Some news on Chad Jackson

[Captain Cliche]

Maybe he will get it, maybe he won't.

In the case of Bethel I think he had problems keeping up smarts wise. Curran said he is like the dog you can trick continually with the same "fake throw the stick trick."

With Jackson I think there was some form of "turd" factor. He showed maturity issues from the get go.

The Patriots flushed a turd.

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

Maybe he will get it, maybe he won't.

In the case of Bethel I think he had problems keeping up smarts wise. Curran said he is like the dog you can trick continually with the same "fake throw the stick trick."

With Jackson I think there was some form of "turd" factor. He showed maturity issues from the get go.

The Patriots flushed a turd.

I don't get this? Doesn't this come out in the interviews with the players prior to the draft? Or are these kids just smart enough to say the right things?

 

[VJCPatriot]

Chad Jackson = Irving Fryar

Only if he manages to land in a system that doesn't require him to make reads for option routes. I think the offensive system in New England was just too cerebral for him. He has the physical tools though, so I wonder how he will fare in a simpler offensive scheme.

 

[patchick]

How does Cris Carter sound? Thrown to the curb by the Eagles, picked up for pennies by the Vikings and rest is history.

Cris Carter sounds like something wildly different. He was NOT a highly touted high pick who didn't pan out for the team that drafted him, in fact just the opposite. He was a day-2 pick who surprised by becoming an impact player for the Eagles. He had 84 receptions for 17 TDs over 2 seasons...then was jettisoned, by his own admission, because of massive substance abuse problems. Then he cleaned up and went on to a terrific career. Where's the parallel to Jackson in that story?

 

[ScottieC]

How does Cris Carter sound? Thrown to the curb by the Eagles, picked up for pennies by the Vikings and rest is history.

Goodness, are you comparing CJ to CC?

Wow.

 

[BradyToMoss]

Cris Carter sounds like something wildly different. He was NOT a highly touted high pick who didn't pan out for the team that drafted him, in fact just the opposite. He was a day-2 pick who surprised by becoming an impact player for the Eagles. He had 84 receptions for 17 TDs over 2 seasons...then was jettisoned, by his own admission, because of massive substance abuse problems. Then he cleaned up and went on to a terrific career. Where's the parallel to Jackson in that story?

What's the parallel ?

It's kind of simple:

It's called giving up on a player, without giving that player a chance?

Whether that chance be coming back from injury and finally playing with a real QB in Tom Brady or whether that chance be recognizing and correcting an alcohol/drug problem and thus going on to a HOF career courtesy of another team who gave him that chance.

How do you think the Eagles felt after watching Cris do the thing he did in Minny and yes he was highly touted coming out of OSU (maybe a shade below CJack) so much so that Philly used a supplemental pick to take him. I'm willing to bet that everyone in that organization wished they gave Cris Carter that second chance and helped him.

And to the prior post, ah no, I know that CJack is not and will never be Cris Carter, it was mentioned in response to a post about touted WRs who were let go that hooked on with another team and went on to succeed. Goodness Gracious !

 

[patchick]

What's the parallel ?

It's kind of simple:

It's called giving up on a player, without giving that player a chance?

Whether that chance be coming back from injury and finally playing with a real QB in Tom Brady or whether that chance be recognizing and correcting an alcohol/drug problem and thus going on to a HOF career courtesy of another team who gave him that chance.

Cris Carter proved he was an NFL talent. But his off-field behavior got worse and worse, and the team couldn't get through to him. So eventually they cut the cord, and Carter credits that "wake up call" with essentially saving his life.

Chad Jackson never proved he could perform in the NFL. He entered training camp completely healthy, and was outplayed at receiver by the likes of C.J. Jones and Raymond Ventrone.

I really, really don't see the parallel here. All they have in common is being released.

 

[BradyToMoss]

Cris Carter proved he was an NFL talent. But his off-field behavior got worse and worse, and the team couldn't get through to him. So eventually they cut the cord, and Carter credits that "wake up call" with essentially saving his life.

Chad Jackson never proved he could perform in the NFL. He entered training camp completely healthy, and was outplayed at receiver by the likes of C.J. Jones and Raymond Ventrone.

I really, really don't see the parallel here. All they have in common is being released.

patchick, I watched the same preseason that you did. Let's summarize:

CJ Jones (1 TD) (3 fumbles) and a game ending 4th down catch that bounced right off his numbers from Kevin O'Connell. Game over.

Chad Jackson (2TDs) (0 fumbles)

(Both of these guys had some nice interior catches on slants and YAC after those catches)

Ventrone (0 TDs), I mean ok, he had some nice slot receptions, but to be honest (Ventrone is more of a hback-hybrid than a WR)

Honestly, can you say that both of these guy did more than Chad in these 4 pre-season games?

