Will BB attempt to fix the pass rush?

[Kontradiction]

I still think trading Vrabel was a mistake but hopefully BB really does have a plan and will fix the defense problems. If not, I think we may have another season like this one.

I disagree. I think trading Seymour was the mistake, however trading Vrabel was not. Vrabel was essentially on his last legs and did very little in Kansas City to warrant the thought that he would have been the difference maker that we needed here.

 

[OldNEPatsFan]

I much rather would have prefered Vrabel being here than wasting a 3rd and 5th round pick on Burgess.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

I much rather would have prefered Vrabel being here than wasting a 3rd and 5th round pick on Burgess.

Not that Burgess did much, but I had no desire to watch Vrabel running in quicksand for another season.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

"Fixing" the pass rush is of secondary importance.

Judging by this thread, fixing the basic lack of intelligence at patsfans.com is more important and pressing.

Again, hello, the defense was 5th in points allowed. Inconsistent play from your QB returning from knee surgery was the critical point of the 2009 season.

 

[neuronet]

"Fixing" the pass rush is of secondary importance.

Judging by this thread, fixing the basic lack of intelligence at patsfans.com is more important and pressing.

Again, hello, the defense was 5th in points allowed. Inconsistent play from your QB returning from knee surgery was the critical point of the 2009 season.

If yer gonna throw down on the IQ joint, ya better have something smart on offer. EPIC FAIL.

Clearly fixing the pass rush needs to be a high priority on defense. If you don't see that, you weren't watching the Patriots this year. Manning and Brees had all day to throw. Being fifth in points allowed doesn't mean there are no priorities for what needs to be fixed on defense. We need to be better than fifth.

Sure, on offense there are priorities too, but Brady wasn't the problem.It was the offensive line not giving him enough time to throw, or not doing their job for our RBs. In 2007 Brady was getting all day to throw. This season he was getting hurried and hit a hell of a lot more than back then.

In sum: defensively one of our main priorities is pass rush, pot shots at people's intelligence notwithstanding just watch the games silly. Offensively, we need a line that can give Brady time to throw, especially now he'll need more time with Welker gone. This will also give our running game some oomph.

 

[oldskool138]

but Brady wasn't the problem.

He was part of the problem in some games.

 

[The Dynasty]

If yer gonna throw down on the IQ joint, ya better have something smart on offer. EPIC FAIL.

Clearly fixing the pass rush needs to be a high priority on defense. If you don't see that, you weren't watching the Patriots this year. Manning and Brees had all day to throw. Being fifth in points allowed doesn't mean there are no priorities for what needs to be fixed on defense. We need to be better than fifth.

Sure, on offense there are priorities too, but Brady wasn't the problem.It was the offensive line not giving him enough time to throw, or not doing their job for our RBs. In 2007 Brady was getting all day to throw. This season he was getting hurried and hit a hell of a lot more than back then.

In sum: defensively one of our main priorities is pass rush, pot shots at people's intelligence notwithstanding just watch the games silly. Offensively, we need a line that can give Brady time to throw, especially now he'll need more time with Welker gone. This will also give our running game some oomph.

Defensively I obviously agree that we need to improve on our pass rush because you're right we give opposing QB's far too much time to throw, but I think we should be satisfied with being 5th in points allowed. There is no shame in being 5th in points allowed per game. What needs to improve is the consistently and the ability to perform against quality opponents.

On the offensive side of the ball I completely disagree about your point about the offensive line. What you and others dont realize is that we never really had a completely healthy offensive line this season. They had a pretty decent year dispite all of the injuries. When our offensive line is at full strength it is actually one of our teams strengths.

The main priority this season on offense is adding a quality 3rd WR and possibly adding another WR to replace Welker until he is ready for his return. Brady did not have anyone to throw to this season besides Moss and Welker, this was the cause for some of his struggles and fans frustrations, not because of the offensive line.

 

[mgteich]

While I agree, giving our injured quarterback better than Aiken and Stanback would have also helped. As the colts showed last week, an offense can succeed without a real running game and even when the top two receiving targets are blanketed. And a team can do this against the #1 defense in the league. The key is having a #3 and #4 target for the quarteback, whether he is 100% or not.

"Fixing" the pass rush is of secondary importance.

Judging by this thread, fixing the basic lack of intelligence at patsfans.com is more important and pressing.

Again, hello, the defense was 5th in points allowed. Inconsistent play from your QB returning from knee surgery was the critical point of the 2009 season.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

If yer gonna throw down on the IQ joint, ya better have something smart on offer. EPIC FAIL.

Clearly fixing the pass rush needs to be a high priority on defense. If you don't see that, you weren't watching the Patriots this year. Manning and Brees had all day to throw. Being fifth in points allowed doesn't mean there are no priorities for what needs to be fixed on defense. We need to be better than fifth.

