Why Did We Expect Better Than 50% In The 3 years After Brady?

[mgteich]

I expected better than this. I expected it would take a few years to get back to respectability, but what is going on, and what has gone on is rediculous. The team is regressing not progressing.

I get it. For NEP fans being competitive for the playoffs for 3 years in NOT respectable.

Let's wait and see how good other teams are after their top QB's leave.

 

[203Pat]

Pete Carrol's teams got worse in 3 consecutive years and he was canned. Even if you give Bill a pass on 2020 in all likelihood we will finish with a worse record than last year.

 

[Hyped]

So few things more annoying than people throwing around the Cassel line.

We went 11-5 with Cassel but everyone just loves to ignore that we produced half the offense of the previous year and lost to every decent AFC team which is why we missed the playoffs. Finally people love to use this as some sort of accomplishment because it was Cassel but then conveniently ignore that Cassel won his division and made the probowl with Haley and a worse Chiefs team. If that is the measuring stick is Haley some genius coach?

As for the 3-1, anyone can fluke a few wins. We have seen it happen with many backup QBs. Not to mention the desire to hold it together knowing Brady was coming back.

We should have been a good team in year 4. Anyone who says they expected differently is flat out lying. I have seen many coaches turn teams around in much shorter time frames. Is Bill not the greatest thing since sliced bread? How can he not do what Carrol has done from basically year 1?

As some of the posts said, I was under the delusion that Belichick knew what he was doing and had a plan to win when he ran Brady out of town. It turns out it was all pure ego and dilusions.

The 11-5 team with Cassell was red hot late in the season. I truly believed that had they made the playoffs...we would have been in the Superbowl that year. We had some fluky losses that year...including in Pittsburgh where we were trailing 13-10 before Slater muffed the kick off....then it was 20-10...then Cassell fumbles....23-10...then another fumble but the Steelers miss a figgie...then we throw an interception...26-10....then another interception.and a score...33-10. And don't forget the 3rd and 19 completion by Favre to Keller in OT too....

Anyway, that 2008 team had a lot of talent as well.... just saying that the 2008 team progressively became better as the year wore on. One of the most fun teams I had the pleasure of watching.

 

[Patriot Missile]

I didn’t expect the offensive line to fall apart like it has. Very quickly.

If they had kept Thuney and Mason might it had made a difference? Or when Brady and Scar left was that the end of plug and play oline days? The days when the Patriots were the envy of every team when it came to drafting oline. Kind of like the way fans looked at the Steelers and their wr picks?

Scar was obviously a great teacher, can’t think of a player who played for him that didn’t respect him. Brady had the best qb movement inside the pocket ever. No debate there. So many variables of what made this thing go. And then it went up in smoke almost overnight.

 

[mgteich]

Expected slow but steady progress not getting progressively worse each year post Brady

Actually, I agree. I expected to see something like 6 wins, 8 wins and 9 wins, with no playoffs in the first three years.
=============================
Yes, this season is frustrating.

Yes, unless we bring Josh back, we need to move on from Jones, bring in a top draftee AND a seasoned veteran.

And yes, we to draft a stud OT.

HOWEVER, these changes are far, far away from total rebuild. If Jones were the franchise QB we hoped he was, we'd be in the same place as always: needing a top OT and wishing for a top 10 WR.

To be clear, I do think that we will be competing for a playoff position in 2024 if we bring in these two QB's and a stud OT (and a backup OT. And, yes, this presumes that we re-sign our free agents.

 

[Patriot Missile]

The 11-5 team with Cassell was red hot late in the season. I truly believed that had they made the playoffs...we would have been in the Superbowl that year. We had some fluky losses that year...including in Pittsburgh where we were trailing 13-10 before Slater muffed the kick off....then it was 20-10...then Cassell fumbles....23-10...then another fumble but the Steelers miss a figgie...then we throw an interception...26-10....then another interception.and a score...33-10. And don't forget the 3rd and 19 completion by Favre to Keller in OT too....

Anyway, that 2008 team had a lot of talent as well.... just saying that the 2008 team progressively became better as the year wore on. One of the most fun teams I had the pleasure of watching.

Considering Pats basically owned the Steelers, yeah, definitely a chance.

 

[mgteich]

I didn’t expect the offensive line to fall apart like it has. Very quickly.

If they had kept Thuney and Mason might it had made a difference? Or when Brady and Scar left was that the end of plug and play oline days? The days when the Patriots were the envy of every team when it came to drafting oline. Kind of like the way fans looked at the Steelers and their wr picks?

Scar was obviously a great teacher, can’t think of a player who played for him that didn’t respect him. Brady had the best qb movement inside the pocket ever. No debate there. So many variables of what made this thing go. And then it went up in smoke almost overnight.

Who are our terrible offensive linemen?
Brown?
Strange?
Andrews?
Sow?
Onwenu?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Was that like 4 or 5 fans?

In fairness Jimmy looked incredible in the limited time he played and there was no reason to think he was so injury prone. I wanted the Patriots to figure out a way to bridge between Brady and JG.

 

[Hyped]

As for the OP's question:

2019: It was a harsh ending to a long season in which we kept hoping to find a game breaker on offense (AB, Snau, etc...) before it all ended on a pick six to Logan Ryan. We were only down a TD at that point...oh well.

