Last years roster players you'd expect to be cut...

[jmt57]

Niko Koutouvides - a whopping four tackles last season.

Niko Koutouvides, LB for the New England Patriots at NFL.com

You may have a point, though I would hesitate to judge a player on just one stat (e.g., all DL and LB on sacks, or all DB on interceptions). I will note that Koutouvides did lead all players on the club with 317 special team snaps in 2012; something tells me that if he was not effective then the Pats would have replaced him with one of many other available alternatives.

Does that guarantee Koutouvides a roster spot in 2013?

Absolutely not.

However, I am not yet ready to place him in to the 'no way' or 'highly doubtful' categories when it comes to his chances of making the roster. History tells us for a certain number of backups their play on special teams rather than their position play is the determining factor. Despite his meager number of tackles, Koutouvides is still viewed by Belichick as a good special teams player; if that was not the case then he would have joined Tracy White as a player who was effectively told his services were no longer required, by not being re-signed.

 

[Deus Irae]

I'll help you out there bud.


DEUS IRAE

Let me help you out, since you don't seem to have the ability to grasp what happened. The poster called someone a hypocrite for something that wasn't hypocritical. Instead of calling the person names, or anything like that, I simply noted the definition of "hypocrite" and told him that he was wrong.

Instead of nipping at my ankles, maybe you should be taking some remedial vocabulary classes.

 

[DaBruinz]

Just my opinion. However, if he makes the final 53 than I'll support him as a Patriot.

Opinions are usually based on some sort of fact. Not just pulled out of thin air and thrown down for all to see unless you are just looking for attention.

 

[DaBruinz]

Based on opinion of what I prefer. That is all.

On what you prefer? Could you be any more vague? Seriously.

Talib has been the BEST cornerback at camp this year, bar none. Yet, you, in your opinion (based on what you prefer) think he'll be cut??

Yes, in years past, Belichick has cut veterans like Sanders & Meriweather as surprises, but do you really believe that Talib falls into that?

For that matter, Talib won one of the off-season awards and has been recognized by his teammates as really having stepped up..

So, again, could you explain your opinion? Or are you just going to give the "Because I said so" spiel?

 

[DaBruinz]

I overlooked Tarpinian being on the roster last season I thought he finished the year on PA, I agree with him.

I like Cole as a ST, I think his 4.3 speed is really a dynamic addition.

I think that Cole's speed is over-rated. Furthermore, it was he and Koutivedes who blew the coverage on the long Run-back against San Fran and against Baltimore.

 

[Brady6]

You may have a point, though I would hesitate to judge a player on just one stat (e.g., all DL and LB on sacks, or all DB on interceptions). I will note that Koutouvides did lead all players on the club with 317 special team snaps in 2012; something tells me that if he was not effective then the Pats would have replaced him with one of many other available alternatives.

Does that guarantee Koutouvides a roster spot in 2013?

Absolutely not.

However, I am not yet ready to place him in to the 'no way' or 'highly doubtful' categories when it comes to his chances of making the roster. History tells us for a certain number of backups their play on special teams rather than their position play is the determining factor. Despite his meager number of tackles, Koutouvides is still viewed by Belichick as a good special teams player; if that was not the case then he would have joined Tracy White as a player who was effectively told his services were no longer required, by not being re-signed.

I'd expect Koutouvides to be cut during final cuts, however much like last season I wouldn't be surprised to see him return to the team at some point during the season. He holds residence in CT and seems to have a good relationship with Belichick.

 

[Joker]

It's unfair to single out Deus as the lone hypocrite. We're all hypocrites.

Not me! I'm a HYPNOCRITE.....

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

This is a very interesting situation to keep an eye on in my opinion. It's certainly a gamble of sorts, especially with Mesko's ability to successfully pin the ball inside of the 20 yd line.

However, any and every contract situation should be taken into account during the salary cap era, so Mesko's situation isn't any different. On top of that, he'll be a free agent when the season is over, so the hope is definitely that any younger, cheaper player will be able to take over for a lessened cost.

There are some here stating that cutting Mesko this season would save the team approx. 900k, but the report that I read today only stated 300k--although I believe that it was Underhill's blog from masslive, so he may have been incorrect. Either way it will save the team money this season and more importantly--moving forward.

