Completely unsubstantiated rumor abour Patriots limiting acess

[FirstAndGoal]

In the rumor guy's mind, Adams may have been involved with Walsh, and that gets Belichick into trouble, so they bring Capers in just in case the walktrhough tape exists.

Pure horse puckey.

The only way this is true is if Belichick is stupid enough to believe anyone will buy the story that, Ernie Adams!" is responsible, should the tape appear.

Belichick is not stupid, therefore this rumor is false.

Oh, I agree. I don't see the connection there. As I said in my previous post, you can't just drop someone into Ernie's job when he's been coaching. Ernie has a unique position that requires you to be able to put your hands on the vast library that the Pats are rumored to have.

 

[FirstAndGoal]

See, I just don't buy this. Ernie Adams is not the one that's going to take the fall here if any of this is true. It's Belichick who will fall.

Everyone knows this.

I agree with that too. I was just playing on the smaller angle.

 

[BelichickFan]

Until someone tells me how else to read that, I can only read it the way I did.

Someone please offer me an alternative interpretation so that I can give any of these rumors a little more credence.

I don't know what to tell you about what Walsh and Adams might have done together. However, if Walsh "violated both state and federal law" then it's clear it wasn't a matter of doing what Adams requested and then turning over the work product (the tape).

 

[bradmahn]

See, I just don't buy this. Ernie Adams is not the one that's going to take the fall here if any of this is true. It's Belichick who will fall.

Everyone knows this.

Someone has already told you. If there has been a falling out between Adams and Belichick because of Adams ordering the taping, then Capers presence on the staff will serve as a valuable reference for Belichick when he is creating a defensive game plan.

Your reading of it is far more than "between the lines," you're making a huge leap and then telling others to prove it wrong.

The rumor could very easily have meant that the Patriots (read, Belichick) could potentially dismiss Adams on their own accord and without NFL suspensions and Capers is an inductee into the Patriots braintrust to serve as a (limited) replacement.

 

[belichickaholic]

"violated state and FEDERAL laws"

is it possible that Walsh secretly taped personnel meetings and then sold them to other teams? If that's the case he's looking at 30 years in jail for selling trade secrets. hmmm... maybe that's too far fetched.

 

[upstater1]

Someone has already told you. If there has been a falling out between Adams and Belichick because of Adams ordering the taping, then Capers presence on the staff will serve as a valuable reference for Belichick when he is creating a defensive game plan.

Your reading of it is far more than "between the lines," you're making a huge leap and then telling others to prove it wrong.

The rumor could very easily have meant that the Patriots (read, Belichick) could potentially dismiss Adams on their own accord and without NFL suspensions and Capers is an inductee into the Patriots braintrust to serve as a (limited) replacement.

I never asked you to prove it wrong. (Why would I ask you to prove something wrong if I believed the actual claim itself was bogus? That makes no sense.) I asked for an alternative explanation. You provided one. I already explained why I think that alternative explanation is preposterous.

 

[upstater1]

I don't know what to tell you about what Walsh and Adams might have done together. However, if Walsh "violated both state and federal law" then it's clear it wasn't a matter of doing what Adams requested and then turning over the work product (the tape).

Quite frankly, I can care less what happens to Walsh. I'm only concerned about the Patriots.

 

[BelichickFan]

Quite frankly, I can care less what happens to Walsh. I'm only concerned about the Patriots.

On that we agree - I'm just saying that if he violated state and federal laws that suggests he was going beyond anything Adams asked/required him to do.

 

[vyrago]

The same source you guys are valorizing also said that the Patriots are worried that Ernie Adams had Walsh make the film, that Adams isn't talking to Belichick, that Dom Capers was hired in case the tape comes out and Belichick is suspended.
.

Where, exactly, did the source say what you have said?

This is what is said in the post that relates to what you are referencing.

"The only fly in the ointment here is some insiders are worried Ernie Adams might have done something with Walsh and this has put some strain on the BB/Adams relationship from limited observations. This is one reason Capers was brought in."

There are some Grand Canyon-sized logical leaps when comparing your speculation to the source.

 

[upstater1]

Where, exactly, did the source say what you have said?

This is what is said in the post that relates to what you are referencing.

"The only fly in the ointment here is some insiders are worried Ernie Adams might have done something with Walsh and this has put some strain on the BB/Adams relationship from limited observations. This is one reason Capers was brought in."

There are some Grand Canyon-sized logical leaps when comparing your speculation to the source.

I've already answered this a couple times. What does this mean if it doesn't refer to the walkthrough?

 

[upstater1]

On that we agree - I'm just saying that if he violated state and federal laws that suggests he was going beyond anything Adams asked/required him to do.

I'm assuming this refers to stealing from the Patriots, so that insinuation is quite apart from the walkthrough allegation. Would it have been against federal law to film a walkthrough? I'm not sure but I could be wrong.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I think the only reason for so-called insiders to be concerned about Ernie is because in the face of the statement that no coaches had any knowledge of the existence of a walkthrough tape they still fear if somebody in Foxboro had knowledge even after the fact it could be 007. There has been speculation that a tape may have existed that Walsh didn't actually film but somehow ended up in posession of - perhaps because video equipment was being shared with the Rams. Maybe Ernie knew of or saw that tape after the fact and didn't think enough about it to realize it could be used against Bill down the road.

But it's just as likely Bill is a little miffed at Ernie because of the piece the NYT did on him in the run up to the SB. Sort of unmasking a potential genius behind the genius. Harmless perhaps unless egos got ruffled, except the media then quickly began to use that piece to tie Ernie who was the tape guru to Walsh. I don't know if Ernie cooperated with that piece, but if he did that alone could be a reason for he and Bill having an issue.

