Lombardi: Seymour's not looking for a contract, he's just pissed.

[mgteich]

I suspect that we know as almost much about the psychology of coaching and athletes as we know about other aspect of football that we discuss.

All our specualtion is just that, whether it is about what Sey or Belichick might be considering or whether we are discussing blocking assignments. We seem to have almost equal ignorance on a vast array of subjects.

FWIW I do think that this forum could do with a whole lot less 'expert analysis' on the inner workings and motivations of players and coaches alike. There's definitely a certain subset of posters who seem to feel uniquely qualified to tell everyone exactly what every player/coach is thinking and why, which has always struck me as more than a little ridiculous.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

FWIW I do think that this forum could do with a whole lot less 'expert analysis' on the inner workings and motivations of players and coaches alike. There's definitely a certain subset of posters who seem to feel uniquely qualified to tell everyone exactly what every player/coach is thinking and why, which has always struck me as more than a little ridiculous.

Take that back. I refuse to be called an expert :disagreement:

 

[Patjew]

I suspect that we know as almost much about the psychology of coaching and athletes as we know about other aspect of football that we discuss.

All our specualtion is just that, whether it is about what Sey or Belichick might be considering or whether we are discussing blocking assignments. We seem to have almost equal ignorance on a vast array of subjects.

That's very well put. Although I'm particularly ignornant on certain subjects.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

That's very well put. Although I'm particularly ignornant on certain subjects.

and you're short

 

[thewaylifeshouldbe]

That's very well put. Although I'm particularly ignornant on certain subjects.

I posted this in the other Seymour thread. Curious if any of you have the interpretation skills to establish if it has merit.

Somewhere in the numerous Seymour threads were the recent media comments that Seymour believed a new contract was being negotiated, and that the shock/surprise was enhanced because of this.

Unlikely it would occur, but is it possible his agent could use this rule to establish lack of good faith in negotiations?-

From Article 14 of the NFL Players Contract:

NFL Players Association

Section 8. Good Faith Negotiation:
(a) In addition to complying with specific provisions in this Agreement, any Club or player engaged in negotiations for a Player Contract (including any Club extending, and any player receiving, a Required Tender) is under an obligation to negotiate in good faith.
(b) A Club extending a Required Tender must, for so long as that Tender is extended, have a good faith intention to employ the player receiving the Tender at the Tender compensation level during the upcoming season. It shall be deemed to be a violation of this provision if, while the tender is outstanding, a Club insists that such a player agree to a Player Contract at a compensation level during the upcoming season below that of the Required Tender amount. The foregoing shall not affect any rights that a Club may have under the Player Contract, under this Agreement, or under the Settlement Agreement, including but not limited to the right to terminate the contract, renegotiate the contract, or to trade the player if such termination, renegotiation, or trade is otherwise permitted by the Player Contract, this Agreement, or the Settlement Agreement.

 

[Patjew]

and you're short

Only in comparison to human males.

 

[Patjew]

I posted this in the other Seymour thread. Curious if any of you have the interpretation skills to establish if it has merit.

Somewhere in the numerous Seymour threads were the recent media comments that Seymour believed a new contract was being negotiated, and that the shock/surprise was enhanced because of this.

Unlikely it would occur, but is it possible his agent could use this rule to establish lack of good faith in negotiations?-

From Article 14 of the NFL Players Contract:

Look buddy, I already told you I was ignorant. Don't make me prove it.

 

[thewaylifeshouldbe]

Look buddy, I already told you I was ignorant. Don't make me prove it.

Hell, Patjew.....I figured this place was full of so many geniuses and self-appointed football guru's, that a little exercise in explaining the legalese here would be a walk in the park.

Now, I know you have never, and would never, present yourself as such. But surely you must know a few of them?

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Hell, Patjew.....I figured this place was full of so many geniuses and self-appointed football guru's, that a little exercise in explaining the legalese here would be a walk in the park.