2020: Went better than I expected. I thought with Brady's dead money and Hightower opting out we would be terrible....that was before Cam started the season 2-0 with wins over Oakland and Miami. Then we saw the final performance of Edelman's career in Seattle....and Cam being stopped short of the goal line....then COVID hit us...and we had a terrible terrible Hoyer performance in K.C....then Cam was in a post-COVID brain fog for like 2-3 weeks...before we started to pull things together...and ended up 7-9 which was amazing in of itself. I really wish we put Stidham out there and "tanked" that season though...we could have had a guy like Micah Parsons.....hmmm...

2021: Went about as well as I expected. Was surprised by the 7 game winning streak....and liked how we competed against the Bucs and Cowboys early in the season. Everything went off the rails after that win in Buffalo though....but we managed to make the post-season by blowing out the Jaguars at least.

2022: That was a disappointing season....YET we were literally a play away from the post-season. Take your pick: Meyers' lateral pass fumble in Vegas (I was there), Rhamondre Stevensons' fumble late vs. the Bengals, and giving up not ONE but TWO kick off return TD's in Buffalo...

2023: So far, the offense is actually worse...which lends credence to the notion that it wasn't the coaching last year. Although, to be fair...the offensive line has been better since the Vegas game...and Onwenu at RT has really made a huge difference. Our defense took a step back though....been seeing too many zone coverages lately (Waddle last Sunday was running free in the secondary too much for my liking).

So, I would say...the team met my expectations from 2020-2021....and 2022 was disappointing as it was a step back....2023 another step back SO FAR....

 

[Hyped]

Considering Pats basically owned the Steelers, yeah, definitely a chance.

2005 too....had they ruled that Champ Bailey pick six a touch back...we probably host the Steelers at Gillette the following week and play the Alexander/Hasselbeck Seahawks......

 

[Patriot Missile]

Who are our terrible offensive linemen?
Brown?
Strange?
Andrews?
Sow?
Onwenu?

Missed the part where I said terrible. Not getting it done was more like it. The whole line basically falling off a cliff in just 2 short years. The talent downgrade at Lg and Rg is pretty obvious from the two former players mentioned. The oline coach and Brady are gone. Was it those two facts? Is it the coaching, the talent? I’m not entirely sure. All i know is watching it live isn’t fun.

 

[Patriot Missile]

2005 too....had they ruled that Champ Bailey pick six a touch back...we probably host the Steelers at Gillette the following week and play the Alexander/Hasselbeck Seahawks......

And 2006, had the refs not gifted the Colts the Pats had mediocre Chicago waiting for them.

 

[StrawHatPatriot]

Was that like 4 or 5 fans?

Assuming you aren't being sarcastic, no, it was good amount of people.

People forget how pro-Belichick a lot of people were up until recently

 

[reflexblue]

I get it. For NEP fans being competitive for the playoffs for 3 years in NOT respectable.

Let's wait and see how good other teams are after their top QB's leave.

I should have said competative along with respectable

 

[Patriot Missile]

Assuming you aren't being sarcastic, no, it was good amount of people.

People forget how pro-Belichick a lot of people were up until recently

It was sarcastic, but it wasn’t as many from here as people think.

I’m still pro Bellichick the coach. The x’s and o’s one. No one better when he is close to equal footing or his defense wants to neutralize something. Aside from Malcolm Butler benching no complaints.

GM Bill lost it, bad.

 

[sb1]

We went 11-5 with Cassel but everyone just loves to ignore that we produced half the offense of the previous year and lost to every decent AFC team which is why we missed the playoffs. Finally people love to use this as some sort of accomplishment because it was Cassel but then conveniently ignore that Cassel won his division and made the probowl with Haley and a worse Chiefs team. If that is the measuring stick is Haley some genius coach?

I would hope a Bill Belichick coached team wouldn't have cratered after losing Brady for the season after they went 16-0 the year before. I don't think that's some spectacular accomplishment, I think any half decent coach might have done the same. That 08 team still had a lot of talent on offense. I also don't know if Bill ought to get most of the credit for Cassel or credit should go to Josh or 50-50 to both guys. Maybe Bill should gets credit for sticking with Cassel and not cutting him after a dreadful preseason.

16-0 to 11-5 is also a 5 game drop so losing Brady was a major impact. Going from 11-5 to 6-10 is the exact same 5 game drop but that doesn't sound nearly as impressive.

Patriots haters of course used that to call Brady a system QB. Like system QB's have any staying power in the league at all.

 

[ahmed]

Was that like 4 or 5 fans?

You can't be serious! There were plenty of people. Since you have been here since 2005, I assume you rememebr there was a massive thread in 2008 about potentially trading Brady for a lot of assets and keeping Cassel?

Good times. Shows the delusion of some fans.

 

[sb1]

Pete Carrol's teams got worse in 3 consecutive years and he was canned. Even if you give Bill a pass on 2020 in all likelihood we will finish with a worse record than last year.

And Pete never had a losing record with us. This season will probably be BB's 4th.

 

[sb1]

You can't be serious! There were plenty of people. Since you have been here since 2005, I assume you rememebr there was a massive thread in 2008 about potentially trading Brady for a lot of assets and keeping Cassel?

Good times. Shows the delusion of some fans.

Yes this one. Read at your own risk. Lol

The Official 'Trade Brady' Debate Thread - Do Not Start Another One

This is going here for one reason and one reason only. I understand there are some who want to speculate, even though most of these same people were ready to kick Cassel out in favor of O'Connell in week 3 yet now they feel he should be a good replacement for Brady. There are also some who...

www.patsfans.com

 

[203Pat]

And Pete never had a losing record with us. This season will probably be BB's 4th.

3 losing seasons in 4 years post-Brady with no playoff wins. The Patricia experiment. A regressing QB and some horrible free agent signings. Any other coach would be lucky to finish out this season.