Or it could be that in reviewing Walsh's employment with the team things came to light that have led Bill to believe Ernie should have flagged this guy to be fired a lot sooner. Maybe the audio tapes he is rumored to have are not of BB or SP (who caught him in the act and canned him on the spot) but Ernie's musings on information gathering or even other information that Bill deems as personal or confidential. If Walsh is the personality I think he is, it would not be out of character for him to have befriend the oddball film guru and become privy to even totally unrelated information in the process because Ernie didn't realize he was being worked as well as audio taped by a video assistant he may have thought was merely an eager student of his aspect of the game...

 

[FirstAndGoal]

I'm putting this rumor in my "Elvis is still alive" category. No matter how much some of you try to make it seem like it's legit, it doesn't pass the sniff test with me.

 

[FirstAndGoal]

The NYT was not the first to put out information on Ernie so that's B.S. that BB would be angry.

It took me 3 seconds to pull up an article from 2004 on Ernie ..... from.... the NYT..... the 2008 article was a rehash of the 2004 one.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A04E4D71E30F935A25752C0A9629C8B63


Not to mention the numerous mentions in the book that came out on 2001

 

[Rob0729]

Until we get a source or more verification, I have to be fair and treat this rumor like I did with the Randy Moss getting cut, Dallas being interested in signing Moss, the Pats videotaping the Rams walkthrough, etc. and treat this with a huge grain of salt. Can't be hypocritical and take a rumor I like to hear with more weight than a rumor I don't want to hear. In fact, since this is an annonymous post on a message board, I gotta take this with even less weight. I will speculate on it, but I have to take with a big grain of salt.

I do find it interesting if true. I do hope the Pats nail Walsh to the wall at this point because his allegations without actually making allegations has tarnished this team. I want him to come forward and if he provides nothing, I hope the Pats have a copy of Walsh's tape of him and Pioli so that he goes to jail. If Specter wants to potentially go after Belichick legally for corporate espinonage, then I hope the Massachusetts goes after Walsh for illegally taping another person without their consent. Fair is fair.

I am guessing the Pats have decided to shut out any media source that has been unfairly critical of them from Spygate. Rumor was that after the "they hate their coach" stuff in 2003, everyone at ESPN short of Mort and Berman were cut off by the Patriots.

 

[SVN]

Until we get a source or more verification, I have to be fair and treat this rumor like I did with the Randy Moss getting cut, Dallas being interested in signing Moss, the Pats videotaping the Rams walkthrough, etc. and treat this with a huge grain of salt. Can't be hypocritical and take a rumor I like to hear with more weight than a rumor I don't want to hear. In fact, since this is an annonymous post on a message board, I gotta take this with even less weight. I will speculate on it, but I have to take with a big grain of salt.

I do find it interesting if true. I do hope the Pats nail Walsh to the wall at this point because his allegations without actually making allegations has tarnished this team. I want him to come forward and if he provides nothing, I hope the Pats have a copy of Walsh's tape of him and Pioli so that he goes to jail. If Specter wants to potentially go after Belichick legally for corporate espinonage, then I hope the Massachusetts goes after Walsh for illegally taping another person without their consent. Fair is fair.

I am guessing the Pats have decided to shut out any media source that has been unfairly critical of them from Spygate. Rumor was that after the "they hate their coach" stuff in 2003, everyone at ESPN short of Mort and Berman were cut off by the Patriots.

i doubt the pats give any access to mort.

 

[Buchanty]

wow - feeding frenzy on this one....and what message board was it on....ESPN - oh right!!

As many have said it would be nice if true, so many deserved come-upances, but it has the ring of fiction more than fact. The King story is hilarious but would expect pete the weasel to test the waters with the NFL before actually complaining, certainly he would be discrete enough not to allow such a rebound. The Adams-Walsh connection is the most fictitious though....and tries to lead one to assume that film was made. Didnt I read recently that Walsh lied by claiming to catch the shuttle bus on return from walkthrough when there was none? It just reads like someone with an active John-Grisham-imagination and a fondness for consipiracies.

Given the family feel within the organization does anyone really think that an employee at the right level would post information of this detail and nature on a public message board let alone on the ESPN one?

 

[PatsFanSince74]

I don't believe any of it.

I see no reason the Patriots would have cut out national guys like that.

Tomase yes.

But the rest, why?

They need to get their side out.

i'd agree if Claymouth and King were the only reporters with national followings, but any time the patriots speak on Spygate (i.e., rarely if ever), it's news and the story will get out.

it is completely cool and thoroughly effective for a major news "source" to cut out unfriendly media members. the pats are as big a source as there is in the NFL, short of the commissioner's office. they should use their power.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Natural reaction to the increasingly sensationalistic direction that sports journalism is taking, if true. I doubt the Pats will be the last team to do this, either.

 

[PonyExpress]

I don't care what the Pats did or didn't do. I attach no moral weight to football gamesmanship, and historical precedent is on my side, going back to Halas, Brown, the old Redskins coach, Jimmy Johnson etc. If any more punishment is assessed it's time to sue the league and make it into a show trial, calling Shanahan and Parcells to the stand to publically explain to the world common NFL practices. What Walsh has or doesn't have or what Ernie Adams did or didn't do is meaningless to me, except as it may result in a more punishment and trigger a lawsuit by the Pats vs the league. In a way i would welcome that outcome. I'd like to see the rats around the league forced out of their sewers into the light of day. Burn the whole league if it comes to it. Kraft has tried to be loved, but now he must learn how to be feared IOT protect his interests.