Now, I know you have never, and would never, present yourself as such. But surely you must know a few of them?

if we were so smart, we wouldnt spend all night on a MB

I think the smart people post during the day

 

[ausbacker]

if we were so smart, we wouldnt spend all night on a MB

I think the smart people post during the day

My day time is your night time . I'm not sure what that makes me.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

My day time is your night time . I'm not sure what that makes me.

normal, i think

 

[TruthSeeker]

FWIW I do think that this forum could do with a whole lot less 'expert analysis' on the inner workings and motivations of players and coaches alike. There's definitely a certain subset of posters who seem to feel uniquely qualified to tell everyone exactly what every player/coach is thinking and why, which has always struck me as more than a little ridiculous. It's really manifested itself a lot these last few days in all these Seymour threads, with the general consensus moving from "Seymour always wanted to leave because he's all about money and doesn't care about winning" to "Seymour was never a team player no matter how hard they tried to make him one" to, now that some new info is coming out, "Seymour wanted to stay, but he's fat and lazy and doesn't love football so he's not good anymore".

I'd think that if nothing else, the Randy Moss saga of 2007 would have taught us something. The board's most prolific armchair psychoanalysts were all writing their own thesis statements on exactly why Moss didn't have the necessary drive to be a 'True Patriot' (tm), only to find out very quickly that none of them had any clue what motivates him. We'd like to think that we know now, but to be honest, we still probably don't. The sooner everyone realizes that human personalities in general are complex, multifaceted, and generally resistant to being broken down into one-dimensional caricatures, the better.

Totally agree.

That being said, lots of people love to do this - and in great detail. It's the way of life in the message board world, so we just have to deal with it.

 

[Bostonian1962]

I have no idea whether the Patriots are "loyal" or not. But unless loyalty wins football games, it's irrelevant.

The NFL is a cutthroat business. Players ger hired and fired every day. The salary cap leaves no room for sentimentality.

If you want loyalty, get a dog.

I also think the "Belchick is arrogant" argument is idiotic. Milloy was cut because he underperformed relative to his contract. Brady was a better player than Bledsoe. Both were unpopular decisions. Both were absolutely correct. How is that "arrogant?"

Trading a 30 year old player with one year on his contract and one of the worst agents in the business for a future #1 pick is not arrogant, it's a no brainer.

Belichick tries to not let emotions get in the way. His decision making process is disciplined and objective. He is not afraid to make the tough call. This does not mean that he doesn't make mistakes; clearly he does.

No question that the hard nosed approach can be tough on people, but it comes with the territory. Belichick does whatever he thinks will make his team better. You can decide for yourself whether that makes him arrogant or a good football coach.

Just hopped back on this morning, and this is a great post. Well said Zeus!

 

[shmessy]

I suspect that we know as almost much about the psychology of coaching and athletes as we know about other aspect of football that we discuss.

All our specualtion is just that, whether it is about what Sey or Belichick might be considering or whether we are discussing blocking assignments. We seem to have almost equal ignorance on a vast array of subjects.

Exactly.

It's a fan website forum. This is what fan website forums do.

If anyone is looking for the official authorized autobiography section, its over there by the Starbucks.

 

[Ring 6]

Exactly.

It's a fan website forum. This is what fan website forums do.

If anyone is looking for the official authorized autobiography section, its over there by the Starbucks.

OK. Got it. Anyone can say whatever they want and no one has any right to respond to it. So if I say, Take away the rings and supermodel wife from Brady and what do you have: Ryan Leaf. Thats fine and no one should comment on that opinion.

 

[Patjew]

Hell, Patjew.....I figured this place was full of so many geniuses and self-appointed football guru's, that a little exercise in explaining the legalese here would be a walk in the park.

Now, I know you have never, and would never, present yourself as such. But surely you must know a few of them?

Perhaps a few.

 

[shmessy]

OK. Got it. Anyone can say whatever they want and no one has any right to respond to it. So if I say, Take away the rings and supermodel wife from Brady and what do you have: Ryan Leaf. Thats fine and no one should comment on that opinion.

Quite the opposite.

