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Why Mac Jones playing this year is important

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bormio

In the Starting Line-Up
How the hell did we get Mac Jones at 15? I am no football guru, but I watched a ton of Bama football last year , and I saw what we are seeing now. A leader, calm and decisive in the pocket, nice pocket mobility, great accuracy. A prototypical NFL QB. Played great in big games. So much emphasis on his receivers when he did not have Waddle for 3/4 of the season. Jones was the reason that offense sang, not Smith or Harris. It was all there to be seen, and a ton of NFL guys talked themselves out of it. Crazy!
 

BobDigital

Pro Bowl Player
How the hell did we get Mac Jones at 15? I am no football guru, but I watched a ton of Bama football last year , and I saw what we are seeing now. A leader, calm and decisive in the pocket, nice pocket mobility, great accuracy. A prototypical NFL QB. Played great in big games. So much emphasis on his receivers when he did not have Waddle for 3/4 of the season. Jones was the reason that offense sang, not Smith or Harris. It was all there to be seen, and a ton of NFL guys talked themselves out of it. Crazy!
A few reasons. NFL guys are often very insecure in their job. There would be a lot to explain if they pass on a superior athlete who hits for an immobile guy who bust. More so than if they take a shot on the more athletic QB and miss while the immobile guy hits. They can always justify it by saying he was the better prospect on paper. Its stupid I know.

The other argument you hear is the higher floor or higher ceiling arguement which is utter nonsense. Tom Brady came into the league with little comparative athletic ability and a very average arm besides a bit of nice touch. He had as high a ceiling as the most gifted athletic freak QBs all said and done.

There are many different ways to win. No one way is inherently superior to any other in theory if played correctly. But the one thing i do believe is this. There is no such thing as a guy who can learn to be everything. There are only so many hours in a day. Look at Lamar Jackson. No doubt he was a good athlete from the word go, but how many hours, days, years did he put into his physical skill set? It was an enormous investment in time and energy. You only have so much of it. And it aint easy to maintain either. When some brings up the tired arguement "if Jackson can learn to be a poor mmanes Peyton Manning from the pocket then..." I just roll my eyes. A guy like Peyton Manning invest absolutely everything into being a pocket passer, because that's what it takes to reach that level. You don't just put in half the work and become half as good. It doesnt work that way.

Think of it this way. The 100m run. Most gifted people can get close to a 10s 100M. The key is getting below that. Each fraction of a second improvement takes more time and energy than the last. At the top level people dedicate every waking moment to try to knock that extra .01 seconds off. That is the difference between getting in the door to even compete and being sent home with a 'good try kid'. And it cost a person everything to get those deminishing returns.

Trying to compete in someone's pro areana being half hearted about getting a skill set is a joke. You will never be the same caliber. Just lesser degrees of incompetent. And it will always bite you when the rubber hits the road.

That doesn't mean you need to absolutely specialize in the most core of the core. It is a warning to not overly divide your focus. You are always better off investing your time to learn the game that is the best fit for you. The issue with super athletic QBs IMO is they over specialized in things which are potentially parts of being a QB as opposed to core parts of being a QB. Anytime you step outside of QB core aspects you are taking time, effort and energy away from something which will always help you to invest it in something which can sometimes help you. A suboptimal approach. It is why elusisivity and escapability have served some of the greatest QBs of all time well. Where as going in with the game plan of being a runner is more hit or miss.

At least that's my thoughts.
 
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DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
How the hell did we get Mac Jones at 15? I am no football guru, but I watched a ton of Bama football last year , and I saw what we are seeing now. A leader, calm and decisive in the pocket, nice pocket mobility, great accuracy. A prototypical NFL QB. Played great in big games. So much emphasis on his receivers when he did not have Waddle for 3/4 of the season. Jones was the reason that offense sang, not Smith or Harris. It was all there to be seen, and a ton of NFL guys talked themselves out of it. Crazy!

A lot of overbloated fake analysis of how Trey Lance was the best prospect, or Fields or Wilson. To be fair Mac did rise from being a 2nd/3rd rounder into the 1st round.

