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Why did this team sign Tebow?

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Should the Patriots cut Tebow?

  • Cut Tebow

    Votes: 155 64.6%
  • Keep Tebow

    Votes: 85 35.4%

  • Total voters
    240
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I'm curious if some of the supposed Tebow fans are just people who like to stir the pot so they're playing the Tebow card to do it. I don't think it's possible for so many people to deny or ignore the logic that comparing Tebow to any other starting QB in NFL history would show them; which is Tebow is not very good, and that's describing it nicely.

But hey if they enjoy doing it and others enjoy feeding into it; do the damn thang I guess! To each their own

I'd rehash the "Case for Tebow" again (for the 1,000th time), but unfortunately, I'm having too much fun playing with the super tough belichick dude. Don't have time to argue.
 
I'd rehash the "Case for Tebow" again (for the 1,000th time), but unfortunately, I'm having too much fun playing with the super tough belichick dude. Don't have time to argue.

Oh I've heard the case brother; it's about as strong as Hernandez defenses, but at least they stand to make millions presenting it.

Tebow's a good dude, does stuff in community, high character, hard worker, excellent college QB, very competitive, leaves his heart on the field, he just is NOT a good NFL QB, I attribute it to the speed of the NFL being to fast for someone who unfortunately has been dealt a difficult hand in terms of having a legitimate learning disability with dyslexia. I genuinely believe he'd benefit from playing another position which would rely more on his physical talent and less on his mental talent.
 
this thread is like a scary movie.....

 
Few things -

- No such thing as watching too much South Park

- I questioned people's fanhood. Any who responded with defenses of their manhood on either side are certainly commenting on something, but not on my post.

- The guy with gator in his name got it. It really is a welcome to you guys. It takes intelligence to get it strictly conditionally. Everybody else, I truly do hope you get it after getting "it." [/EST seminar]

- Some interweb terminology... people who "just like to stir the pot" are called "Trolls." Some people say :trolls: but who am I to make the line for food stamps that much longer?

In all seriousness... here's the closest I get to understanding this phenomenon: I'm not a baseball fan, but as a kid, I was a Sawx fan. I just couldn't keep my interest in baseball, because it has so little action that the play-by-play guys are telling stories about cleaning their gutters between significant moments. I honestly have skipped a world series Sawx game on a Sunday to watch a meaningless mid-season Pats game when the division isn't in question. Flip side, I finally found out hockey's a good game this Stanley Cup, cuz the Bruinz were in it. I found myself saying to my Blackhawk fan relatives "Oh it's on like Bergeron." Stuff like that. It made me remember what it's like to be a bandwagon-jumping, "just for fun" casual fan.

So I guess I get "abandoning" a team or casually picking up the interest, based on bandwagon events, though for me it's more about one set of teams defined by coming from the Boston area long ago.

So yes, I'm calling out your fanhood, but in so doing I'm saying you're devoid of irrational loyalty to something that unites a fan base. To be brutally honest, reason and fanhood are essentially incompatible. I think I like fanhood because it's a break from reason, not an extension thereof.

So that's how I do it. It's gotta be New England. If you don't do it that way, I hope that you do by the time you're done.... 'cuz that's how you gotta do it. Cuz I say so goddammit... or more like, because I think the loyalty/irrationality aspect is the heart of the experience. I think the Gators guy gets it because he's got that college fanhood experience.

The alternative being proffered here, being a fan of another man, following him team-to-team, seems very night-vision-goggles/it-puts-the-lotion-in-the-basket to me.

I guess I can make a rough analogy to, say, Genesis before and after Peter Gabriel left. It didn't take too long to give up on much good coming out of that band from Abacab onward. Then again, I expect to be watching Pats games in a nursing home as my only respite from catheter infections and the like... new Genesis (or Gabriel) songs? Not so much.
 
Few things -

- No such thing as watching too much South Park

So yes, I'm calling out your fanhood, but in so doing I'm saying you're devoid of irrational loyalty to something that unites a fan base. To be brutally honest, reason and fanhood are essentially incompatible. I think I like fanhood because it's a break from reason, not an extension thereof.