However you had written:

1) "That is the most ignorant statement Ive seen in a terribly long time.
You have never met either person, yet you have decided to accuse one of being an @ss by comparing him to the other.
I know someone very well who is as close to Mangini as virtually anyone outside his family. And I can tell you that you know absolutely nothing about Eric Mangini the person."

2) "The guy made a negative judgment on both peoples personalities. The fact that he could have no way of knowing is not a defense, it is the crime." (btw, Andy, "crime"?)

3) "Posting on a message board does not entail guessing at the personality and character of someone you never met or know nothing about. This board has survived this long without needing that as a topic, and mot crickets have arrived......"
___________________

Guess what? THAT'S what happens on a website forum when talking about PUBLIC figures. It's not their Facebook page.

Are you really going to claim that you never made a character judgement here about a Terrell Owens or a Michael Vick or a John Tomase?

(and BTW, WHO wrote this a few weeks back?)
*************************
"I think the biggest shame in all of this is that Tony Dungy is 'mentoring' poor ex-felon Vick so he can get back to making multi-millions when he could be mentoring the teenagers who need a father figure but instead will sell and use drugs, become gang members and be dead by the time they are old enough to play QB in the NFL.
But then, that won't get your name on ESPN, and there won't be millions of people giving you credit for the 'success' of Michael Vick being on a football field."
****************************

Evidently you're a close confidante of Mr. Dungy? How do you know his real intentions?

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Quite the opposite.

However you had written:

1) "That is the most ignorant statement Ive seen in a terribly long time.
You have never met either person, yet you have decided to accuse one of being an @ss by comparing him to the other.
I know someone very well who is as close to Mangini as virtually anyone outside his family. And I can tell you that you know absolutely nothing about Eric Mangini the person."

2) "The guy made a negative judgment on both peoples personalities. The fact that he could have no way of knowing is not a defense, it is the crime." (btw, Andy, "crime"?)

3) "Posting on a message board does not entail guessing at the personality and character of someone you never met or know nothing about. This board has survived this long without needing that as a topic, and mot crickets have arrived......"

Guess what? THAT'S what happens on a website forum when talking about PUBLIC figures. It's not their Facebook page.

Are you really going to claim that you never made a character judgement here about a Terrell Owens or a Michael Vick or a John Tomase?

Dear god, are the rest of us going to have to stage an intervention or should we take up a special collection so Ian can take youse guys on a mod retreat... We're told if we have an issue with a mod we should PM them. You guys are on the verge of get a room...

PS you're right though...

 

[shmessy]

Dear god, are the rest of us going to have to stage an intervention or should we take up a special collection so Ian can take youse guys on a mod retreat... We're told if we have an issue with a mod we should PM them. You guys are on the verge of get a room...

PS you're right though...

Mods are people too!

Actually, more to the point, we are posters like anyone else. We can argue, etc. We're no better than anyone else. Ian just asks us to help keep the forum clean every now and then. My only point here is defend people who want to share an honest opinion on public figures even though they don't personally know the public figure.

As I pointed out in my last post, someone was lecturing others against doing the EXACT same thing he HIMSELF does (and in the example given, did a few weeks ago).

Now, has Seymour shown up yet?

 

[JackBauer]

Re: Typical Richard Seymour

I'm surprised to hear someone say this. Maybe before the 2004 season, but not after. Were you a Pats fan then? Check out the contributions of Green who filled in for Seymour during the stretch run and 2004 playoffs.

Before that season, I would have said that Seymour was indespensible to the Pats. When Seymour and Law were out the last few games and the playoffs, many thought the Pats were done. But they won a superbowl.

Not saying that Green is better than Seymour. But I am saying that no one person makes the team. Not even Brady. BB doesn't call that time out as Cassel sneaked for a first against the Colts, and we're in hte playoffs and who knows?

Good players are better than bad players, but the team is the most important thing.

Green is a decent player, no doubt, but he's not going to make us "forget about Seymour."

While he's a good pass rusher, he tends to wear down and is a much bigger liability in the run game. The post was a reflexive response to the annoying tendency amongst fans on this board to denigrate players and downplay their abilities as they're on their way out the door.