"By keeping Ryan, the Patriots would save $300,000 against the salary cap. Mesko is set to become a free agent after the season." (courtesy of masslive.com/Nick Underhill)

If only, if only there was a resource to answer these cap questions

Miguel's UNOFFICIAL 2013 Patriots Salary Cap Information Page

 

[DaBruinz]

Kevin O'Connell and Tyrone McKenzie only lasted one season with the New England Patriots.

Draft Finder Query Results - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Two out of how many draft picks in 13 years?

Again, he defined it as rare. Not unheard of..

 

[DaBruinz]

Listening to Talib when he gets in front of a microphone and watching how hard he works on every rep in the drills at camp, I have a feeling that the change of scenery did good things for him. TB was not a good fit and this could be a Corey Dillon-type situation. Dillon's problems were also domestic violence in nature. I hope this works out. God knows the Patriots need a break.

Cuts: I see Cunningham, Dowling and Mesko as the big ones. Cole, Tarpinian, Koutouvides, etc., are guys who may leave and return as shadow roster guys if they don't get snatched up. Mesko's contract should not be a reason to cut him.

People keep mentioning Mesko, but I've heard nothing that makes me think that Allen is any better than Mesko. The reports that were out there mention that Allen's hang-times are .1-.3 seconds less than Mesko's, though they have more yardage. That's not a good thing. It usually means you're outkicking your coverage.

 

[DaBruinz]

OK, I like this. We now have a complete base list

1) Develin

2) Aiken

3) Rivera

4) Tarpinian

5) Koutouvides

6) Ebner

7) Dowling or Cole

Which Aiken are you referring to? There are two of them. Kamir and Danny.

I think that Cole gets cut before Dowling. I also wouldn't be surprised if Fletcher (who can't stay healthy) get's cut.

 

[Brady6]

Definitely (barring unforeseen injuries):

1, 2, 3, 4, 5

Probably:

Ebner or Gregory or T. Wilson

Cole or Dowling

AT I'm not sure if I understand but are you suggesting Tavon Wilson as a potential cut?

 

[Brady6]

I think that Cole's speed is over-rated. Furthermore, it was he and Koutivedes who blew the coverage on the long Run-back against San Fran and against Baltimore.

The coverage was blown by the unit, not by just those 2 players, and if you were to blame them you’d have to also include Slater.

Regarding Cole’s speed I respectfully disagree; anybody who paid attention to our special teams units coverage (which was middle of the pack) last season would of seen that Cole made more impact plays than anyone not named Matthew Slater and his speed was the primary factor in those plays. I’m not suggesting Cole is a lock to make this roster but if improving the coverage over last season roster is a priority, I really cannot believe releasing their second best special teams player in coverage (in my opinion) is a good idea, and certainly not to keep a 3rd string QB or a developmental WR/TE that will likely never see the field.

 

[DaBruinz]

The bigger benefit to keeping Allen would probably come in future years.

Frankly, I don't think punting is that big a deal, so trading down -- if that's what it is -- to save money is fine by me. It doesn't make that many yards difference over the course of a season, and they're less valuable yards than most, in that they don't contribute directly to getting first downs.

WOW. I'd put money that Belichick would say you were wrong.

In fact, one only has to look back a few years to when the Pats had to sign Todd Sauerbrun and BB told him to NOT kick it to Pac-man Jones and Sauerbrun didn't. However, Jones had the SPEED to make the Pats pay because Sauerbrun had outkicked the coverage.

Punting is a big deal. Saying it's not is taking for granted a part of the game.

 

[Lamanai]

If only, if only there was a resource to answer these cap questions

Miguel's UNOFFICIAL 2013 Patriots Salary Cap Information Page

In an effort to get the answer myself, I looked at Miguel's cap page, but couldn't reconcile the cap savings of $768,000 with Mesko's salary and prorated bonus. Jason's cap page has the savings at $1.3 million (hate to rely on a Jets fan, but he's earned some respect too). After subtracting Allen's $400,000 salary, you get either $300,000 or you get $900,000 depending upon what numbers you rely on.

I'm sure there is an answer for this, but I can see how there would be two numbers floating around, both using reliable sources.

 

[Brady6]

On what you prefer? Could you be any more vague? Seriously.

Talib has been the BEST cornerback at camp this year, bar none. Yet, you, in your opinion (based on what you prefer) think he'll be cut??

Yes, in years past, Belichick has cut veterans like Sanders & Meriweather as surprises, but do you really believe that Talib falls into that?

For that matter, Talib won one of the off-season awards and has been recognized by his teammates as really having stepped up..