So that's how I do it. It's gotta be New England. If you don't do it that way, I hope that you do by the time you're done.... 'cuz that's how you gotta do it. Cuz I say so goddammit... or more like, because I think the loyalty/irrationality aspect is the heart of the experience. I think the Gators guy gets it because he's got that college fanhood experience.

The alternative being proffered here, being a fan of another man, following him team-to-team, seems very night-vision-goggles/it-puts-the-lotion-in-the-basket to me.

I guess I can make a rough analogy to, say, Genesis before and after Peter Gabriel left. It didn't take too long to give up on much good coming out of that band from Abacab onward. Then again, I expect to be watching Pats games in a nursing home as my only respite from catheter infections and the like... new Genesis (or Gabriel) songs? Not so much.

I get where you're coming from, and the parts I left quoted are essentially what I was going to argue for. (before complete thread derailment)

Fan(atic)s can't be fully rational when they're cheering for their team. And the act of becoming a fan(atic) is rarely rational or well reasoned. You simply pick up a team you like (for whatever reason) and go with it. For people who pick a team like this while they're young, the team they pick is often "their" team for life.

Diehard fans are great, and fun to talk with. I'm pretty sure that's why most people are here. But even the diehard fans had to start somewhere. At some point, everybody is just a casual fan, even if it's only when they're ten years old

I'm a broncos fan. Posting here isn't going to change that. (Even if I do like the Patriots) I keep an eye on Tebow's career because I like the skill set he brings to the table at qb. It's fun to watch, I think it could be something special if coached up right. The 2011 Broncos season was one of the most memorable ones in Broncos history.

It appears creepy to see us "Tebro's" posting about him a lot, but in reality, it's a pretty small amount of time we spend actually typing about him (for most, at least). I'd be perfectly happy lurking for a few years, if the claims made against Tebow weren't so absolute and over the top. It's the weird underdog aspect of it that makes me want to come out and defend him.

So yeah... good post

One last thought... Even before Tebow arrived, I'd occasionally browse some Pats forums, and you guys are some of the cooler fans I've come across. Generally well reasoned, pretty civil, good football talk, etc. (there are always exceptions ) Jets and Steelers fans are generally awful...
So even if I get caught up arguing with people I disagree with, in general, you guys are pretty cool.
 
The "keep Tebow" crowd is turning the numbers around... (dramatic music)

Here we go...almost at 43% and climbing.

Can we get to 43% by tomorrow? That's what I want to know!

A couple of good runs and we get this baby pumped up to 44% by midnight Saturday morning. Come on people! YOU CAN DO IT :rocker:
 
I am pretty sure another " manly" core belief is not to whine and cry constantly about who likes what palyer ...waaaaa, waaaaa, waaaaa...

Some of you guys really need to give it a rest.

 
I get where you're coming from, and the parts I left quoted are essentially what I was going to argue for. (before complete thread derailment)

Fan(atic)s can't be fully rational when they're cheering for their team. And the act of becoming a fan(atic) is rarely rational or well reasoned. You simply pick up a team you like (for whatever reason) and go with it. For people who pick a team like this while they're young, the team they pick is often "their" team for life.

Diehard fans are great, and fun to talk with. I'm pretty sure that's why most people are here. But even the diehard fans had to start somewhere. At some point, everybody is just a casual fan, even if it's only when they're ten years old

I'm a broncos fan. Posting here isn't going to change that. (Even if I do like the Patriots) I keep an eye on Tebow's career because I like the skill set he brings to the table at qb. It's fun to watch, I think it could be something special if coached up right. The 2011 Broncos season was one of the most memorable ones in Broncos history.

It appears creepy to see us "Tebro's" posting about him a lot, but in reality, it's a pretty small amount of time we spend actually typing about him (for most, at least). I'd be perfectly happy lurking for a few years, if the claims made against Tebow weren't so absolute and over the top. It's the weird underdog aspect of it that makes me want to come out and defend him.

So yeah... good post

One last thought... Even before Tebow arrived, I'd occasionally browse some Pats forums, and you guys are some of the cooler fans I've come across. Generally well reasoned, pretty civil, good football talk, etc. (there are always exceptions ) Jets and Steelers fans are generally awful...
So even if I get caught up arguing with people I disagree with, in general, you guys are pretty cool.

