The 2013 Prospect Thread

[Merril Hoge's Tie Knot]

I'm with Mayo. I'm not convinced adding a first round pick to the secondary is desirable (or 2nd round for that matter). The one possible exception for me is David Amerson and that's only because I'm intrigued by his height and play-making ability. I do have other concerns with him.

That's not to say that I don't love watching Matt Elam, I really do, he's a fantastic player although I'm less convinced he's a great fit for the Pats.

There are some really nice later round safety options in this draft: Dexter McCoil, Shamarko Thomas, Rontez Miles, John Boyett, Malcolm Bronson, DJ Swearinger and others.

The thing I love the most about Matt Elam is the energy he brings to the field. It's almost tangible. It's like Ray Lewis or Troy Polamalu. I don't think we need him or any safety for that matter, but if we took Elam I wouldn't mind. I just love the player. He'd complement McCourty (who has been on fire lately) well too.

 

[mackenzie45220]

Care to expand on this?

I already have
Robert Woods- 2013 NFL Draft Scouting Report - NFL Mocks - 2013 NFL Mock Draft, Fantasy Football, NFL News, and NFL Mock Draft Databases
The projection is outdated (was considered a top 10 prospect at the time), and, if anything, my grade of him is now lower.

 

[mackenzie45220]

The thing I love the most about Matt Elam is the energy he brings to the field. It's almost tangible. It's like Ray Lewis or Troy Polamalu. I don't think we need him or any safety for that matter, but if we took Elam I wouldn't mind. I just love the player. He'd complement McCourty (who has been on fire lately) well too.

That's fair. Frankly, I like Elam as a top 20 prospect. But I like Jefferson in the top 30 AND he might be available at 60. It's all about value.

 

[manxman2601]

DeAndre Hopkins had a monster night and barring a bad 40 time, if he declares he should be a first round pick for somebody. His nickname is "Nuke!" I wouldn't mind the Foxboro faithful chanting "Nuke!" every time he catches the ball from Brady

In all seriousness, he showed amazing hands tonight and tremendous route running. Had a fantastic clutch catch on 4th and long in the final two minutes. I do wonder whether he's 4.4 quick though.

 

[kennyb]

DeAndre Hopkins had a monster night and barring a bad 40 time, if he declares he should be a first round pick for somebody. His nickname is "Nuke!" I wouldn't mind the Foxboro faithful chanting "Nuke!" every time he catches the ball from Brady

In all seriousness, he showed amazing hands tonight and tremendous route running. Had a fantastic clutch catch on 4th and long in the final two minutes. I do wonder whether he's 4.4 quick though.

malliciah goodman looked good too at DE.

 

[Merril Hoge's Tie Knot]

I already have
Robert Woods- 2013 NFL Draft Scouting Report - NFL Mocks - 2013 NFL Mock Draft, Fantasy Football, NFL News, and NFL Mock Draft Databases
The projection is outdated (was considered a top 10 prospect at the time), and, if anything, my grade of him is now lower.

You said "He sucks." He definitely does not "suck."

I didn't read the report. I will, but I don't have time now. The film awaits.

That's fair. Frankly, I like Elam as a top 20 prospect. But I like Jefferson in the top 30 AND he might be available at 60. It's all about value.

God damn right. I haven't seen Jefferson play so I can't comment. Who would you him compare too?

 

[mayoclinic]

Russ Lande says scouts like Manx's boy Terron Armstead:

Terron Armstead, OT / OG, Arkansas-PineBluff, Senior (6044, 303 and 4.83): All fall NFL scouts were flocking to Pine Bluff to evaluate Armstead and nearly all of them have been impressed. At 6-4 with 34+ arms, Armstead has the length to stay at tackle or make the move inside to guard depending on the team that drafts him. A great athlete with rare explosiveness for an offensive lineman, Armstead makes it look easy getting outside to block in space. Blessed with the natural strength to control man once he locks on, he is able to do so despite not blocking with a nasty or aggressive attitude. In addition to being a dominant football player at Pine Bluff, Armstead has been one of the best track athletes in the SWAC and if he can continue developing that athleticism onto the football field he could become a star in the NFL. Do not be surprised if Armstead ends up being a third or fourth round pick in the 2013 Draft.

What NFP is hearing - Draft Rumblings. | National Football Post

Why am I not surprised that scouts would be high on someone Manx likes?

 

[manxman2601]

Russ Lande says scouts like Manx's boy Terron Armstead:



What NFP is hearing - Draft Rumblings. | National Football Post

Why am I not surprised that scouts would be high on someone Manx likes?

Thanks. Let's see. Kyle Long was being talked of as a seventh rounder when you "discovered" him. He's now being talked of as top-100. Dion Jordan could go top 10 etc etc. You do damn well yourself.

