Thursday Day Night Football: Saints @ Jerryworld Official Game Thread

[bormio]

Any Given Thursday

Even more true than “Any given Sunday”.

 

[captain stone]

Haven't we been saying this for years now? When have they ever really had fast LBs? Even in the heyday their LBs weren't "fast". Bruschi - great player, not really "speedy". Mayo - tackling machine, not really "speedy". Ninkovich, Phifer, Vrabel - solid defenders, not "speedy". Hightower and McGinest and Ted Johnson and Cox and Spikes - thumpers but not "speedy". I'm trying to recall the best, "speedy" linebacker the Pats have had in the BB era. I'm having a hard time coming up with one.

Jamie Collins, maybe?

 

[ivanvamp]

Jamie Collins, maybe?

Yep, forgot about him, if you can believe it. Very fast and athletic, and brought some real positives to the D. Of course....he also submarined them at times because he wasn't disciplined. But other than him, I can't think of a "speedy" LB (and you had to remind me of him!).

 

[Kontradiction]

Yep.

That DAL D is so fast. Even when the pressure was in Brees' face and he'd dump it out to Kamara they held him to very modest gains.

If there is one thing I really want Bill to do in the offseason is pick up a couple of speedy LBs. They just make so much of a difference vs teams like NO, KC, etc (teams with speed in the backfield).

What? You’re not a fan of our massive, lumbering, unathletic backer corps that are built like the Power-I is still the personnel grouping that dominates the NFL?

 

[RobertWeathers]

Haven't we been saying this for years now? When have they ever really had fast LBs? Even in the heyday their LBs weren't "fast". Bruschi - great player, not really "speedy". Mayo - tackling machine, not really "speedy". Ninkovich, Phifer, Vrabel - solid defenders, not "speedy". Hightower and McGinest and Ted Johnson and Cox and Spikes - thumpers but not "speedy". I'm trying to recall the best, "speedy" linebacker the Pats have had in the BB era. I'm having a hard time coming up with one.

Mayo and Collins were the "fastest".

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Any Given Thursday

Knowing goodell, pretty soon itll be ‘any given 4th of july’

 

[PatsFan2]

Amari Cooper catching on well in Dallas I 'll take a young proven player over a Daft pick 24/7.

 

[RobertWeathers]

What? You’re not a fan of our massive, lumbering, unathletic backer corps that are built like the Power-I is still the personnel grouping that dominates the NFL?

Bill is hoping Levon Kirkland comes out of retirement and can help the run D.

In all sincerity I think Bill wants fast LBs but he won't sacrifice "stoutness" for speed.

 

[Kontradiction]

Mayo and Collins were the "fastest".

Belichick clearly saw the need. If he didn’t, he wouldn’t have drafted Sam. Unfortunately, he and his scouting department badly whiffed on that one and Sam sucked all kinds of ass. The good news is that if we see an offense like the 2000 Ravens this year, we’ll completely shut it down.

 

[The Brandon Five]

Belichick clearly saw the need. If he didn’t, he wouldn’t have drafted Sam. Unfortunately, he and his scouting department badly whiffed on that one and Sam sucked all kinds of ass. The good news is that if we see an offense like the 2000 Ravens this year, we’ll completely shut it down.

Bentley was pretty quick and looked good early on. Can't predict a kid is going to get hurt in Week 3.

 

[Kontradiction]

Bentley was pretty quick and looked good early on. Can't predict a kid is going to get hurt in Week 3.

Yep. Bentley too. Good call. He was a good pick. It’s still a shame that he waited so long to address the need.

 

[PatsFan2]

Really want the Rams to be that #1 Seed the Saints with Brees scare me.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Belichick clearly saw the need. If he didn’t, he wouldn’t have drafted Sam. Unfortunately, he and his scouting department badly whiffed on that one and Sam sucked all kinds of ass. The good news is that if we see an offense like the 2000 Ravens this year, we’ll completely shut it down.

