Franchise tag now in effect for 2011; will Pats tag Mankins?

[mgteich]

Re: Franchise tag in effect

?????

Why would Mankins sign a contract before a CBA is decided upon? The patriots will franchise him giving him a $12M 2011 salary unless they withdraw it after there is a CBA, in which case he will get whatever a new team gives him.

The only way it makes sense to sign a contract is if the players union screws the free agents and agrees to no 2011 free agency. While this has been discussed, free agency even after the draft (or even in July) seems quite feasible.

No player movement is allowed without a new CBA.
Mankins may get a franchise tag ( and guaranteed 1 year contract ),but Patriots will not be able to trade him untill a new CBA is agreed upon.
Patriots should give him a new contract before March first with stipulation that he'll get paid,lets say,72 hr after a new CBA is reached.IMHO.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: Franchise tag in effect

?????

Why would Mankins sign a contract before a CBA is decided upon? The patriots will franchise him giving him a $12M 2011 salary unless they withdraw it after there is a CBA, in which case he will get whatever a new team gives him.

The only way it makes sense to sign a contract is if the players union screws the free agents and agrees to no 2011 free agency. While this has been discussed, free agency even after the draft (or even in July) seems quite feasible.

Signing before the new CBA (from the players perspective) would be great if you were signing with a team like the Redskins who manage the cap poorly and would probably spend to their highest estimate of what the new cap will be. Of course, with the Pats, the opposite would hold true.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Franchise tag in effect

?????

Why would Mankins sign a contract before a CBA is decided upon? The patriots will franchise him giving him a $12M 2011 salary unless they withdraw it after there is a CBA, in which case he will get whatever a new team gives him.

The only way it makes sense to sign a contract is if the players union screws the free agents and agrees to no 2011 free agency. While this has been discussed, free agency even after the draft (or even in July) seems quite feasible.

Your ???? would beg the question then wtf is he whining about. He would sign a contract before the new CBA if it was the contract he wanted replete with guaranteed money... Few teams will be negotiating with their FA in the interim (and perhaps someone should point that fact out to the cowboy) because teams aren't inclined to commit to big contracts now (with few exceptions like Brady and Manning) until they know the terms of the new CBA and how that will impact all of their financials.

As for your contention that 500 FA (70 or so of whom are deemed pro bowlers this season) potentially flooding the market changing hands or requiring new contracts in July seems quite feasible for the league or the NFLPA is comical.

 

[BigMike]

Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

per Bedard at Globe....

 

[PittPatriot]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

per Bedard at Globe....

Whys is it always "slap?"
Why not Pats Will "Likely" (place) Franchise Tag On Mankins
OR
Pats Will "Likely" exercise Franchise Tag On Mankins?

 

[Fencer]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

They did it for Cassell even though it would have paid him many millions more than he was worth for one season.

Any overpayment of Mankins will be much, much less in comparison.

That said -- didn't Walter Jones play two straight years under the franchise tag?

 

[Ron Sellers]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

They did it for Cassell even though it would have paid him many millions more than he was worth for one season.

Any overpayment of Mankins will be much, much less in comparison.

That said -- didn't Walter Jones play two straight years under the franchise tag?

Yes, but because Seattle kept franchising Jones the NFLPA pushed for (and got) a concession on using the tag in back-to-back years; it is much more expensive to franchise a player in consecutive years now.

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

Yes, but because Seattle kept franchising Jones the NFLPA pushed for (and got) a concession on using the tag in back-to-back years; it is much more expensive to franchise a player in consecutive years now.

Wasn't AV tagged twice?

 

[Patriot Missile]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

I wonder what top 5 guard pay is nowadays with Steve Hutchinson's contract mixed in there?

"Cowboys... he's your's for the taking if you send us your first this year and 3rd next year.. No strings attached. Or...we'll just take Demarcus Ware off your hands and throw in Merriweather as a show of friendship.

Seriously though. I could not take it if they accept minimal value for this guy. If they are going to sign him, fine. That's good for our team and their o-line. He's a great player. He deserves it. But if they have no intention of paying the guy and take anything less than a 1st round pick I'm going to be highly dissapointed via Cassel 09.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

Ok, I can't vouch for the site, but I'm getting a number:

Offensive Line – $10.576M

2011 Franchise Tag Projections | Backseat Fan


Along with the $1.54M that Mankins was tendered at for last season, that would work out to $12.116M, which is more than $6M per season. Mankins will have recovered all/almost all of his "lost" money, and he'll still be in line for a big contract while being young enough to draw offers.