 

[spacecrime]

Predicting his future success, I'm going with the long, long track record of amazing physical specimens who were drafted high at WR but just couldn't cut it on the field. They always get a second chance or two, but I can't remember a single one who actually fulfilled his potential with a new team.

How does Cris Carter sound?

Sounds like a specimen who wasn't drafted high.

 

[Displaced - Fan]

patchick, I watched the same preseason that you did. Let's summarize:

CJ Jones (1 TD) (3 fumbles) and a game ending 4th down catch that bounced right off his numbers from Kevin O'Connell. Game over.

Chad Jackson (2TDs) (0 fumbles)

(Both of these guys had some nice interior catches on slants and YAC after those catches)

Ventrone (0 TDs), I mean ok, he had some nice slot receptions, but to be honest (Ventrone is more of a hback-hybrid than a WR)

Honestly, can you say that both of these guy did more than Chad in these 4 pre-season games?

Chad: Ran wrong routes and didn't finish off most of the routes he did run.

Jones: Ran the correct routes and finished them.

Ventrone: same

Chad just didn't get it so he was cut. It's pretty darn simple.

 

[Sicilian]

patchick, I watched the same preseason that you did. Let's summarize:

CJ Jones (1 TD) (3 fumbles) and a game ending 4th down catch that bounced right off his numbers from Kevin O'Connell. Game over.

Chad Jackson (2TDs) (0 fumbles)

(Both of these guys had some nice interior catches on slants and YAC after those catches)

Ventrone (0 TDs), I mean ok, he had some nice slot receptions, but to be honest (Ventrone is more of a hback-hybrid than a WR)

Honestly, can you say that both of these guy did more than Chad in these 4 pre-season games?

Contribution to ST:

CJ Jones = Kickoff and Punt returns while we wait for Faulk and Welker to return/get healthy

Ventrone = Kick coverage

Chad Jackson = Nothing


Versatility:

CJ Jones = KR, PR, and WR

Ventrone = ST Coverage, WR, S

Chad Jackson = WR


BB values ST and versatility very highly. It's really a pretty easy formula in this case.

 

[BelizePats]

I think that Brady to Moss is being disingenious when asserting that CJ was not given the opportunity. CJ was given many chances and did not take advantage of any of them. He made the same mistakes, could not stay healthy, missed the same reads, stuggled with his playbook (CJ's own words in the spring mini camp) and in no way distinguished himself on the field the few times he did mange to get on the field.
If he was a 7th rounder or a free agent when he came in, instead of being touted as the best receiver in his draft class, you'd likely have a very different take on him being released.
The guy with the best seat in the house (BB) saw enough and finally released him. The easiest thing for BB to do would have been to keep him on. Because releasing him is admitting that he made a mistake.
I wonder if there are still guys in San Diego arguing that Ryan Leaf didn't get a fair shake?

 

[NYCPatsFan]

patchick, I watched the same preseason that you did. Let's summarize:

CJ Jones (1 TD) (3 fumbles) and a game ending 4th down catch that bounced right off his numbers from Kevin O'Connell. Game over.

Chad Jackson (2TDs) (0 fumbles)

(Both of these guys had some nice interior catches on slants and YAC after those catches)

Ventrone (0 TDs), I mean ok, he had some nice slot receptions, but to be honest (Ventrone is more of a hback-hybrid than a WR)

Honestly, can you say that both of these guy did more than Chad in these 4 pre-season games?

Guess you didn't read my earlier query asking you Chad fans what you think of Brady losing confidence in Chad.

All these stats rank significantly less than the level of confidence that the QB has on the WR.

 

[Pats_R_#1]

Chad: Ran wrong routes and didn't finish off most of the routes he did run.

Jones: Ran the correct routes and finished them.

Ventrone: same

Chad just didn't get it so he was cut. It's pretty darn simple.

Remember Matt Cassell yelling at Chad Jackson when he ran the wrong route? That is one of the highlights I remember from the preseason the most. I'm not a fan of Cassell either, but you have to wonder how many times Jackson left him hanging by running the wrong route...

I really don't get the severe mancrush for Chad Jackson on this board. Even when Jackson was healthy, he couldn't climb his way up the depth chart to see the field consistently. The sad fact remains that other guys on the roster outperformed him in training camp and the preseason.

I had high hopes for Chad; I really, really did! But for him to go through this entire offseason and training camp and not be able to crack the top three on the depth chart says something about the guy. Forget the preseason, he had a chance to prove he belonged before that. Just because he didn't have Tom Brady throwing him the ball in those games doesn't mean they didn't get a chance to practice and go through camp together. Every time I read about Jackson during the offseason, he was either up and down or just flat out unimpressive.

 

[NYCPatsFan]

Contribution to ST:

CJ Jones = Kickoff and Punt returns while we wait for Faulk and Welker to return/get healthy

Ventrone = Kick coverage

Chad Jackson = Nothing


Versatility:

CJ Jones = KR, PR, and WR

Ventrone = ST Coverage, WR, S

Chad Jackson = WR


BB values ST and versatility very highly. It's really a pretty easy formula in this case.