We should, as PatsFans, set up a Blesto rival.

 

[mayoclinic]

Thanks. Let's see. Kyle Long was being talked of as a seventh rounder when you "discovered" him. He's now being talked of as top-100. Dion Jordan could go top 10 etc etc. You do damn well yourself.

We should, as PatsFans, set up a Blesto rival.

Hey, when I jump on the Armstead bandwagon and probably end including him in some mocks, I fully expect to see some reference's to "Mayo's boy Armstead" down the road.

 

[mackenzie45220]

DeAndre Hopkins had a monster night and barring a bad 40 time, if he declares he should be a first round pick for somebody. His nickname is "Nuke!" I wouldn't mind the Foxboro faithful chanting "Nuke!" every time he catches the ball from Brady

In all seriousness, he showed amazing hands tonight and tremendous route running. Had a fantastic clutch catch on 4th and long in the final two minutes. I do wonder whether he's 4.4 quick though.

I agree with all of the above. He doesn't have 4.4 speed, but he is an elite route runner who knows how to deceive with his eyes. He reminds me of Cecil Shorts (who quietly had a pretty good season).

 

[mackenzie45220]

You said "He sucks." He definitely does not "suck."

I didn't read the report. I will, but I don't have time now. The film awaits.



God damn right. I haven't seen Jefferson play so I can't comment. Who would you him compare too?

A short Eric Weddle comes to mind. Maybe Reggie Nelson, who has really made strides the last two years. Or Quintin Mikell

 

[mayoclinic]

Corey Lemonier declares for the draft:

The Auburn Plainsman - Corey Lemonier declares for NFL Draft

According to the article, Lemonier thinks he'll be a 3rd round pick.

 

[mackenzie45220]

Going back to Addae; his flexibility and quickness makes him harder to block than any safety in this draft class. He finds ways to simply get around large people, and it makes him a playmaker. On top of that, he's tough as nails and has great instincts in coverage. Short arms can make breaking up passes difficult, but he's a good athlete and he's always in good position

 

[mayoclinic]

I'm with Mayo. I'm not convinced adding a first round pick to the secondary is desirable (or 2nd round for that matter). The one possible exception for me is David Amerson and that's only because I'm intrigued by his height and play-making ability. I do have other concerns with him.

That's not to say that I don't love watching Matt Elam, I really do, he's a fantastic player although I'm less convinced he's a great fit for the Pats.

The thing I love the most about Matt Elam is the energy he brings to the field. It's almost tangible. It's like Ray Lewis or Troy Polamalu. I don't think we need him or any safety for that matter, but if we took Elam I wouldn't mind. I just love the player. He'd complement McCourty (who has been on fire lately) well too.

As mentioned, reports suggest that Elam will be declaring after all:

Sources: Florida expecting to lose Sharrif Floyd, Matt Elam to NFL Draft | Gator Bytes blog: University of Florida | The Palm Beach Post

I agree about loving Elam's energy and aggressiveness. It's possible he could be the BPA when he pick, and I wouldn't cry if we took him. I love the player, and see some Polamalu in him. But in general I don't really want to go DB that early.

NFL DraftScout currently has Amerson ranked #83, and Tony Pauline also thinks he'll end up being a 3rd round pick. If the Pats trade back and get an 3rd round pick, I'd be thrilled to pick up Amerson. What about something like this (I'm going to throw in an extra 3rd/4th round pick, assuming we can trade something):

2a.Kyle Van Noy, LB, BYU. Move Hightower up on the DL. Van Noy would provide the coverage ability and range at LB that we currently lack. I'd go for Trent Murphy if he declares.

2b. Markus Wheaton, WR, Oregon St. Re-sign Welker and Edelman, and you have an awfully nice WR group.

3a. David Amerson, DB, North Carolina St.. DJ Swearinger and Tony Jefferson might be alternatives, but like Manx I'm intrigued by the idea of putting Amerson at safety and having his range and ball skills paired with McCourty.

3b. Brian Winters, OG, Kent St. In a year or so we could probably move Mankins to RG. Winters has some Mankins in him. "Manx's binky" Terron Armstead might be an option if Winters is gone (maybe we trade back and get Armstead plus Brandon Williams).

3c/4. Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern. 6'2" 328# with sub 5.0 speed who had 8.5 sacks and 16.5 TFL as the NT, so he has some quickness.

Add someone like Reid Fragel or Luke Marquardt late, and we've addressed most major needs.

 

[patsfaninpa]

As mentioned, reports suggest that Elam will be declaring after all:

Sources: Florida expecting to lose Sharrif Floyd, Matt Elam to NFL Draft | Gator Bytes blog: University of Florida | The Palm Beach Post

I agree about loving Elam's energy and aggressiveness. It's possible he could be the BPA when he pick, and I wouldn't cry if we took him. I love the player, and see some Polamalu in him. But in general I don't really want to go DB that early.