Comes from being secure in your fanhood

Kind of glad Denver ended up with Welker, in a way... it's like an invitation to more Peyton Hatin'. We may be in that rivalry's waning days, after everybody's had that season-ending injury, and both of the QBs are way past the career mid-points, but I'm still savoring it (while hoping that we score our version of Aaron Rogers after Brett Favre, preferably without the embarassing fake retirements.)
 
Comes from being secure in your fanhood

Kind of glad Denver ended up with Welker, in a way... it's like an invitation to more Peyton Hatin'. We may be in that rivalry's waning days, after everybody's had that season-ending injury, and both of the QBs are way past the career mid-points, but I'm still savoring it (while hoping that we score our version of Aaron Rogers after Brett Favre, preferably without the embarassing fake retirements.)

It's difficult for me, these days...

Being a Broncos fan, that really doesn't like Manning... and especially not Fox... nobody gets me anymore... :bricks:

I can't bring up Peyton's amazing playoff chokiness/averageness without pissing people off, so I have to bottle it up... I don't think it's good for my emotional stability.

I haven't actually searched to see what the general consensus is on Peyton, around here. Is he pretty much considered "best regular season qb ever", as well as "worst postseason choker ever"? I'm gonna have to do some research on the local opinions...
 
It's difficult for me, these days...

Being a Broncos fan, that really doesn't like Manning... and especially not Fox... nobody gets me anymore... :bricks:

I can't bring up Peyton's amazing playoff chokiness/averageness without pissing people off, so I have to bottle it up... I don't think it's good for my emotional stability.

I haven't actually searched to see what the general consensus is on Peyton, around here. Is he pretty much considered "best regular season qb ever", as well as "worst postseason choker ever"? I'm gonna have to do some research on the local opinions...

The great "Brady vs Manning" debate, you should get an earful on that no matter what NE fan you ask...
 
Regarding Tebow fans who will be gone if Tebow's gone:

Screw the love-fest. Then it'll be good riddance -- including if the improbable happens, all the hunches are right, all the stars align, and he turns into an NFL QB, and you stick around 10 years.

I've never understood being a "one-man fan" for a favorite player, or saying "ho hummm, I like the Pats because I like this player, but I hope the Bears beat them this week because I like two Bears players. Soul rending but I had to make a call..."

I am openly questioning your Fanhood.

Come to the Pats because you like Tebow, fine, but WTF? Do you even follow the NFL? I mean what, did Tebow personally massage your naughty bits down in Florida or something?
I didn't become a Raiders fan when Plunkett left, and I didn't think "we" won anything when he had some success there. I liked David Givens okay but I never became a Titans fan, and I like Randy Moss just fine, but I've never been a [your team here] fan. I'm not a Broncos fan because Welker's there. I'm not a KC fan because Cassel's there (he's still there, right?)

<SNIP>

Welcome.

(Now live up to it goddammit!)

[/rant]

PFnVA,

This was either my first or second post made on this forum.

New member here. Will go ahead and get it out of the way, yes, I'm a Tebow fan.

Will try to make this short. Grew up on SEC football and have been an avid fan of it for 35+ years. Three favorite teams are Georgia (where I grew up), Auburn (where my brother went to college and was only 45 mins away) and Kentucky (which his where most my family is from, and where I live now).

While I'm a fan of SEC football, NFL football didn't appeal to me the same way. I rooted for the Falcons when I lived down in Georgia, but after moving to Ky, with no "local" team, I never was fanatical about it. Definitely didn't have a single favorite team that I was enamored with.
Now, this doesn't mean that I didn't/don't spend every Sunday planted in front of the TV watching games, Monday and Thursday nights as well. It might not be SEC football, but it still beats the heck out of anything else that's on .

Over the years of watching, there have been some NFL teams that I like, some that I tolerate, and some that I just absolutely despise. I mean, when Cleveland plays, I don't care who the other team is, they just became my favorite, unless it's the Giants or the Raiders, cause yeah, I hate them both as well. Don't know why exactly, it just is what it is.