I think he is hoping Obi gives them something in that area.

Bentley lost 10 lbs which helped his speed and showed promise but he wasn't a pure sideline-to-sideline LB.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Haven't we been saying this for years now? When have they ever really had fast LBs? Even in the heyday their LBs weren't "fast". Bruschi - great player, not really "speedy". Mayo - tackling machine, not really "speedy". Ninkovich, Phifer, Vrabel - solid defenders, not "speedy". Hightower and McGinest and Ted Johnson and Cox and Spikes - thumpers but not "speedy". I'm trying to recall the best, "speedy" linebacker the Pats have had in the BB era. I'm having a hard time coming up with one.

Mayo played pretty rigidly within the scheme, but he was one of the fastest LB in the entire NFL. I know we didn't get to see him unleashed very frequently, and he wasn't a world beater in coverage, but his 10 yard split was absolutely insane for a guy that big.

Jerod Mayo:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.54
20 Yrd Dash: 2.58
10 Yrd Dash: 1.51


Von Miller:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.53
20 Yrd Dash: 2.64
10 Yrd Dash: 1.62


Luke Kuechly:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.58
20 Yrd Dash: 2.63
10 Yrd Dash: 1.57


Bobby Wagner (pro day; add .05 or .1 seconds) :

40 Yrd Dash: 4.46
20 Yrd Dash: 2.64
10 Yrd Dash: 1.57


Vander Esch:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.65
20 Yrd Dash: 2.69
10 Yrd Dash: 1.56


Roquan Smith:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.51
20 Yrd Dash: 2.63
10 Yrd Dash: 1.58


Tremaine Edmunds:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.54
20 Yrd Dash: 2.65
10 Yrd Dash: 1.60


Oh, and the favorite for the rookie DPOY of the year? Not even that "fast."

Darius Leonard:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.70
20 Yrd Dash: 2.77
10 Yrd Dash: 1.69


A lot of it is scheme. Belichick may want to consider the need to bring in some speed and size in future drafts. I was a big fan of Genard Avery and Leon Jacobs as late round LBs with speed and at least some coverage ability.

At least we got Obi to match up on TEs. At 6'4 and 225, he's an imposing, explosive presence.


40 Yrd Dash: 4.40
20 Yrd Dash: 2.55
10 Yrd Dash: 1.51

Vertical Jump: 44
Broad Jump: 11'08"

 

[Froob]

Yep. Bentley too. Good call. He was a good pick. It’s still a shame that he waited so long to address the need.

Man if that kid shows back up and ends up getting cut or something...we badly need him to be good. He seemed to actually have good awareness to go with the speed. Why was he such a late pick?

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Bentley was pretty quick and looked good early on. Can't predict a kid is going to get hurt in Week 3.

Yep. Bentley too. Good call. He was a good pick. It’s still a shame that he waited so long to address the need.

Bentley lost 10 lbs which helped his speed and showed promise but he wasn't a pure sideline-to-sideline LB.

Reports I read from other scouts had Bentley listed as a 4.67 guy, but Draft Scout has him at 4.75. Still, if he dropped 10 pounds and worked on that first step (which looked fine to me on tape), then it's not unreasonable to expect that he's relatively in line with Leonard or Vander Esch. I'm hopeful that he'll continue to improve in space, but regardless, he seems like a fine ILB for the team to develop.

40 Yrd Dash: 4.75
20 Yrd Dash: 2.69
10 Yrd Dash: 1.66

 

[RobertWeathers]

Reports I read from other scouts had Bentley listed as a 4.67 guy, but Draft Scout has him at 4.75. Still, if he dropped 10 pounds and worked on that first step (which looked fine to me on tape), then it's not unreasonable to expect that he's relatively in line with Leonard or Vander Esch. I'm hopeful that he'll continue to improve in space, but regardless, he seems like a fine ILB for the team to develop.

