Colts shopping Robert Mathis (pats involved)

[Frick]

For a 3rd, whynot? Let him freelance , costs a few dollars and could possibly recoup draft pick with a trade or comp. pick. Couldn't a linebacker fill his void on running plays? He has been impressive over the years and think he might be jacked up about returning to Indy to play in Super Bowl.

 

[mcsully]

Mathis has 45 sacks at home and only 33 away. That's a big difference. When I watch him play away from Indy, his speed seems to be clearly diminished and his game seems a half-step slower.

That's not a good sign for a player who'd be outside in New England, as well as playing games in Pitt/Philly/NJ/Wash/Den.

so in 9 years of his career he has 12 more sacks at home. That averages around 1.5 more at home than on the road, per year.. Not that big of a deal

Every player is slower on grass. This is why college players run their 40 on turf..

The real question is, the day he walks in, is he better than what we have. I say absolutely!

 

[jbb9s]

Mathis has 45 sacks at home and only 33 away. That's a big difference. When I watch him play away from Indy, his speed seems to be clearly diminished and his game seems a half-step slower.

That's not a good sign for a player who'd be outside in New England, as well as playing games in Pitt/Philly/NJ/Wash/Den.

I think you are being a bit ingeniousness with your statistics.

First - are you implying that only Robert Mathis is slowed down on grass in December in Buffalo/Pitt/NE or is it everyone on the field in the NFL? Because I would be shocked if this guy was dis-proportionally slowed.

Second - do you think if someone with raw data ran a few numbers, they'd find that sacks league wide are up or down on grass versus a dome/turf baseline?

Third - Do you think there are more passing downs in a game that is played in a dome (i.e. turf) versus grass?

Fourth - Tom Brady has 37 interceptions at home and 72 on the road in the exact same number of games. How would you interpret that split?

Fifth - don't bother going through 10 yrs of Colts schedule and adding up all their away games that happen to be on turf and then writing back.

 

[Triple-T]

I think the Colts should think about trading him, just to make room for Jerry Hughes, unless Hughes is another busted Colts' pick, which would give them one of the worst draft records in the last 5 years or so.

 

[T_Brady12]

I think you are being a bit ingeniousness with your statistics.

First - are you implying that only Robert Mathis is slowed down on grass in December in Buffalo/Pitt/NE or is it everyone on the field in the NFL? Because I would be shocked if this guy was dis-proportionally slowed.

Second - do you think if someone with raw data ran a few numbers, they'd find that sacks league wide are up or down on grass versus a dome/turf baseline?

Third - Do you think there are more passing downs in a game that is played in a dome (i.e. turf) versus grass?

Fourth - Tom Brady has 37 interceptions at home and 72 on the road in the exact same number of games. How would you interpret that split?

Fifth - don't bother going through 10 yrs of Colts schedule and adding up all their away games that happen to be on turf and then writing back.

Mathis has 28 sacks in 45 games on grass, and 50 sacks in 70 games on turf.

For comparison sake, Freeney has 68.5 sacks in 73 games on turf and 30.5 sacks in 47 games on grass....

So yeah, definitely proves your point.

 

[patsfan-1982]

for a 3rd round pick hell ya get it done, Haynesworth Wilfork Anderson and Mathis thats what opposing teams QB's could be faceing on 3rd Down in the playoffs in new england

 

[Wides]

for a 3rd round pick hell ya get it done, Haynesworth Wilfork Anderson and Mathis thats what opposing teams QB's could be faceing on 3rd Down in the playoffs in new england

Make it so.

 

[dhamz]

Close to 130 posts on a rumor that has no source.

The closst thing to a source sighted is Schefter who said trading him to the Jets makes sense for both teams. He has also tweeted numerous times that the Colts aren't trading him.

 

[102 Pat]

Close to 130 posts on a rumor that has no source.

The closst thing to a source sighted is Schefter who said trading him to the Jets makes sense for both teams. He has also tweeted numerous times that the Colts aren't trading him.

The Moss trade to the Pats from Oakland wasn't going to happen either...

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

The last time the Pats went for the second fiddle of a duet they ended up with Ron Brace, face it, Mathis is not as good without Freeney on the other side. Hell even the Colts pull both of them at once. You would think that they woudl try to leave one of them out there, but both of themgo to the sidelines together.