Sure, on offense there are priorities too, but Brady wasn't the problem.It was the offensive line not giving him enough time to throw, or not doing their job for our RBs. In 2007 Brady was getting all day to throw. This season he was getting hurried and hit a hell of a lot more than back then.

In sum: defensively one of our main priorities is pass rush, pot shots at people's intelligence notwithstanding just watch the games silly. Offensively, we need a line that can give Brady time to throw, especially now he'll need more time with Welker gone. This will also give our running game some oomph.

Ahhh youranut

Thanks for proving my point.

Look at 2009:

Jets- How about scoring in the 2nd half. If you don't mabe pick up a couple of TD's if you are in the red zone.

Denver- Make a 40 yard FG so you score in the 2nd half.

Indy- Don't throw an INT in the endzone. Don't fumble on the goalline

New Orleans- If you are up 7-3 and deep in the opponents territory, don't throw a momentum changing INT. Go up 14-3 and put the pressure on.

Miami- If you are inside the opponents 10 TWICE. Come away with maybe 3 points to earn the win.

AGAIN, an ACL is a two year injury. TB's performance was outstanding given the circumstances. However, it was not vintage Brady. The offense was too inconsistent and he was not as fluid or showed normal presence in the pocket.

These are things that I fully expect to see changed this year with better health and a full offseason of TB style work.

Likewise, I have no problem with upgrading the "pass rush" but this should never be done by picking a "pass rusher" before a quality player that fits the BB system.

Also, why didn't a "pass rush" solve the following?

The Jets losing 6 games because of late game drives

If Brees "had all day", why didn't the blitz happy Eagles and Giants limit him to less than 48 points and about 600 yards of offense?

Likewise for the "draft a 3rd wide receiver" crowd, a few points should be mentioned:

We drafted two in 2009.

Do you really believe that Collie and Garcon got to where they are without a full offseason of work with Goober?

 

[LasVegasPatsFan]

I know everyone expected more out of Burgess but this is his first year in our system. Give him some time. How many top players did exceptionally well their first year with another team? AD?? Heres a look at some stats

2009

Burgess (34 tackes / 5 sacks / 1 forced fumble)
Seymour (47 tackles / 4 sacks / 1 forced fumble) Oakland gave up a 1st round
Haynesworth (37 tackles / 4 sacks) Redskins paid dearly for him.

Don't try to suggest I am comparing Burgess to the other two guys but what do you think Oakland and Redskins fans feel right now about their additions?

BB knows his talent and lets see what he can do in his 2nd year. Patience.

 

[mgteich]

According to Bill, Burgess performed very well indeed. I would note that Burgess is not yet re-signed for 2010.

I know everyone expected more out of Burgess but this is his first year in our system. Give him some time. How many top players did exceptionally well their first year with another team? AD?? Heres a look at some stats

2009

Burgess (34 tackes / 5 sacks / 1 forced fumble)
Seymour (47 tackles / 4 sacks / 1 forced fumble) Oakland gave up a 1st round
Haynesworth (37 tackles / 4 sacks) Redskins paid dearly for him.

Don't try to suggest I am comparing Burgess to the other two guys but what do you think Oakland and Redskins fans feel right now about their additions?

BB knows his talent and lets see what he can do in his 2nd year. Patience.

 

[Leave No Doubt]

Ahhh youranut

Thanks for proving my point.

Look at 2009:

Jets- How about scoring in the 2nd half. If you don't mabe pick up a couple of TD's if you are in the red zone.

Denver- Make a 40 yard FG so you score in the 2nd half.

Indy- Don't throw an INT in the endzone. Don't fumble on the goalline

New Orleans- If you are up 7-3 and deep in the opponents territory, don't throw a momentum changing INT. Go up 14-3 and put the pressure on.

Miami- If you are inside the opponents 10 TWICE. Come away with maybe 3 points to earn the win.

AGAIN, an ACL is a two year injury. TB's performance was outstanding given the circumstances. However, it was not vintage Brady. The offense was too inconsistent and he was not as fluid or showed normal presence in the pocket.

These are things that I fully expect to see changed this year with better health and a full offseason of TB style work.

Likewise, I have no problem with upgrading the "pass rush" but this should never be done by picking a "pass rusher" before a quality player that fits the BB system.

Also, why didn't a "pass rush" solve the following?

The Jets losing 6 games because of late game drives

If Brees "had all day", why didn't the blitz happy Eagles and Giants limit him to less than 48 points and about 600 yards of offense?

Likewise for the "draft a 3rd wide receiver" crowd, a few points should be mentioned:

We drafted two in 2009.

Do you really believe that Collie and Garcon got to where they are without a full offseason of work with Goober?

Thank you.

 

[Deus Irae]

Ahhh youranut

Thanks for proving my point.

Look at 2009:

Jets- How about scoring in the 2nd half. If you don't mabe pick up a couple of TD's if you are in the red zone.