All Mac did was have the best passing season ever in college in the toughest college division.

.
 

Patriot Missile

Pro Bowl Player
A lot of overbloated fake analysis of how Trey Lance was the best prospect, or Fields or Wilson. To be fair Mac did rise from being a 2nd/3rd rounder into the 1st round.

All Mac did was have the best passing season ever in college in the toughest college division.

.
I remember watching Joe Burrow at LSU the year before and saying that season is going to stand for a while. Boom, broken the next year. I defintely feel good about Mac.
 

zydecochris

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
An interesting very upbeat assessment (calling him “the steal of the draft”) of Mac by Drew Brees. DrewBreesonMac

It was interesting to me because Brees (apart from obviously knowing quite a bit about what makes a successful NFL QB) has some similarities with Mac, the most obvious being their tennis background and (perhaps not unrelated ) their excellent footwork in the pocket.
 

PatsFanSince74

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
First of all, I was delighted when the Pats were able to pick up Mac Jones at 15.

But, the only thing that is "important" when it comes to the QB position is that it be the guy who gives the team the best chance to win. BB and Josh have decided that that guy is Jones and that's good enough for me. They've also decided that starting now is the best thing for his development and, again, I just trust their judgment.
 

jimnance

In the Starting Line-Up
How the hell did we get Mac Jones at 15? I am no football guru, but I watched a ton of Bama football last year , and I saw what we are seeing now. A leader, calm and decisive in the pocket, nice pocket mobility, great accuracy. A prototypical NFL QB. Played great in big games. So much emphasis on his receivers when he did not have Waddle for 3/4 of the season. Jones was the reason that offense sang, not Smith or Harris. It was all there to be seen, and a ton of NFL guys talked themselves out of it. Crazy!
Its mindboggling to me.
I said b4 the draft Mac was the 2nd best qb in that draft after Lawrence. I watched a ton of Mac, Lawrence and Fields- and Mac was better than Fields. Period. I think Fields will be a good qb but I like Mac better. When we didnt have to trade up to get him and he magically fell to us at 15, I was surprised and happy.
 

BigPeteG

Practice Squad Player
How the hell did we get Mac Jones at 15? I am no football guru, but I watched a ton of Bama football last year , and I saw what we are seeing now. A leader, calm and decisive in the pocket, nice pocket mobility, great accuracy. A prototypical NFL QB. Played great in big games. So much emphasis on his receivers when he did not have Waddle for 3/4 of the season. Jones was the reason that offense sang, not Smith or Harris. It was all there to be seen, and a ton of NFL guys talked themselves out of it. Crazy!
Mac doesn't look like an NFL player - not even a kicker. Honestly its amazing he can run a 4.8 or whatever because his upper body looks like garbage. This totally hurts him. It's why they called him a statue or whatever. Guy moves decent when you consider his fitness level..

Even when he is working with is QB coach - who obviously does an excellent job - you can see Mac just looks flabby and goofy out there. His results are excellent but his fitness is not. So its not surprising he fell.. Had he really worked on his measurables and cut down his body fat and added more muscle he could have gone higher. Glad he did not really.. Since he fell to us.

Guys like Lance and Field look the part much more.. It was the same for Brady. Had he concentrated on his body more - he could have gone in one of the earlier rounds. Some of his college games were really really good..
 

zydecochris

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Its mindboggling to me.
I said b4 the draft Mac was the 2nd best qb in that draft after Lawrence. I watched a ton of Mac, Lawrence and Fields- and Mac was better than Fields. Period. I think Fields will be a good qb but I like Mac better. When we didnt have to trade up to get him and he magically fell to us at 15, I was surprised and happy.
It is difficult to predict the future greatness of any of these rookie QBs before they have even played one NFL game. But it is a no-brainer that Mac fits the Patriot system better then Fields.

Mac is a rookie, and he will make rookie mistakes. I dread the inevitable threads about how "Mac Sucks" the first time or two that he struggles. I expect his main problem as a rookie to be taking sacks and adjusting to to not having wide open receivers, I would be surprised if he throws a bunch of balls up for grabs, but it will take him time to learn how and where to throw the ball away.

