Through 12 weeks.. thoughts on Gordon?

[n6249c]

The key point here is that the RFA tender, unlike the franchise tag, is not guaranteed.

NBD. Tender him at the first round level, tell him they’d like to sign him to a longer contract but want him to test the market first. If there’s no interest offer him a deal as I described, otherwise decide whether or not to match whatever offer he gets. Or tender him and put the long term deal on the table, let him shop the market with that offer in hand. Given his history and a first round tender it seems unlikely to me that any other team will match a decent long term deal. Plus he seems to like it here, and he’s smart enough to know it’s good for him.

 

[mcmurtry86]

He’s been solid but not an impact player. A few great plays but otherwise just an average starting WR. Looks slower than he did in Cleveland and he’s struggled to separate quickly

A huge upgrade over the garbage that is Patterson and Dorsett but not anything special. Maybe he will pick it up down the stretch. The Pats need him to given Gronk and Edelman’s deterioration and questionable durability

 

[TB_Helmet]

I don't know how you can conclude this

He’s been solid but not an impact player. A few great plays but otherwise just an average starting WR. Looks slower than he did in Cleveland and he’s struggled to separate quickly

A huge upgrade over the garbage that is Patterson and Dorsett but not anything special. Maybe he will pick it up down the stretch. The Pats need him to given Gronk and Edelman’s deterioration and questionable durability

After seeing this

Since the Chicago game his pace over 16 games would have him with 70 rec 1353 yards which 1353 would have him top 5 all-time single season for Pats

Welker 1569 (2011)
Moss 1493 (2007)
Morgan 1491 (1986)
Welker 1354 (2012)
Welker 1348 (2009)
Gronk 1327 (2010)

I started at Chicago because at that point he had been practicing in the system for 4 weeks

 

[supafly]

He’s been solid but not an impact player. A few great plays but otherwise just an average starting WR.

With a 1-2 record and the crap that we had at the position at the time, coughing up a 5th rounder for Josh Gordon seems like a genius move when we’ve gone 7-1 since the acquisition.

I agree with you idea that he’s been solid but unspectacular, but like I said before, we’ve never seen an in-season pickup at WR who has been able to produce as quickly as he has. I believe that he’ll improve with more time in the system and a full offseason of running up the hill. What we’re seeing now is impressive if you consider the fact that Gordon was likely at his lowest (in terms of on the field product) when he arrived.

Any way you look at it, they’d be stupid not to place a high round tender on him for reasonable money.

 

[Caretaker]

Well I think he's a solid WR #2 for this offense. Hopefully with a full offseason he'll make more impact. Next year he's 28, just as LaFell in 2014, so 1000 yards with 60% catch rate will be a reasonable bottom line.

 

[Gronk]

I think it’s good they fell ass backwards into this trade opportunity because otherwise they clearly had either zero plan, or a very ****ty plan, for stocking the WR position.

Hard to argue with the production. He’s been good but not a world beater. Think the arrow is pointing up and could be really amazing next year. BUT THEY WERENT EVEN PLANNING ON HAVING HIM SO OMG WHAT DOES THIS LOOK LIKE WITHOUT HIM?!? Oh, I know...2013. But without young Edelman. Whither Amendola? Oh well, it is what it is and all’s well...if it ends well.

 

[RayClay]

We got allpro talent with troubles for a 5th. What was the question again?

 

[RayClay]

Of course, he's not as good as Ochicinco or Galloway...

 

[RobertWeathers]

I think it’s good they fell ass backwards into this trade opportunity because otherwise they clearly had either zero plan, or a very ****ty plan, for stocking the WR position.

Hard to argue with the production. He’s been good but not a world beater. Think the arrow is pointing up and could be really amazing next year. BUT THEY WERENT EVEN PLANNING ON HAVING HIM SO OMG WHAT DOES THIS LOOK LIKE WITHOUT HIM?!? Oh, I know...2013. But without young Edelman. Whither Amendola? Oh well, it is what it is and all’s well...if it ends well.

You don't know. They might have gone harder at Tate.

 

[primetime]

He's been solid, with flashes of spectacular, after coming to a team with an offense that's notoriously difficult for even Hall of Fame caliber receivers to pick up with a full training camp under their belt. He hadn't played football in several years until December of last year and then missed training camp with the Browns this season, so in addition to learning the offense he's out of football shape.

But he catches everything thrown his way, his chemistry with Brady's growing, he seems to be learning more of the playbook weekly, getting in better shape, and he's making the occasional absurd play the likes of which we haven't seen since Randy Moss, who's merely the second greatest wide receiver to ever live.

The expectations of fans were outrageous, that he would come in and be Randy Moss. He has that talent, and you can see it's still there, but he's playing with a 41 year old Brady rather than a 30 year old Brady and he missed camp and came midseason. It was always going to be an uphill climb for him and he's been making that climb as well as anyone would have dared to hope.