I'm not sure what the Patriots think they accomplished with this situation.

 

[mgteich]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

The patriots showed him who is boss!

Ok, I can't vouch for the site, but I'm getting a number:



2011 Franchise Tag Projections | Backseat Fan


Along with the $1.54M that Mankins was tendered at for last season, that would work out to $12.116M, which is more than $6M per season. Mankins will have recovered all/almost all of his "lost" money, and he'll still be in line for a big contract while being young enough to draw offers.

I'm not sure what the Patriots think they accomplished with this situation.

 

[Ron Sellers]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

Wasn't AV tagged twice?

The thing is the franchise tag for a kicker is much lower than it is for an OL. Currently if you franchise a player back-to-back he gets a 20% increase over his previous (franchise tag) salary. Last year that was $10.7 million for an offensive lineman; $2.8 million for a kicker. Bottom line is that it's a lot more affordable to franchise a kicker in consecutive years than it is to franchise an offensive lineman.

As for Vinatieri, he was tagged twice: in 2002 and in 2005.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

Ok, I can't vouch for the site, but I'm getting a number:



2011 Franchise Tag Projections | Backseat Fan


Along with the $1.54M that Mankins was tendered at for last season, that would work out to $12.116M, which is more than $6M per season. Mankins will have recovered all/almost all of his "lost" money, and he'll still be in line for a big contract while being young enough to draw offers.

I'm not sure what the Patriots think they accomplished with this situation.

It never ends.

 

[Triumph]

Re: Franchise tag in effect

No player movement is allowed without a new CBA.
Mankins may get a franchise tag ( and guaranteed 1 year contract ),but Patriots will not be able to trade him untill a new CBA is agreed upon.
Patriots should give him a new contract before March first with stipulation that he'll get paid,lets say,72 hr after a new CBA is reached.IMHO.

The Tag is just an instrument that the Pats will use to keep Mankins from walking as the 2010 season comes to a close.

 

[SanAngeloState]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

Ok, I can't vouch for the site, but I'm getting a number:



2011 Franchise Tag Projections | Backseat Fan


Along with the $1.54M that Mankins was tendered at for last season, that would work out to $12.116M, which is more than $6M per season. Mankins will have recovered all/almost all of his "lost" money, and he'll still be in line for a big contract while being young enough to draw offers.

I'm not sure what the Patriots think they accomplished with this situation.

They haven't risked a signing bonus and they get to sign and trade him for a pick and not pay the 10M this year.

 

[mgteich]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

The patriots will not have use of the $11+M of cap money until Mankins signs the tag. Of course, he cannot be traded until there is a new CBA and he signs the tag.

They haven't risked a signing bonus and they get to sign and trade him for a pick and not pay the 10M this year.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

Ok, I can't vouch for the site, but I'm getting a number:



2011 Franchise Tag Projections | Backseat Fan


Along with the $1.54M that Mankins was tendered at for last season, that would work out to $12.116M, which is more than $6M per season. Mankins will have recovered all/almost all of his "lost" money, and he'll still be in line for a big contract while being young enough to draw offers.

I'm not sure what the Patriots think they accomplished with this situation.

Mankins didn't collect the $1.54M he was finally tendered (after the higher $3M+ tender was reduced when he failed to sign it), he collected 8/17ths of that or about $720K. I think they will have accomplished retaining a pro bowl LG's rights and 10 games of service for $720K and/or his rights for two years and $11.3M TOTAL ($5.65M per) if indeed he signs his tag and plays. Considering he was looking for an $8M per $56M+ ballpark deal with in excess of $24M guaranteed...and he'd have taken home over $3M in salary plus a fat signing bonus last season, I think they could live with that. And then there is the matter of whether or what level of deal he will in fact still be in line for under a new CBA with a cap back in place at age 30. Not to mention there is always the possibility the tag for OL gets broken out like DL in a new CBA or under work rules resulting from a declared impasse or union decertification. In which case his tag number would probably drop substantially (to $7.5M or so). And please don't opine that the union would never stand for that, because they could care less about him either.