I'm not saying that Mathis is not better than, Cunningham, but still the answer is and always has been, an elite pass rusher that causes the other team to concentrate on him, and Mathis is not that.

 

[Rob0729]

Close to 130 posts on a rumor that has no source.

The closst thing to a source sighted is Schefter who said trading him to the Jets makes sense for both teams. He has also tweeted numerous times that the Colts aren't trading him.

Mike Lombardi is the source although there is no mention of the Pats only that Mathis could be had for a 3rd:

NFL Network's Mike Lombardi believes that both DE Robert Mathis and WR Reggie Wayne are available for trade at "the right price."

Mathis and Wayne are both in contract years, and neither would be a reasonable candidate for the franchise tag in 2012 because Peyton Manning is holding captive so much salary cap space. Wayne turns 33 years old next month and is obviously in decline. Mathis is 29. He'd cost a pretty penny to re-sign.

Robert Mathis - Indianapolis Colts - 2011 Player Profile - Rotoworld.com

I don't see the Pats trading for him. I don't see Polian ever making a trade with the Patriyachts to help them get better to win a Super Bowl. I think it is a moot discussion.

 

[Simkin]

I would take Mathis for a 3rd better than Al for a 5th or so...

Totally worthy IMO.Tired of those Vereen/Price/McKenzie bs picks

 

[randomk1]

Those of you who are calling him just a product of Freeney are ridiculous.

Robert Mathis #44 (Top 100 Players of 2011) - YouTube

Robert Mathis mix on Vimeo

This guy would be the best pass rusher on this team(shocking i know,considering how scary our passrush already is) and you know BB would find a way how to use a guy like him.

 

[DaBruinz]

I stand by that comment, well, at least the original comment before you distorted it's intent. If Green-Ellis left the Pats, he wouldn't find a starting job. He could probably 'contribute' somewhere. I don't know what that level of contribution would be, but he could at least give a starter a breather. Maybe a short yardage back for a team with a finesse starter?

Comments like this take away any credibility you might have. BJGE is more than a JAG and to claim he wouldn't find a starting job anywhere else in the league is a joke. BJGE would START for the following:

NY Jets
Miami Dolphins
Seattle Seahawks
Cincinnati Bengals
Denver Broncos
Detroit Lions
Indianapolis Colts
Washington Redskinis

What you foolishly discount is that BJGE doesn't fumble. He gains positive yards more often than not. He may not have that 2nd gear with breakaway speed, but he's very consistent and has had some big runs..

 

[Patsgofor4]

I agree that Polian would rather light himself on fire at halftime at Lucas than help the Pats win a championship, but for argument's sake....wouldn't the Pats likely receive a compensatory pick in next year's draft if he signs a big contract with another team in the offseason, softening the blow of giving up a 3rd for him? We'd certainly be getting a player with a lot of motivation to put up some big sack numbers the rest of the season.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Mike Lombardi is the source although there is no mention of the Pats only that Mathis could be had for a 3rd:



Robert Mathis - Indianapolis Colts - 2011 Player Profile - Rotoworld.com

I don't see the Pats trading for him. I don't see Polian ever making a trade with the Patriyachts to help them get better to win a Super Bowl. I think it is a moot discussion.

Mike isn't a source either. That's just his NFLN opinion on Schefter's ESPN speculation...along the lines of almost everyone is available for a price...

I agree that Polian would not trade him to NE unless he's planning on leaving Indy and taking his kid with him... Attendance is plummeting and while that has some immediate impact, the tickets were sold out this season so it has greater dire long term implications for a franchise that basically has to support itself (it's Irsay's sole revenue generating asset). Irsay has been tweeting with an eye towards maintaining interest in his suddenly floundering and increasingly irrelevant franchise. Even to the point of mentioning "Luck". A fire sale of their limited core talent not named Manning or Freeney would not bode well for 2012 season ticket sales...

The thread title is total BS as well since even the rumor isn't about these players being "shopped", let alone to any specific teams or this team in particular, it's solely based on off the cuff comments Schefter made on Sports Center about what he'd do if he were Indy's braintrust, which he isn't.

 

[DaBruinz]

Huh? It was the best game of his career, by far.