40 Yrd Dash: 4.75
20 Yrd Dash: 2.69
10 Yrd Dash: 1.66

...and these measurables are from his pro day in which he is listed at 246. I think hes closer to that than 265. Ive seen him next to Hightower and High is much bigger.

I wonder if he lost too much weight too quickly and that hurt his times?

 

[ivanvamp]

Mayo played pretty rigidly within the scheme, but he was one of the fastest LB in the entire NFL. I know we didn't get to see him unleashed very frequently, and he wasn't a world beater in coverage, but his 10 yard split was absolutely insane for a guy that big.

Jerod Mayo:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.54
20 Yrd Dash: 2.58
10 Yrd Dash: 1.51


Von Miller:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.53
20 Yrd Dash: 2.64
10 Yrd Dash: 1.62


Luke Kuechly:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.58
20 Yrd Dash: 2.63
10 Yrd Dash: 1.57


Bobby Wagner (pro day; add .05 or .1 seconds) :

40 Yrd Dash: 4.46
20 Yrd Dash: 2.64
10 Yrd Dash: 1.57


Vander Esch:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.65
20 Yrd Dash: 2.69
10 Yrd Dash: 1.56


Roquan Smith:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.51
20 Yrd Dash: 2.63
10 Yrd Dash: 1.58


Tremaine Edmunds:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.54
20 Yrd Dash: 2.65
10 Yrd Dash: 1.60


Oh, and the favorite for the rookie DPOY of the year? Not even that "fast."

Darius Leonard:

40 Yrd Dash: 4.70
20 Yrd Dash: 2.77
10 Yrd Dash: 1.69


A lot of it is scheme. Belichick may want to consider the need to bring in some speed and size in future drafts. I was a big fan of Genard Avery and Leon Jacobs as late round LBs with speed and at least some coverage ability.

At least we got Obi to match up on TEs. At 6'4 and 225, he's an imposing, explosive presence.


40 Yrd Dash: 4.40
20 Yrd Dash: 2.55
10 Yrd Dash: 1.51

Vertical Jump: 44
Broad Jump: 11'08"

Good post. I never saw Mayo as being that fast at all. Not slow, but not "speedy". I do think there's a difference between 40-speed and game speed. Maybe it's scheme. I just see opposing TEs and RBs routinely (and this has been happening for years) run away from our LBs. So maybe it's coverage skills and not speed? I dunno. But we haven't been fast at LB for some time.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Good post. I never saw Mayo as being that fast at all. Not slow, but not "speedy". I do think there's a difference between 40-speed and game speed. Maybe it's scheme. I just see opposing TEs and RBs routinely (and this has been happening for years) run away from our LBs. So maybe it's coverage skills and not speed? I dunno. But we haven't been fast at LB for some time.

I think it's a combination of scheme responsibility, coaching, and the individual's coverage ability. Measurements are also poor substitutes for reaction and processing speed. Sometimes a slower guy with great instincts and game knowledge gets moving a step sooner, and that makes all the difference. Remember, we used to have this specimen on the roster (I think he made over 30 starts for the Patriots, in fact), but I don't know that any of us would consider him a tier 1 coverage LB.


Height: 6015
Weight: 245
40 Yrd Dash: 4.47
20 Yrd Dash: 2.53
10 Yrd Dash: 1.46
225 Lb. Bench Reps: 16
Vertical Jump: 40
Broad Jump: 10'06"
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.33
3-Cone Drill: 7.07


Any guesses without looking him up?

 

[JarOfMayo51]

Yep, forgot about him, if you can believe it. Very fast and athletic, and brought some real positives to the D. Of course....he also submarined them at times because he wasn't disciplined. But other than him, I can't think of a "speedy" LB (and you had to remind me of him!).

Gary Guyton was a fast Lb back in the early 2000s as well, I think they even had him playing out of the safety position at times

Roosevelt Colvin maybe? Although he was never the same player after that hip injury

Adalius Thomas was pretty fast too I recall, but turned into a total bust of a signing for us

But yea, cupboard has been bare for awhile in terms of fast Lbs