I have pulled for the Pats a number of times over the years. Back when I was younger, it was because of the wicked cool Pat's logo:

and the colors. Who doesn't like Red, White and Blue ?

Wasn't into them much during the Bledsoe years, probably because I just didn't like Bledsoe. Can't remember why that was, but again, it is what it is.

The past decade or so ? Mainly pulled for the Pats in the SB, especially when they were playing the Giants. Did I mention that I REALLY HATE the Giants ? Again, not sure why, but it is what it is.

Brady ? He's an interesting case as he has a number of things working against him. Biggest problem for me is that he played at Michigan, and good lord, let me tell you, I HATE THE UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN. Seriously. My favorite color is blue and my favorite vegetable is corn (maize), but I still HATE THE UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN.

That said, the dude can flat out play, and that earned my respect long, long ago.

(A quick aside, it was a similar situation with Tebow (and Urban Meyers too). Both were at Florida of course, and that means I hated them both as I was from Bulldog country. So, right from the get go, I had no love for either Tebow or Meyer. For Tebow specifically, after he committed to UF a and at the beginning his freshman year, I kept wondering what all the damned hype was about. Then, the next 3 years of Tebow happened. Somewhere along the line, while he and Urban ran roughshod over the SEC, I began to develop a healthy respect for them both. Right after "The Promise", I was like "WTF" and got a good laugh out of it. Later, I was like "Damn". Ok, enough of that, back to the regularly scheduled programming. )

Then we get to The Dark Lord, the Evil Genius himself, Bill Belichick. I've forgiven him for being associated with Cleveland. I mean, how can you not like a guy that wears a freaking hoody on the sidelines and looks like Emperor Palpatine ? The fact that he's inarguably the smartest and most creative coach in the NFL certainly doesn't hurt. What I really like about him is that while most other coaches seem to have looked down on the college game over the years, Belichick has been fishing those waters for innovations for years. I like a guy who says "Fark conventional wisdom, I'm going to do what I think works."

Anyways, as I said, I'm here because of the Tebow signing. Hopefully he'll make the roster and I'll be pulling for the Pats this season regardless of whether he plays or spends the season carrying a clip board and bringing Brady some Gatorade. Obviously, I'd love it if Bill and company figure out a way to use him in games this season. But, it won't bother me a bit if he spends the entire year or two or three learning and developing as a QB.



Short version to answer your question highlighted above is that yes, I have "followed the NFL" for 35 years or so, but never was an actual fan of any team.
 
I'm curious if some of the supposed Tebow fans are just people who like to stir the pot so they're playing the Tebow card to do it. I don't think it's possible for so many people to deny or ignore the logic that comparing Tebow to any other starting QB in NFL history would show them; which is Tebow is not very good, and that's describing it nicely.

What do you want to compare Sunshine ?
 
I haven't actually searched to see what the general consensus is on Peyton, around here. Is he pretty much considered "best regular season qb ever", as well as "worst postseason choker ever"? I'm gonna have to do some research on the local opinions...

Second-best regular season QB, worst postseason choker ever

PFnV
 
Regarding Tebow fans who will be gone if Tebow's gone:

Screw the love-fest. Then it'll be good riddance -- including if the improbable happens, all the hunches are right, all the stars align, and he turns into an NFL QB, and you stick around 10 years.

I've never understood being a "one-man fan" for a favorite player, or saying "ho hummm, I like the Pats because I like this player, but I hope the Bears beat them this week because I like two Bears players. Soul rending but I had to make a call..."

I am openly questioning your Fanhood.

Come to the Pats because you like Tebow, fine, but WTF? Do you even follow the NFL? I mean what, did Tebow personally massage your naughty bits down in Florida or something?

I didn't become a Raiders fan when Plunkett left, and I didn't think "we" won anything when he had some success there. I liked David Givens okay but I never became a Titans fan, and I like Randy Moss just fine, but I've never been a [your team here] fan. I'm not a Broncos fan because Welker's there. I'm not a KC fan because Cassel's there (he's still there, right?)