He's only had 3 games over 100 yds in his career, the best being 112 yds.

On a team that is Pass first. He leads the league in rushing TDs since the start of 2010. But far be it from you to admit that.

The number of 100 yard games "argument" would be more relevant when talking about someone who is ELITE or who absolutely stinks. Someone who is GOOD, should be judged by everything, not just "100 yard games"..

 

[DaBruinz]

Please read above posts were I clearly stated there's no guarantee that Mathis would work out but just look at his history of production, 9.5+ sacks per season in 6/8 of his previous complete seasons and it is not outrageous to consider that he could become a valuable contributor for the Pats regardless of 'system' which btw HAS changed to a predominantly 4-3 front.

*sigh* whatever VJC.. What you FAIL to understand is that the Pats use a 2 gap system and that their "4-3" really isn't a 4-3 because they are lining up one of the DTs over the center, one DE over one of the OTs and the other DT over the other OT. Then they have the other DE lined up outside of that. But they are still playing a 2 GAP. Something that Mathis has never done.

Since when were a 3rd round pick and 1.5m considered huge risks? The Pats draft history is littered with useless 3rd round picks, they hit on them at less than a 20% rate. And 1.5m is chump change in the NFL and you know it. Jarvis -freaking- Green, the 5.4m man got paid more money than that to be a backup player!

It's laughable that you bring up Jarvis Green. Why? Cause he was never paid 5.4 million for a single season. Nor was he on the Pats roster at that amount. EVER. He was let go. And though he was a "back-up" he saw a huge number of reps as a 3-4 DE. Which is different than a 4-3 DE. Something that you should understand.

Really. You're really telling me with a STRAIGHT FACE that the Pats defense has pressured the QB well enough to help out the secondary?

Numbers don't lie:

New England Patriots pass defense
Total passing yards given up 1,633 Rank #32
Yards per game allowed 326.6 Rank #32
Passing yards given up per play 8.6 Rank #30
Passing 1st downs allowed 79 Rank #32
Passing Plays of 20+ yards allowed 32 Rank #32
Completion percentage allowed 65.5% Rank #26

In sum, the Patriots pass defense is currently the worst defensive unit in the ENTIRE NFL in just about every statistic that matters. You may be telling us that the Pats put enough pressure on the QB to help out the woeful secondary, but the numbers don't support your assertions. We're not talking powerball here, we're saying that if there are ANY steps the Pats can take to improve that mess up above, they need to be taken. Winning teams play to WIN, they don't play 'not to lose'. And success is not gained without taking some measure of risk. Mathis might not be the answer, but neither is the status quo.

Right now mind you this is only speculation by one man named Schefter. We don't even know if this is even in actual talking stages. But if an opportunity presents itself for the Pats to improve, then why wouldn't they grab it?

Yes, the Pats have been getting pressure. Yes, the numbers do lie. Why? Because you damn well know that the only thing that matters is the points on the scoreboard. The Pats are 4-1. Yes, they've allowed 23.8 ppg (on average), but it's also trending downward.

Most people look at the Pats Pass Defense and recognize that the Safeties are a bigger issue than the pass rush. They see that they have been forcing guys like Sanchez, Campbell and Rivers to throw the ball, not from the pocket, but outside the pocket or flat out on the run. But people like yourself ignore stuff like that because it suits your argument.

 

[scout]

I would take Mathis for a 3rd better than Al for a 5th or so...

Totally worthy IMO.Tired of those Vereen/Price/McKenzie bs picks

Have you given up on Mallet also?

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I agree that Polian would rather light himself on fire at halftime at Lucas than help the Pats win a championship, but for argument's sake....wouldn't the Pats likely receive a compensatory pick in next year's draft if he signs a big contract with another team in the offseason, softening the blow of giving up a 3rd for him? We'd certainly be getting a player with a lot of motivation to put up some big sack numbers the rest of the season.

Comp picks are never guaranteed or easily predicted because of the circumstance (FA you sign) and formula (contract and performance and age - Mathis will turn 31 before FA commences in 2012 and be entering his 10 credited season in the league). I believe we saw recently where a team had their comp pick hopes dashed because of the age and length of career of a FA...and if I recall correctly it had to do with players with 10 years of service being largely discounted for comp purposes...