So, again, could you explain your opinion? Or are you just going to give the "Because I said so" spiel?

He doesn’t like Talib as a person :Cry: because Talib does a ton of Adderall, gets hyped up:beatingcoming:and pistol whips :violent: his sisters boyfriends. C-Cat is a new fan of the Patriots (Tebow Fan) so he did not have to witness our secondary :doh: the last 4-5 years; if he would be like the rest of us be able to forgive just about any transgression of a DB capable of turning his head in coverage

 

[Bruins29]

Please stop acknowledging Christan Cat.

I cant wait until Tblow gets cut or is just gone from this team. These obsessed, clowns who follow Tblow around the country like he is some football God make people absolutely hate him.

Go find a real hero not some 3rd string virgin. Granted I am sure Tblow being a virgin is why so many of these lemmings love him. They have something they can relate to with their own virginity.

 

[Brady6]

Please stop acknowledging Christan Cat.

I cant wait until Tblow gets cut or is just gone from this team. These obsessed, clowns who follow Tblow around the country like he is some football God make people absolutely hate him.

Go find a real hero not some 3rd string virgin. Granted I am sure Tblow being a virgin is why so many of these lemmings love him. They have something they can relate to with their own virginity.

http://m.bleacherreport.com/article...w-is-the-worst-thing-ever-to-happen-to-sports

It's actually a really funny list.

 

[DaBruinz]

The coverage was blown by the unit, not by just those 2 players, and if you were to blame them you’d have to also include Slater.

Wrong. Go back and watch it again. Those two came out of their lanes both times and were directly responsible for opening the holes that the return man used to break the big run. Attempting to blame Slater or the rest of the unit for their mistakes is ridiculous and shows that you just weren't paying attention.

Regarding Cole’s speed I respectfully disagree; anybody who paid attention to our special teams units coverage (which was middle of the pack) last season would of seen that Cole made more impact plays than anyone not named Matthew Slater and his speed was the primary factor in those plays. I’m not suggesting Cole is a lock to make this roster but if improving the coverage over last season roster is a priority, I really cannot believe releasing their second best special teams player in coverage (in my opinion) is a good idea, and certainly not to keep a 3rd string QB or a developmental WR/TE that will likely never see the field.

Disagree all you want but you are still 100% wrong. Cole didn't have near the impact on Special Teams (particularly kick coverage) that you claim.

Cole wasn't even close to the 2nd best special teams player on the coverage units. He was middle of the pack, at best, behind Slater, Ebner, and Tracy White. BTW, Who said anything about a 3rd string QB or a Developmental WR/TE? Reality is, though, the Pats need a 3rd TE more than they need Cole.

Cole was not nearly the special team player you make him out to be and he was downright horrid as a reserve CB. The drop off from Arrington to him is clearly what prompted BB to draft Ryan and Harmon. For the SOLE purpose of replacing Cole on Special Teams and as a reserve/Dime back.

 

[Brady6]

Wrong. Go back and watch it again. Those two came out of their lanes both times and were directly responsible for opening the holes that the return man used to break the big run. Attempting to blame Slater or the rest of the unit for their mistakes is ridiculous and shows that you just weren't paying attention.




Disagree all you want but you are still 100% wrong. Cole didn't have near the impact on Special Teams (particularly kick coverage) that you claim.

Cole wasn't even close to the 2nd best special teams player on the coverage units. He was middle of the pack, at best, behind Slater, Ebner, and Tracy White. BTW, Who said anything about a 3rd string QB or a Developmental WR/TE? Reality is, though, the Pats need a 3rd TE more than they need Cole.

Cole was not nearly the special team player you make him out to be and he was downright horrid as a reserve CB. The drop off from Arrington to him is clearly what prompted BB to draft Ryan and Harmon. For the SOLE purpose of replacing Cole on Special Teams and as a reserve/Dime back.

Man I've never seen anyone make so many brash statements in one post in my life.

Anyway I'm not going to argue the impact of Cole with you it not an efficient use of my time, and honesty I don't debate with people who make stubborn statements like 100% wrong with not a single thing to back it up other than their own bias reasons to add to merit their argument, and then back that statement up with the assertion that they know the sole purpose for why BB drafted a players.

The amusing part is the fact you don't even see the error of your own ways, as you completely contradict yourself by in one statement saying Cole was an average player or worse, and then making the bold statement that BB used his two third round picks solely to replace Cole.