NFL DraftScout currently has Amerson ranked #83, and Tony Pauline also thinks he'll end up being a 3rd round pick. If the Pats trade back and get an 3rd round pick, I'd be thrilled to pick up Amerson. What about something like this (I'm going to throw in an extra 3rd/4th round pick, assuming we can trade something):

2a.Kyle Van Noy, LB, BYU. Move Hightower up on the DL. Van Noy would provide the coverage ability and range at LB that we currently lack. I'd go for Trent Murphy if he declares.

2b. Markus Wheaton, WR, Oregon St. Re-sign Welker and Edelman, and you have an awfully nice WR group.

3a. David Amerson, DB, North Carolina St.. DJ Swearinger and Tony Jefferson might be alternatives, but like Manx I'm intrigued by the idea of putting Amerson at safety and having his range and ball skills paired with McCourty.

3b. Brian Winters, OG, Kent St. In a year or so we could probably move Mankins to RG. Winters has some Mankins in him. "Manx's binky" Terron Armstead might be an option if Winters is gone (maybe we trade back and get Armstead plus Brandon Williams).

3c/4. Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern. 6'2" 328# with sub 5.0 speed who had 8.5 sacks and 16.5 TFL as the NT, so he has some quickness.

Add someone like Reid Fragel or Luke Marquardt late, and we've addressed most major needs.

Love that Mock mayo. Van Noy has announced he's returning to BYU though. But, I'd take Khaseem Greene there. I'd be satisfied with; Greene, Wheaton, Amerson and Winters. We didn't get that DT we both want. But, maybe Fortson can develop a little. Or, sign a vet.

 

[mackenzie45220]

As mentioned, reports suggest that Elam will be declaring after all:

Sources: Florida expecting to lose Sharrif Floyd, Matt Elam to NFL Draft | Gator Bytes blog: University of Florida | The Palm Beach Post

I agree about loving Elam's energy and aggressiveness. It's possible he could be the BPA when he pick, and I wouldn't cry if we took him. I love the player, and see some Polamalu in him. But in general I don't really want to go DB that early.

NFL DraftScout currently has Amerson ranked #83, and Tony Pauline also thinks he'll end up being a 3rd round pick. If the Pats trade back and get an 3rd round pick, I'd be thrilled to pick up Amerson. What about something like this (I'm going to throw in an extra 3rd/4th round pick, assuming we can trade something):

2a.Kyle Van Noy, LB, BYU. Move Hightower up on the DL. Van Noy would provide the coverage ability and range at LB that we currently lack. I'd go for Trent Murphy if he declares.

2b. Markus Wheaton, WR, Oregon St. Re-sign Welker and Edelman, and you have an awfully nice WR group.

3a. David Amerson, DB, North Carolina St.. DJ Swearinger and Tony Jefferson might be alternatives, but like Manx I'm intrigued by the idea of putting Amerson at safety and having his range and ball skills paired with McCourty.

3b. Brian Winters, OG, Kent St. In a year or so we could probably move Mankins to RG. Winters has some Mankins in him. "Manx's binky" Terron Armstead might be an option if Winters is gone (maybe we trade back and get Armstead plus Brandon Williams).

3c/4. Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern. 6'2" 328# with sub 5.0 speed who had 8.5 sacks and 16.5 TFL as the NT, so he has some quickness.

Add someone like Reid Fragel or Luke Marquardt late, and we've addressed most major needs.

I actually did get my hands on one game of Brandon Williams film. I wan't particularly impressed. My notes:
"Brandon Williams #66 senior defensive tackle/nose tackle prospect mediocre height excellent bulk good speed for size good numbers had 44 tackles and 8 sacks in only 9 games in 2011 also had 5 pass breakups poor balance mediocre quickness off the ball gets good leverage doesn’t look very bulky on film very strong could improve hand usage looks slow on film lacks range solid quickness off the ball accelerates quickly could improve hand usage mediocre instincts typically a 3 technique vulnerable to cut blocks can’t contain the quarterback on the field for every play pretty strong poor instincts can’t make tackles in traffic terrific strength can flash incredible quickness bench presses over 400lbs not an every down player mediocre stamina penetrates easily looks unimpressive good tackler good strength uses ideal tackling fundamentals tough and strong mediocre on field awareness mediocre instincts plays with solid on field intensity left the game due to mysterious injury"
I know it seems like I contradict myself a lot with his quickness. That usually means he accelerates quickly, but sometimes can't anticipate the snap. Regardless, he's inconsistent, and his instincts and hand usage need a ton of work.
That being said, Cory Grissom is a good player. Lack of flexibility and length makes him useless against the pass, but he's powerful, quick, athletic, and strong.