Denver- Make a 40 yard FG so you score in the 2nd half.

Indy- Don't throw an INT in the endzone. Don't fumble on the goalline

New Orleans- If you are up 7-3 and deep in the opponents territory, don't throw a momentum changing INT. Go up 14-3 and put the pressure on.

Miami- If you are inside the opponents 10 TWICE. Come away with maybe 3 points to earn the win.

AGAIN, an ACL is a two year injury. TB's performance was outstanding given the circumstances. However, it was not vintage Brady. The offense was too inconsistent and he was not as fluid or showed normal presence in the pocket.

These are things that I fully expect to see changed this year with better health and a full offseason of TB style work.

Likewise, I have no problem with upgrading the "pass rush" but this should never be done by picking a "pass rusher" before a quality player that fits the BB system.

Also, why didn't a "pass rush" solve the following?

The Jets losing 6 games because of late game drives

If Brees "had all day", why didn't the blitz happy Eagles and Giants limit him to less than 48 points and about 600 yards of offense?

Likewise for the "draft a 3rd wide receiver" crowd, a few points should be mentioned:

We drafted two in 2009.

Do you really believe that Collie and Garcon got to where they are without a full offseason of work with Goober?

The Patriots had the lead in every game they lost. Feel free to figure out how many times that lead was lost because the defense failed to hold as opposed to an offensive turnover run back for a score.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

The Patriots had the lead in every game they lost. Feel free to figure out how many times that lead was lost because the defense failed to hold as opposed to an offensive turnover run back for a score.

Wasn't really talking to you. As with just about everything, it's way over your head.

 

[Deus Irae]

Wasn't really talking to you. As with just about everything, it's way over your head.

Nothing you post is over anyone's head. It's just usually wrong or misleading. As for who you were talking to, that never seems to stop you from jumping in on other people's conversations, so why would it apply here?

 

[NHPATSFAN11]

I agree with you. People are calling for a immediate remake of the whole team which is not only impossible but also irrational. I think we need to stick with some stuff while change others.
I think the basic backbone of the defense should stay. They are all young players who will get exponentially better in 2010. We should get rid of the old timers who arent producing and have limited potential to improve. I think we all know who that is/are. We keep the young bucks get them the experience they need and a good coach to motivate them and play a more aggressive style. This does not imply exotic blitzes but rather mixing it up and knowing when go pick it up a notch during the game. Offensively, we just need to fill in the OL gaps and add another deadly weapon or two to our aresenal so that our attack can be more dynamic. This ITmay be a new tight end, reciever, or RB depending on the draft pool. ]HOwever, ITS DEF TIME TO GO BIG OR GO HOME ON THE DRAFT

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Nothing you post is over anyone's head. It's just usually wrong or misleading. As for who you were talking to, that never seems to stop you from jumping in on other people's conversations, so why would it apply here?

Ahhhh the daily mindless ramblings of the Douche Awry

How do I explain 2009?

Simple

Teams lose first half leads all the time. The only time this has ever been rare is with BB defenses. Why would this happen?

A young and inexperienced defense. This would especially apply on the road.

Since it is generally recognized a defense tires at the 50 snap point, scoring becomes easier. This is multiplied in the heat of south Florida or the thin air of Colorado.

It's generally recognized that a reasonable NFL offense will score on 30-40 percent of their drives. Keep giving a reasonable offense chances and they will eventually make the adjustments to score.

 

[Deus Irae]

Ahhhh the daily mindless ramblings of the Douche Awry

How do I explain 2009?

Simple

Teams lose first half leads all the time. The only time this has ever been rare is with BB defenses. Why would this happen?

A young and inexperienced defense. This would especially apply on the road.

Since it is generally recognized a defense tires at the 50 snap point, scoring becomes easier. This is multiplied in the heat of south Florida or the thin air of Colorado.

It's generally recognized that a reasonable NFL offense will score on 30-40 percent of their drives. Keep giving a reasonable offense chances and they will eventually make the adjustments to score.

No matter how much you blame the offense, the reality will always be that the offense got the team a lead in every game this season.

 

[oldskool138]

No matter how much you blame the offense, the reality will always be that the offense got the team a lead in every game this season.

...and then couldn't sustain drives late in the game thereby gassing the already tired defense.

 

[neuronet]

No matter how much you blame the offense, the reality will always be that the offense got the team a lead in every game this season.

Exactly.

Note I'm not saying there aren't problems on offense. But on defense, the pass rush needs to be a high priority. I'm not sure why anyone is even debating this that watched our games this season.

On offense it is an interesting argument against my claim about offensive line being the key, and the need for more receivers. I disagree. I think the Colts show if you have a great OL, you can get by with mediocre WRs and RBs. We have mediocre RBs right now, and our WR corp is crippled. One of their most productive WRs was Thomas, a Patriots reject from this year.