Who is best athlete ever in Boston/New England?

[RayClay]

Russell was 6-9... he wouldn't even be a center nowadays. He's an inch taller than Tracy McGrady. Guys his size play SF or possibly PF. Russell and Wilt were the only guys back than with even close to the skills and athleticism you see today from guys like: Duncan, Shaq, Garnett, Stoudamire, Howard, Camby, Yao, Nowitzki, Bosh, etc.

You know Jabbar right? 7'2" 225. Chamberlain used to throw him around like a rag doll even thou Wilt was at the end of his career 7'1" 275.

Russell had to beat a team with Chamberlain at center almost every year once Wilt moved to Philly, (later L.A.). You're worrying about an inch or two and forgetting Russell was a high jump champion ranked second in the country. He had a jump of 6'9 1/4" (I don't know if that was his highest). He could have jumped in the Olympics, but chose to play basketball there since that was also offered.

Russell would be the best center in the league right now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWFsL4Y8RVA&feature=related

 

[TruthSeeker]

As far as Russell goes... he was the greatest in his era and did a lot to revolutionize the game. But he's an above average to all-star level player in today's game (if he were put in a time warp) rather than the greatest player ever.

If you put Garnett in a time machine and replaced Russell with him, the Celtics would have won about 99% of their games.

Utter foolishness.

 

[scout]

I really like your descriptive words for each player. They really fit.

If I can add on. As far as the types of people they are to the fans away from the game. Let me give it a try:

Orr - Very modest. Humble. Always has enough time for the fans. Supposedly is a perfect gentleman. It's interesting, because the 4 arguably best NHL players of all time, Orr, Gretsky, Howe, and Lemeiux are all super nice to the fans. I have two personalized autographs from him. Love the guy.

Williams - Was ornery in his youth. But, while a bit gruff, seemed to mellow some as he got older.

Russell - Not the nicest guy in the world. Would not sign autographs. Only started signing at all, for money, over the last couple of years. Met him at Maui Airport. Not very nice.

Brady - He's not a bad guy, but a bit aloof from the fans. He's Tommy Hollywood, dating the models and actresses. His teammates love him. Went to the Lions - Pats game in Detroit a few years ago, and after the game he was going through the tunnel, and tons of Pats fans were chearing him. He would not even acknowlege anybody, like most other players did.

Bird - Not Mr. Friendly, but I went to the Celtics Rookie camp in Marshfield, MA when he was a rookie. I must have a half dozen autographs from him. He's always signs, and while not all smiles, seemed decent enough. It's just that his personality is what it is.

I know none of this has to do with the question itself, but felt not touching on this part of them. Others may have some good antecdotes.

Actually, you ruined the guys post. The one word he had for each athlete was genune and most here would agree. You describe each athlete with by your perception that I'm willing to bet most here would disagree.

 

[maverick4]

I really like your descriptive words for each player. They really fit.

If I can add on. As far as the types of people they are to the fans away from the game. Let me give it a try:
Orr - Very modest. Humble. Always has enough time for the fans. Supposedly is a perfect gentleman. It's interesting, because the 4 arguably best NHL players of all time, Orr, Gretsky, Howe, and Lemeiux are all super nice to the fans. I have two personalized autographs from him. Love the guy.
Williams - Was ornery in his youth. But, while a bit gruff, seemed to mellow some as he got older.
Russell - Not the nicest guy in the world. Would not sign autographs. Only started signing at all, for money, over the last couple of years. Met him at Maui Airport. Not very nice.
Brady - He's not a bad guy, but a bit aloof from the fans. He's Tommy Hollywood, dating the models and actresses. His teammates love him. Went to the Lions - Pats game in Detroit a few years ago, and after the game he was going through the tunnel, and tons of Pats fans were chearing him. He would not even acknowlege anybody, like most other players did.
Bird - Not Mr. Friendly, but I went to the Celtics Rookie camp in Marshfield, MA when he was a rookie. I must have a half dozen autographs from him. He's always signs, and while not all smiles, seemed decent enough. It's just that his personality is what it is.

So basically, you don't like most Boston players due to their actions towards you, and you have a huge hard on for Bobby Orr. In your mind, Bobby Orr wins the autograph olympics.

 

[maverick4]

OKAY, for the final time:

- Bill Russell won every single game 7 or important 'win or go home' game in his life, he was 21-0 lifetime.

- 11 NBA Championships in 13 Years
- 2 NCAA Championships carring a scrub college team
- 1 Olympic Gold Medal
- He invented or revolutionized shot blocking, jump shooting, and fast break basketball.