Some seem stunned that the tags are even still in play, but the fact always was owners want them and the NFLPA doesn't really care to trade off anything else for eliminating them because they generally impact only a dozen or so players per season and frankly they have helped drive comp for other FA albeit potentially at a handful of players expense annually...

If Mankins has any issues with what has happened to him over the last couple of seasons, he should call 1-800-NFLPA and biatch at someone else who doesn't care.

Meanwhile by tagging him this year and tendering him as a RFA last year this team did what any smart business would do, exercised/protected it's claim on a valuable asset.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

The patriots will not have use of the $11+M of cap money until Mankins signs the tag. Of course, he cannot be traded until there is a new CBA and he signs the tag.

What cap? Until there is a resolution to the CBA there will be none and nothing to spend it on...since there will be no FA or contract extensions past March 3rd absent one or absent an alternative resolution on owners terms. And if there is a prolonged work stoppage ownership has already proposed that as part of any settlement guys like Mankins will likely end up being retained by their former team in 2011 at a lot less than franchise prices...and FA won't be achieved for any of them until 2012.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

Mankins didn't collect the $1.54M he was finally tendered (after the higher $3M+ tender was reduced when he failed to sign it), he collected 8/17ths of that or about $720K. I think they will have accomplished retaining a pro bowl LG's rights and 10 games of service for $720K and/or his rights for two years and $11.3M TOTAL ($5.65M per) if indeed he signs his tag and plays. Considering he was looking for an $8M per $56M+ ballpark deal with in excess of $24M guaranteed...and he'd have taken home over $3M in salary plus a fat signing bonus last season, I think they could live with that. And then there is the matter of whether or what level of deal he will in fact still be in line for under a new CBA with a cap back in place at age 30. Not to mention there is always the possibility the tag for OL gets broken out like DL in a new CBA or under work rules resulting from a declared impasse or union decertification. In which case his tag number would probably drop substantially (to $7.5M or so). And please don't opine that the union would never stand for that, because they could care less about him either.

His RFA tag was initially only about 3.16. He lost about half of that in the reduction to 1.54. Even subtracting the amount you're talking about, and giving him only 720k, you're looking at 3.16 - .720, which is 2.44M. If that franchise projection of 10.576 is correct, that number is higher than 8M + 2.44 M, meaning that the money "lost" to Mankins last year will have been made up with just one season of the franchise tag, which is what I pointed out. Furthermore, since Mankins is being tagged under the rules of the current CBA, there's not going to be any "adjustment" to that number without a court fight, and Mankins would likely win that battle.

The Patriots screwed up, and needlessly pissed off an excellent player and locker room presence (reportedly), and all the shills (paid or unpaid) aren't going to be able to spin that. They could have had a happy camper for about an extra $3.5 million dollars over the life of a long-term contract. Instead they've got a pissed off free agent left guard and a team that's got offensive line issues moving forward.

As I said, I'm not sure what the Patriots think they accomplished here.

 

[bucky]

Re: Pats Will "Likely" Slap Franchise Tag On Mankins

His RFA tag was initially only about 3.16. He lost about half of that in the reduction to 1.54. Even subtracting the amount you're talking about, and giving him only 720k, you're looking at 3.16 - .720, which is 2.44M. If that franchise projection of 10.576 is correct, that number is higher than 8M + 2.44 M, meaning that the money "lost" to Mankins last year will have been made up with just one season of the franchise tag, which is what I pointed out. Furthermore, since Mankins is being tagged under the rules of the current CBA, there's not going to be any "adjustment" to that number without a court fight, and Mankins would likely win that battle.

The Patriots screwed up, and needlessly pissed off an excellent player and locker room presence (reportedly), and all the shills (paid or unpaid) aren't going to be able to spin that. They could have had a happy camper for about an extra $3.5 million dollars over the life of a long-term contract. Instead they've got a pissed off free agent left guard and a team that's got offensive line issues moving forward.

As I said, I'm not sure what the Patriots think they accomplished here.

The Patriots are not going to pay Mankins $10.5 mil next year. They're either going to let him walk, agree to a long term contract, or tag and trade him.

What they "accomplished" is saving money in 2010. No more, no less.