafting Luck with the top overall pick in 2012. At the time of the conversation, Manning was recovering from fusion surgery on his neck and the Colts were attempting to rebound from a 2-14 season.

"[Manning] said, 'You've got to take Andrew,'" Irsay told USA Today Sports. "'You have to. You're crazy if you don't.'"

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John Fox calls Jim Irsay's comments on Peyton Manning 'a cheap shot' - ESPN

 

[TriplecHamp]

Re: Irsay cheap shots on Manning....

I guess we don't even check the first page before making threas anymore..

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

If poetic justice were to become reality, this tanking drunken POS owner would suffer through about a dozen winless seasons in a row