If Brady left for (say) Chicago, I wouldn't be a Bears fan, and if I were a Peyton-era Colts fan I would not now be a Broncos fan. Because, damn.

So yeah fine let's all coexist and everything, but to me you're a bunch of former Jets fans team-shopping. Worse, you're just not fans. You're idolators.

This team and this franchise has a proud tradition that adds up to more than a logo and some laundry. It starts with an owner that every goddam person in this fan-base will tell you is, in our eyes, the class of the league. It moves on to a head coach who, to a man, we'll tell you is one of the all-time greats. And yes, it encompasses memories and "birthright," or at least football-consciousness-birthright.

You're coming to people who went through fan hell for years, then soared to fan heaven, and everything in between -- all for a team. Even were we not blessed with the special aspects above named, we are now and have been for some time the quintessential team team, the one that made the silly pre-game individual introductions look like the crap they were in one fell swoop, as surely as grunge did to the hair bands.

And beyond whatever's "special" about our team, it's our team. Even if we were (unimaginably) the Jets' fans, or the Jags' fans, or whatevah, you're mixing in your infatuation with one particular person with an abiding passion for a team that for many of us has lasted decades.

God help me, but if you met with something like this response among Jets' fans, I have to (to some extent) agree with them.

So sorry for the core dump. Here's what I hope for you. I hope you get into the Patriots because Tebow led you there. Perhaps that was his mission, PTL, amen. I hope you stick around and hang on every play, every season, every 45-yard field goal. I hope you stick around until you "get it," and I hope that you'll make me feel justified in retrospect, when I say,

Welcome.

(Now live up to it goddammit!)

[/rant]

All this "not real fans like us" stuff comes across as pathetic and clingy. Like "I will not open my heart to you and be your friend because you are not what you seem. The rest of us Pats fans have a special bond."

Get over it. It's the internet. Makes for many fellow travelers. You're not looking for friends, neither are we. Tebow's going to ride the pine, assuming he even makes the squad. Quit expending oxygen over the issue of of Tebow's fans not being real Pats fans. Everybody starts following a team sometime over some development -- it either sticks or it doesn't.
 
Even though all of that is true, I will add that I loved seeing the Steelers lose that game. The fact Tebow was the QB made it even more delicious. They're my number one most hated team and fanbase for a whole bunch of reasons.

I can watch the Tebow to Decker play over and over again and it never gets old.

You must not have started watching it over and over again yet since it was tebow to Thomas.
 
How some of you could even call yourself "men" is beyond me because men have a core placement of beliefs that begins with our belief in a team and not a player.

Part of me looks forward to your inevitable emotional breakdown and subsequent banning because I love watching that sort of stuff erupt on a message board and the other part of me would miss getting your daily 'most ridiculous thing I've read on patsfans.com yet' post.
 
You must not have started watching it over and over again yet since it was tebow to Thomas.

LOL, whoops. Yes, Thomas it was.

Guess I was too busy laughing at the Steelers defense!
 
What do you want to compare Sunshine ?

2011 QB Rankings

Completion percentage – 34th
Passing yards – 32nd
Passing yards per game – 34th
Yards per attempt – 28th
Passing Touchdowns – 27th
Times sacked – 12th (more than Tom Brady had in 16 games)
QB rating – 28th

Please note that these rankings are out of 34 total quarterbacks (14 attempts per game) therefore Tebow ranked dead last in 2, and in the bottom of all ranks except times sacked. Am I missing something?

So I have to ask the question Demo; are you lobbying for any of these players below to be quarterback in the NFL?

Curtis Painter
Matt Cassel
Matt Moore
Tarvaris Jackson
Colt McCoy
Kyle Orton
Matt Hasselbeck
Rex Grossman
John Skelton
Ryan Fitzpatrick
 
Curtis Painter
Matt Cassel
Matt Moore
Tarvaris Jackson
Colt McCoy
Kyle Orton
Matt Hasselbeck
Rex Grossman
John Skelton
Ryan Fitzpatrick

I'd take Cassel, Moore, Jackson, Orton, Hasselback and Fitzpatrick over both Mallett and Tebow at this point.
 
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