This guy was the ultimate winner, I guess this thread depends on whether you worship stats or individual accomplishments, or just being the most unstoppable dominant winner ever in all athletic history.

 

[Bostonian1962]

So basically, you don't like most Boston players due to their actions towards you, and you have a huge hard on for Bobby Orr. In your mind, Bobby Orr wins the autograph olympics.

What are you talking about?

 

[Fencer]

What he said. Orr changed the way the game was played. He was that good.

I can't think of another athlete in any sport that I could say that about.

Bill Russell says hello.

He invented the concept of the shotblocking defensive center. Pretty literally; even his college coach didn't believe in leaving one's feet on defense.

 

[oldskool138]

I voted for Ted Williams. All the other on that list are fantastic athletes but Teddy Ballgame was arguably the best baseball player ever. Not to take anything away from Russell, Bird, Orr or Brady. Imagine the astronomical numbers Ted could have put up if WW2 never happened (in fact I think you have to give him extra points for fighting in the war)...And nobody has even come close to breaking his record for batting average for a season.

But only 10% think Ted was the best Boston athlete to play in Boston borders on an insult to his legacy, IMO.

(I know Russell had to deal with racism and all that)

 

[40yrpatsfan]

I voted for Ted Williams. All the other on that list are fantastic athletes but Teddy Ballgame was arguably the best baseball player ever. Not to take anything away from Russell, Bird, Orr or Brady. Imagine the astronomical numbers Ted could have put up if WW2 never happened (in fact I think you have to give him extra points for fighting in the war)...And nobody has even come close to breaking his record for batting average for a season.

But only 10% think Ted was the best Boston athlete to play in Boston borders on an insult to his legacy, IMO.

(I know Russell had to deal with racism and all that)

Imagine that not only he gets the 5 years backm but also if he played on a good team on a home field where it's 340' to right instead of 380', i.e., the Yankees of that era. He'd have hit 750 homers with a lifetime avg of .330.

 

[kriskanos]

Freddy Lynn was the most amazing out-fielder I ever saw. Dewey Evans was also amazing and had the best arm ever. Carlton Fisk was the best catcher ever. Plus even though Manny is Manny there is no denying the numbers he has put up for this town,and there should always be love given to Big Papi.

You know looking at everyones list there are two guys absent who could have been all time greats and its a shame we did'nt get to see their true potential. Tony Conigliaro and Len Bias. As rich as this town is in stars two of our brightest were snuffed out before their light could fully warm us.

 

[PatriotsReign]

OKAY, for the final time:

- Bill Russell won every single game 7 or important 'win or go home' game in his life, he was 21-0 lifetime.

- 11 NBA Championships in 13 Years
- 2 NCAA Championships carring a scrub college team
- 1 Olympic Gold Medal
- He invented or revolutionized shot blocking, jump shooting, and fast break basketball.

This guy was the ultimate winner, I guess this thread depends on whether you worship stats or individual accomplishments, or just being the most unstoppable dominant winner ever in all athletic history.

"For the final time"???? As if your opinion is the be all & end all?? I don't think so. Your opinion is just that of another bozo on the bus...just like the rest of us...take that as he first & "Final time"!!

 

[Fencer]

Was he a better player than Centers like Wilt, Moses Malone, Lew/Kareem, Shaq, Duncan, Ewing, Akeem, or a healthy Bill Walton? That's debatable. And

You seem to be under the funny impression that Bill Russell wasn't an excellent offensive player.

As for defense, one test is whether or not they at least slowed down the other great centers of their day. Russell and Hakeem passed that test, although Russell's defense against Wilt may be a bit overrated. Duncan famously did not.

I agree that Wilt, Kareem, Hakeem, and Walton all enter the greatest-center discussion. I don't agree that Shaq or Duncan or Malone do. The idea of having Ewing on the list -- please tell me you just typed too quickly on that one.

 

[Fencer]

HAHAHAHA!!

All but one of them are WHITE!

Oh man. Boston Boston Boston.

Hahahahaha.

We deserve our rep, fellas.

Hardly. The Red Sox were a bit racist for a while, and Auerbach happens to have found a number of great white players in row, AFTER utterly leading his sport in racial integration. (Russell would never have been a Celt if it were not for the racism in St. Louis.) And hockey is popular in Boston.

That does NOT all add up to serious racism in the Boston fanbase.

 

[Fencer]

I would have to go with Bobby Orr. Russell was great..but Orr revolutionized the way defensemen played the game.

To repeat -- Russell revolutionized his sport at least as much as Orr did.

 

[Fencer]

If you put Garnett in a time machine and replaced Russell with him, the Celtics would have won about 99% of their games.