I thought Chad tore his ACL playing ST during the AFC champsionship game against the Colts, no??

 

[Sicilian]

I thought Chad tore his ACL playing ST during the AFC champsionship game against the Colts, no??

I was referring to the preseason this year, where it was being argued he had a better preseason than Jones or Ventrone.

Before the injury, he showed some flash in limited action as a kick returner, yes.

 

[Pats_R_#1]

I think that Brady to Moss is being disingenious when asserting that CJ was not given the opportunity. CJ was given many chances and did not take advantage of any of them. He made the same mistakes, could not stay healthy, missed the same reads, stuggled with his playbook (CJ's own words in the spring mini camp) and in no way distinguished himself on the field the few times he did mange to get on the field.
If he was a 7th rounder or a free agent when he came in, instead of being touted as the best receiver in his draft class, you'd likely have a very different take on him being released.
The guy with the best seat in the house (BB) saw enough and finally released him. The easiest thing for BB to do would have been to keep him on. Because releasing him is admitting that he made a mistake.
I wonder if there are still guys in San Diego arguing that Ryan Leaf didn't get a fair shake?

Seriously folks, how long do you give a player to learn the f'in playbook? Some people just aren't very bright...

 

[Pats726]

"How many plays would Jackson be involved with as a 4th wideout? How many would Jones be involved with playing special teams?".

you didn't answer the question really...but Sicilian covered that point..CJ just a WR and RV and CJns WR-KR-PR FAR more than a 4th receiver...

This is exactly my point. Chad Jackson would have brought so much more to the team in the 4th WR slot and to be quite honest, as the season progressed and the more he played with Brady, I believe he would have challenged Gaffney for 3rd-WR snaps and eventually won it.
We lost Stallworth and Stallworth you had to watch deep, the safeties had to be somewhat honest, that's gone, Jackson would have replaced that threat, Gaffney won't, he's a middle of the field and IN guy that works the sidelines and the zones. Now teams can really focus on Moss.
Gaffney isn't going to scare anyone deep like Chad Jackson will. Jackson and Moss together on the field would have opened up so much underneath for Wes and the TE's it would have been unreal. We pissed that away when we let him go.?

Andfthere we have it...the Chad Jackson DREAM scenario...it's all fantasy..what you hope would happen...and there's nothing wrong to fantasize it all..BUT??? Reality is a tough thing to deal with.
I had high hopes with him...even hoped the team would have given some time with Brady..BUT.. all that is just what ifs..nothing close to reality..And it's good to have dreams..BUT the way he was playing..it was not happening here. He was far from challanging Gaffney..far from that. I had hoped time with BRADY..but not happening..and I thought THAT might be a difference..but running the right routes and other things have NOTHING to do with the QB.. When he ran a bad pass route turning in instead of out, it resulted in an interception..THAT is not good at all. I had wished he could have become the deep fast receiver, but THAT can not happen when one doesn't know the play book.
Brady had a low confidence wuth him...

Now compare this to CJ Jones who IMO will not be returning kicks or punts for this team and will probably be the 5/6th WR on this team.

Well what you have said about Chad is all dreams; hopes; what ifs..means zero..compared with Jones..who may not return kicks but can play on special teams..you know there ARE 10 other positions besides the returner..and he is learning a LOT about playing wide receiver. He also has an upside, but the flash and hype of Jackson is far brighter and sharper, even though it may not be the diamond everyone is thinking...glass...Jones may not have the athletic skill of Jackson...but hard work and intangibles may pay off...EVEN if he is cut, which I think he will..another team will sign him.

Their CAP figure difference is a paltry 300K in favor of Chad Jackson, which is nothing. CJ Jones, let me tell you, is not going to scare any defensive coordinator or NFL safeties deep in this league, believe me. The value/upside especially as the season progressed would have been so much more with Jackson instead of Jones. I don't understand it. They pulled the trigger way too fast on this guy.

There are many that think they waited too long..I do not..Potential means nothing unless at some point one makes it a reality.or even takes steps to that... And he may have successs in another system. BUT that can not be thrown back here as systems are all different..and if a player is great in one does NOT translate to being great in another. For Chad...he could not be successful here..I think that is the bottom line. I wish him well...
I do think fantasy football, Madden etc do not help people's views of players..I know nothing of them, but I tend to think things like that that depend on stats really miss a lot about players..But that is reserved for another time..

 

[Patslifer]

 

[jbb9s]

I thought Chad tore his ACL playing ST during the AFC champsionship game against the Colts, no??

Considering he only played 5 offensive snaps in the 3 post season games that year behind bug eyes, troy and gaffney, the chances are high he got hurt on ST. However the injury was not really disclosed until much much later so I guess we know as much about the play he got hurt on as the one that injured Brady's ankle against the charger's last year.