But, I am hopeful that he will be moderately successful his first year and just get better and better in later years. I actually would not be shocked if he is a candidate for offensive rookie of the year, he certainly has a better team around him than some of his most obvious competitors.
 
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zydecochris

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
Mac doesn't look like an NFL player - not even a kicker. Honestly its amazing he can run a 4.8 or whatever because his upper body looks like garbage. This totally hurts him. It's why they called him a statue or whatever. Guy moves decent when you consider his fitness level..

Even when he is working with is QB coach - who obviously does an excellent job - you can see Mac just looks flabby and goofy out there. His results are excellent but his fitness is not. So its not surprising he fell.. Had he really worked on his measurables and cut down his body fat and added more muscle he could have gone higher. Glad he did not really.. Since he fell to us.

Guys like Lance and Field look the part much more.. It was the same for Brady. Had he concentrated on his body more - he could have gone in one of the earlier rounds. Some of his college games were really really good..
Mac came in as a 180 lb painfully thin freshman at Alabama (with a tennis background), his body was simply not physically mature compared to some players (pictures of him next to Tua as freshmen are striking in their physical maturity difference). He was told to put on weight, and he did so (I think he is up to 217 or so?), but some of his pictures (like the famous cigar one of a couple of years back) showed a work in progress ;)

But, I think he already looks to be in decent shape in his Pats pictures. Guys like Lance and Fields are frankly a high bar for comparison, they both look like linebackers IMHO. Mac will be fine as his body matures in a NFL strength and conditioning program, he certainly is a hard enough worker.
 

BigPeteG

Practice Squad Player
Mac came in as a 180 lb painfully thin freshman at Alabama (with a tennis background), his body was simply not physically mature compared to some players (pictures of him next to Tua as freshmen are striking in their physical maturity difference). He was told to put on weight, and he did so (I think he is up to 217 or so?), but some of his pictures (like the famous cigar one of a couple of years back) showed a work in progress ;)

But, I think he already looks to be in decent shape in his Pats pictures. Guys like Lance and Fields are frankly a high bar for comparison, they both look like linebackers IMHO. Mac will be fine as his body matures in a NFL strength and conditioning program, he certainly is a hard enough worker.
I agree. In HS he was super thin - looked more like a pro tennis player then football player. He doesn't look that fit to me yet - but Eli Manning never gained any muscle tone and won two super bowls. Even Peyton didn't have what I would call an NFL body.. Point is this is going to hurt your draft stock.

The other knock is arm strength. The "worst case" scenario with Mac is that he would end up like say Matt Lienart. Matt was great in college - won heisman. Had amazing seasons. Was considered an accurate thrower and went 10th in the draft. Was out of football in only a few years. And he wasn't some dumb guy.. just didn't have a big enough arm.
 

jimnance

In the Starting Line-Up
How many great,hell even good, nfl qbs have been musclebound?
Been watching the nfl since early 60's and I..cant..name..even..ONE! Not one.
This ain't a bodybuilding beauty contest.
I dont trust a qb who looks like Lance. A qb needs fluidity of motion in his shoulder and arm.
Same with running qbs. Youre not going to win consistently with one.
The jury is out on LJackson- he has a good arm but has relied more on his legs.
He needs to step up and take his game another level if he wants to be one of the better qbs. Hes not remotely close to Mahomes,Brady Rodgers,Wilson or even Josh Allen right now. More film study more working on his mechanics, less running.
 