There's a secret advantage to him coming along slowly this year, and it's that the Patriots may be able to sign him long-term without having to break the bank. They'll have him for at least another year - no team's going to tender him a 1st as an RFA with a possible expulsion from the league looming - but they could have him for another five.

Even in just eight games, Gordon is having the best season of any new receiver the Patriots have acquired over the summer or after a season began who didn’t have a previous tenure in New England (those qualifiers remove Deion Branch, who was reacquired in 2010 after a stint with the Seattle Seahawks). The Patriots’ install their offense during training camp. Because they run a complex offense, it’s hard to get caught up after missing any part of that process.

Here’s Gordon’s competition:

Andre Davis, 2002: 9 receptions: 190 yards, one touchdown
Doug Gabriel, 2006: 25 catches, 344 yards, three touchdowns
Chad Johnson, 2011: 15 catches, 276 yards, one touchdown
Greg Salas, 2012: No catches in one game
Keshawn Martin, 2015: 24 catches, 269 yards, two touchdowns
Phillip Dorsett, 2017: 12 catches, 194 yards, no touchdowns


Running back Danny Woodhead also had 34 catches for 379 yards with one touchdown after being acquired early in the 2010 season. Tight end Tim Wright caught 26 passes for 259 yards with six touchdowns after being acquired in a trade after training camp in 2014.

And this isn’t even mentioning guys like Reggie Wayne and Eric Decker who never even made it out of camp.

(This misses Austin Collie as well but he wouldn't change the picture.)

 

[JackBauer]

I don't know how you can conclude this

Consider who you're talking to.

 

[Nehalem]

TLDR for the thread

Gordon had no offseason with the Patriots, had a bad hamstring, and was out of shape, but his production essentially matches what Brandin Cooks gave us last season.

Grade: C-

 

[1960Pats]

I feel the same about Gordon after 12 weeks as I did when he came here. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that he'll stay clean.

 

[p8ryts]

You were only down on him after the titans game?

I wasn't up on him

 

[maineman209]

Edelman’s deterioration

Seriously? Based on what?

 

[WaterfallJumper]

He’s been solid but not an impact player. A few great plays but otherwise just an average starting WR. Looks slower than he did in Cleveland and he’s struggled to separate quickly

A huge upgrade over the garbage that is Patterson and Dorsett but not anything special. Maybe he will pick it up down the stretch. The Pats need him to given Gronk and Edelman’s deterioration and questionable durability

Average starting receiver? He's been here for 8 games. He has 31 catches for 547 yards (17.6 average) and 2 TDs. You're telling me that a 60+ catch, 1100 yard receiver (extrapolating his production) is only average and struggles to separate? Several of his catches have been spectacular. He's still catching up to speed on the playbook and recovering from an injury, not to mention multiple years of not even playing football. I don't even know what to say . . .

Edelman's deterioration? What?? He's on pace for one of his best seasons ever. I really question where you're getting these ideas from -- the only one that makes sense is Gronk's durability. I'll give you that one (because arguing otherwise would be stupid), but I'm burning my hands responding to these hot takes.

Julian Edelman Stats | Pro-Football-Reference.com

 

[RobertWeathers]

Average starting receiver? He's been here for 8 games. He has 31 catches for 547 yards (17.6 average) and 2 TDs. You're telling me that a 60+ catch, 1100 yard receiver (extrapolating his production) is only average and struggles to separate? Several of his catches have been spectacular. He's still catching up to speed on the playbook and recovering from an injury, not to mention multiple years of not even playing football. I don't even know what to say . . .

Edelman's deterioration? What?? He's on pace for one of his best seasons ever. I really question where you're getting these ideas from -- the only one that makes sense is Gronk's durability. I'll give you that one (because arguing otherwise would be stupid), but I'm burning my hands responding to these hot takes.

Julian Edelman Stats | Pro-Football-Reference.com

McMurtry takes a steaming dump on everything. Hes the biggest wet blanket on this board.

 

[Observer]

He has been about as good as any WR not named Moss. Catches what comes his way, does not get injured so he’s been excellent in my books. Would easily give up a second rounder for him.

 

[Kontradiction]

I don't know how you can conclude this



After seeing this

Well, generally speaking, you come to a conclusion like that if you're a moron.

 

[BradytoMosstoGronk]

He’s been solid but not an impact player. A few great plays but otherwise just an average starting WR. Looks slower than he did in Cleveland and he’s struggled to separate quickly

A huge upgrade over the garbage that is Patterson and Dorsett but not anything special. Maybe he will pick it up down the stretch. The Pats need him to given Gronk and Edelman’s deterioration and questionable durability