 

[mayoclinic]

Love that Mock mayo. Van Noy has announced he's returning to BYU though. But, I'd take Khaseem Greene there. I'd be satisfied with; Greene, Wheaton, Amerson and Winters. We didn't get that DT we both want. But, maybe Fortson can develop a little. Or, sign a vet.

Damn, hadn't heard about Van Noy returning. I want Trent Murphy, anyway. And I think that Brandon Williams can be that "DT we both want", if we can find a way to pick him up. He'll be playing in the Senior Bowl - keep an eye out for him.

 

[patsfaninpa]

Damn, hadn't heard about Van Noy returning. I want Trent Murphy, anyway. And I think that Brandon Williams can be that "DT we both want", if we can find a way to pick him up. He'll be playing in the Senior Bowl - keep an eye out for him.

Fantasy trade proposal to get you that 4th. If we re-up Woodhead, would you deal Vereen for a 4th? Could we get a 4th for him?

 

[manxman2601]

As mentioned, reports suggest that Elam will be declaring after all:

Sources: Florida expecting to lose Sharrif Floyd, Matt Elam to NFL Draft | Gator Bytes blog: University of Florida | The Palm Beach Post

I agree about loving Elam's energy and aggressiveness. It's possible he could be the BPA when he pick, and I wouldn't cry if we took him. I love the player, and see some Polamalu in him. But in general I don't really want to go DB that early.

NFL DraftScout currently has Amerson ranked #83, and Tony Pauline also thinks he'll end up being a 3rd round pick. If the Pats trade back and get an 3rd round pick, I'd be thrilled to pick up Amerson. What about something like this (I'm going to throw in an extra 3rd/4th round pick, assuming we can trade something):

2a.Kyle Van Noy, LB, BYU. Move Hightower up on the DL. Van Noy would provide the coverage ability and range at LB that we currently lack. I'd go for Trent Murphy if he declares.

2b. Markus Wheaton, WR, Oregon St. Re-sign Welker and Edelman, and you have an awfully nice WR group.

3a. David Amerson, DB, North Carolina St.. DJ Swearinger and Tony Jefferson might be alternatives, but like Manx I'm intrigued by the idea of putting Amerson at safety and having his range and ball skills paired with McCourty.

3b. Brian Winters, OG, Kent St. In a year or so we could probably move Mankins to RG. Winters has some Mankins in him. "Manx's binky" Terron Armstead might be an option if Winters is gone (maybe we trade back and get Armstead plus Brandon Williams).

3c/4. Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern. 6'2" 328# with sub 5.0 speed who had 8.5 sacks and 16.5 TFL as the NT, so he has some quickness.

Add someone like Reid Fragel or Luke Marquardt late, and we've addressed most major needs.

Swearinger is intriguing. He can hit like Elam and runs around like Philip Thomas.

As we're all talking about safeties today, I've been watching some Vaccaro and I'm not all that impressed (if he's a first/second rounder). He has shed loads of athleticism but he's so reliant on it - doesn't seem to play with his head at all. When he comes up in run support, he absolutely flies up the field but doesn't seem to think about the fact that he has to make the tackle. Which usually results in the RB running past him with Vaccaro at full stretch trying to make the tackle. He's Patrick Chung basically.

 

[manxman2601]

I actually did get my hands on one game of Brandon Williams film. I wan't particularly impressed. My notes:
"Brandon Williams #66 senior defensive tackle/nose tackle prospect mediocre height excellent bulk good speed for size good numbers had 44 tackles and 8 sacks in only 9 games in 2011 also had 5 pass breakups poor balance mediocre quickness off the ball gets good leverage doesn’t look very bulky on film very strong could improve hand usage looks slow on film lacks range solid quickness off the ball accelerates quickly could improve hand usage mediocre instincts typically a 3 technique vulnerable to cut blocks can’t contain the quarterback on the field for every play pretty strong poor instincts can’t make tackles in traffic terrific strength can flash incredible quickness bench presses over 400lbs not an every down player mediocre stamina penetrates easily looks unimpressive good tackler good strength uses ideal tackling fundamentals tough and strong mediocre on field awareness mediocre instincts plays with solid on field intensity left the game due to mysterious injury"
I know it seems like I contradict myself a lot with his quickness. That usually means he accelerates quickly, but sometimes can't anticipate the snap. Regardless, he's inconsistent, and his instincts and hand usage need a ton of work.
That being said, Cory Grissom is a good player. Lack of flexibility and length makes him useless against the pass, but he's powerful, quick, athletic, and strong.

Have you watched Caraun Reed of Princeton? He's not a run stopper but looks to have good length for someone reportedly 6'2" (which I think is low-balling him). LDE and interior rusher I see him as.