BaconGrundleCandy

#1 Mac Jones fan
PatsFans.com Supporter
How many great,hell even good, nfl qbs have been musclebound?
Been watching the nfl since early 60's and I..cant..name..even..ONE! Not one.
This ain't a bodybuilding beauty contest.
I dont trust a qb who looks like Lance. A qb needs fluidity of motion in his shoulder and arm.
Same with running qbs. Youre not going to win consistently with one.
The jury is out on LJackson- he has a good arm but has relied more on his legs.
He needs to step up and take his game another level if he wants to be one of the better qbs. Hes not remotely close to Mahomes,Brady Rodgers,Wilson or even Josh Allen right now. More film study more working on his mechanics, less running.
Lamar Jackson has been better than Allen and everyone else from his class. Allen was awful up until last year. They basically take the same amount of sacks but Jackson is a much better moving the football with his legs. Look at the stats, Jackson has been more consistent.
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BelichickFan

PatsFans.com Supporter
PatsFans.com Supporter
The thing about everyone, correctly, saying Mac had Waddle (part of the year), Smith, Harris, OL . . . well Tua went #5 and he had all those guys AND Jeudy and Ruggs.

I love Mac but that leg brace scares me :eek:
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
The thing about everyone, correctly, saying Mac had Waddle (part of the year), Smith, Harris, OL . . . well Tua went #5 and he had all those guys AND Jeudy and Ruggs.

I love Mac but that leg brace scares me :eek:

And Burrow had Chase and great players too. This is why Mac is arguably a steal. He had the best passing season ever in the hardest conference and it also takes a lot of leadership to lead 6 other first round picks.

.
 

zydecochris

2nd Team Getting Their First Start
I agree. In HS he was super thin - looked more like a pro tennis player then football player. He doesn't look that fit to me yet - but Eli Manning never gained any muscle tone and won two super bowls. Even Peyton didn't have what I would call an NFL body.. Point is this is going to hurt your draft stock.

The other knock is arm strength. The "worst case" scenario with Mac is that he would end up like say Matt Lienart. Matt was great in college - won heisman. Had amazing seasons. Was considered an accurate thrower and went 10th in the draft. Was out of football in only a few years. And he wasn't some dumb guy.. just didn't have a big enough arm.
Good point about players like the Mannings, none of them had much muscle tone.

Regarding Mac's arm strength, I guess I'm not enough of an expert to be able to tell, but what I can say is that at Alabama throwing the long ball accurately was really his strength, so it definitely wasn't like he was only a check-down artist. However, admittedly I didn't see him throw many bullets through a tight window to a receiver 10 yards away, but that isn't his style anyway, in college Mac took what was there and didn't force things (thus the 40 TD to 4 INT ratio). But, others can judge his arm strength better than me.

Regarding your "floor" comparison of Matt Lienart, maybe the arm strength thing is apt but nevertheless I'm still twitching in horror. :eek:

Not that Leinart was an ogre or criminal or anything, but he never seemed like he was that serious about his craft given his exhaustively repetitive tabloid media exploits, which seemed to define him more than anything else. In contrast, after his Freshman DUI (which clearly shook him up) Mac seemed to completely turn a corner, he stopped going out on the town with other players and he became a nose-to-the-grindstone type and an outstanding student of the game (plus, academically a 4.0 student who got a Masters degree in addition to his Bachelors). It was tough enough to lose Tom Brady, if highly professional and emotionally mature Mac turns into an embarrassing mainstay on Hollywood Gossip magazines like Leinart did it might be too much for me to bear, I might have to switch to watching golf or bowling or something. ;)
 
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Pape

In the Starting Line-Up
How the hell did we get Mac Jones at 15? I am no football guru, but I watched a ton of Bama football last year , and I saw what we are seeing now. A leader, calm and decisive in the pocket, nice pocket mobility, great accuracy. A prototypical NFL QB. Played great in big games. So much emphasis on his receivers when he did not have Waddle for 3/4 of the season. Jones was the reason that offense sang, not Smith or Harris. It was all there to be seen, and a ton of NFL guys talked themselves out of it. Crazy!
We zigged when everyone else was zagging... Everyone is looking for the flavor of the month mahomes... Bill is like effing A plain ole vanilla tastes just as good...
 

Ochmed Jones

Pro Bowl Player
2021 Weekly NFL Picks Winner
We zigged when everyone else was zagging... Everyone is looking for the flavor of the month mahomes... Bill is like effing A plain ole vanilla tastes just as good...

I hope this is the best zig bb had made since he kept 4 qb’s on the roster in 2000!
 

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