Russell was a better shotblocker than Garnett, and his equal or better as a defender, scorer, passer, and inspirational team leader. I don't know about dribbling.

In all other aspects of the game, Garnett is Russell's superior.

 

[Fencer]

Really. I wonder how he lead the league in assists one year then.

By passing up dunks and lay-ins to hit outside shooters with passes in the era before the three-point shot.

Really.

 

[RayClay]

Disagree entirely. Russell was a lanky 6'11" and didn't have the athletic prowess of most of today's players. In that era, only Wilt Chamberlain could match his height (the reason the two were so completely dominant). Shaquille O'Neal, for instance, probably weighs a time and a half what Russell did and could likely match him stride for stride. Not saying that Russell was not among the all-time greats (as I said, I'd pick him second if I could have anyone in the world on my basketball team, after Shaq), but I think that you have to look at how time has changed the scene of athletics.

It's just the simple evolution of the athlete, as people get bigger, stronger, faster on average. Or steroids and growth hormones, take your pick.

There were great offensive linemen in the 1960s and 1970s, but they weighed approximately 250 lbs. They would have been eaten alive by guys like Mike Wright and Dan Klecko, let alone Richard Seymour or Ty Warren.

Russell high jumped 6'9 1/4" (maybe more). He would run any center today into the ground, much like he did then.

He was the second best high jumper in the country at one time and could have jumped in the Olympics, but chose to play Basketball in the Olympics instead.

 

[RayClay]

In that era, only Wilt Chamberlain could match his height (the reason the two were so completely dominant).

There were more good big men then than now. If you don't believe me Ask Pat Riley, Pat williams (sixer, magic exec), Heinson Bob Lanier etc.

"I like Shaq, but he's not in a league with guys like Wilt and (Bill) Russell," said Tom Heinsohn, the old Celtics forward and ex-head coach. "Shaq is this game's ultimate guy. But he's not a dominating guy at both ends of the floor. He doesn't sweep all the boards. Heck, those guys used to break up an entire defense by themselves. Look at the record book. Wilt averaged 50 points a game. Shaq, he's not playing against anybody his own size. So he's just knocking people over. Not only aren't there any centers anymore, there aren't that many power forwards,

"At one time, there were 10 great centers in the league, seven feet or better," said Miami's Pat Riley, who played with Chamberlain and later coached another Hall of Famer, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. "Shaq is the only guy right now who is absolutely dominant, based on sheer force and talent."

Not 7' or better, though they might have looked it to Reilly, LOL!. It was the era of the great center, though. Great article here.

http://espn.go.com/nba/columns/lawrence/836066.html

6 ft 11 235 Nate thurmond

Honors: Elected to Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame (1985); NBA All-Defensive First Team (1969, '71); NBA All-Defensive Second Team (1972, '73, '74); NBA All-Rookie Team (1964); Seven-time NBA All-Star (1965-'68, '70, '73, '74); One of the 50 Greatest Players in NBA History (1996).

Nate Thurmond was one of the all-time great NBA centers, with a rugged, in-your-face style of play that frequently intimidated even Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Wilt Chamberlain. The Hall of Famer played 14 professional seasons in the 1960s and 1970s, posting career averages of 15.0 points and 15.0 rebounds per game.

6 ft 9 in 225 lb Russell

7'1" 275 Wilt Chamberlain

6-11 245 lbs.Walt Bellamy

He averaged 20.1 points and 13.7 rebounds over a career that lasted 13 seasons and one game of a 14th. He is one of only seven players to score more than 20,000 points and grab more than 14,000 rebounds, a group that includes Wilt Chamberlain, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Elvin Hayes, Robert Parish, Moses Malone and Karl Malone. He played in four All-Star Games and he was the NBA's Rookie of the Year in 1962.

6' 10'': 235 Sam Lacey

A 6'10" center from New Mexico State University, Lacey played 13 seasons (1970–1983) in the National Basketball Association as a member of the Cincinnati Royals, Kansas City Kings, New Jersey Nets, and Cleveland Cavaliers. Lacey averaged over 10 rebounds per game in his first six seasons, and was the third leading rebounder in the 1974-75 season. In 1975, he played in the NBA All-Star Game.

He is one of five players (along with Hakeem Olajuwon, Julius Erving, David Robinson, and Ben Wallace) to have registered 100 blocks and 100 steals in six consecutive seasons [1], and he has had his #44 jersey retired by the Sacramento Kings franchise.

 

[oldskool138]

And hockey is popular in Boston.

Boston, Lincolnshire in the UK or Boston, Massachusetts in the USA?

 

[tdw777]

To repeat -- Russell revolutionized his sport at least as much as Orr did.

okay...but I'll still go with Orr.