(They say) This Hypothetical Earl Thomas-Patriots Trade Makes Ton Of Sense

[supafly]

Can we actually commence to talk about Earl Thomas now??

Not sure what we can discuss that hasn’t already been covered? We have 3 safeties that play as starters, one of which happens to cost 12m and is our 3rd highest cap hit on the entire team. Chung and Harmon were both recently extended, as well, and Earl Thomas has a 10.5m dollar cap hit, himself.

That’s not even bringing up the fact that it would be foolish to part with the 2nd round asking price for him, which is why Dallas’ safety group remains in shambles, and they are the ones who have shown actual interest in him. The position of safety is one of our most talented positions on the team, so unless they’re planning on parting with Harmon so they can trade a high round pick AND pay 3x as much, this is just a silly article.

 

[Lee144]

I played football many years, through college and have coached some. You?

Everything I have said in this thread is completely accurate and either you don’t know what you are talking about or you struggle with comprehension.

Where and when? And for what teams did you coach? I’m going to go out on a limb and say aside from being a fan you have had zero presence within any locker room or offensive play development during the past 25 years. The most important aspect of a play occurs at the LOS pre snap and involves everyone reading what the D is showing. JM is a big fan of WR flexibility and having multiple responsibilities pre-snap. Do you find it ironic that of all the people that post here, you have argued with a majority of them? My college positition coach as well as several other position coaches on the team are now or have been NFL coaches.

 

[Ring 6]

Where and when? And for what teams did you coach? I’m going to go out on a limb and say aside from being a fan you have had zero presence within any locker room or offensive play development during the past 25 years.

You would be wrong

The most important aspect of a play occurs at the LOS pre snap and involves everyone reading what the D is showing.

At what point did I say anything that conflicts with this?

JM is a big fan of WR flexibility and having multiple responsibilities pre-snap.

And his offense involved the qb having progressions. It’s like you want to say things that aren’t what I am discussing and act like they affect it.

Do you find it ironic that of all the people that post here, you have argued with a majority of them?

Not at all. My purpose in using this board is finding things I disagree with to discuss. Reasonable people often disagree. Do you agree with everything everyone says?

My college positition coach as well as several other position coaches on the team are now or have been NFL coaches.

Congrats but I don’t know what that has to do with the fact that Brady was following his assignment on the play and going through his progressions.

 

[Lee144]

Andy, that’s just it. Whatever play gets called in a huddle can and does change at the LOS. Brady’s progression doesn’t involve following anyone regardless of wether that player was the target. You could have a play in which two players are your primary and you’re targeting a specific defender or mismatch. You are implying the play in question had player X as the primary and Brady has to follow that play progression from snap to break and that’s just not efficient nor likely. Brady’s assignment is to read a defense, the same as his receivers and backs.

 

[Ring 6]

Andy, that’s just it. Whatever play gets called in a huddle can and does change at the LOS. Brady’s progression doesn’t involve following anyone regardless of wether that player was the target. You could have a play in which two players are your primary and you’re targeting a specific defender or mismatch.

None of that conflicts with what I am saying.

You are implying the play in question had player X as the primary and Brady has to follow that play progression from snap to break and that’s just not efficient nor likely. Brady’s assignment is to read a defense, the same as his receivers and backs.

Let me state it a different way.
The play is designed with progressions. Those progressions change based upon what the defense does.
On this play based upon everything, Gronk was the read and Brady isn’t going to abandon his read because a check down is open

 

[luuked]

Someone was arguing that Thomas was a "centerfielder." I took that to mean that he wasn't tough enough, so I posted a video where he nailed Gronk, a tough player 70 pounds heavier, and walked away like nothing happened. That's not a knock on Gronk, but just shows how tough a guy Earl Thomas is.

If that is what you think OTG meant by centerfielder then I guess I understand why you posted the video. I just could not make the connection.

I don't think OTG was questioning if Thomas could punish as hard as a SS but I think we can all agree that he could not do consistently what a player like Chancellor is bringing to the table in the box. Yes. Thomas can clearly hit hard but the thing that makes him an elite safety is his play recognition and range. Put him somewhere where this becomes less important and he becomes quickly overpaid because that is not where his value lies.

 

[Kontradiction]

None of that conflicts with what I am saying.


Let me state it a different way.
The play is designed with progressions. Those progressions change based upon what the defense does.
On this play based upon everything, Gronk was the read and Brady isn’t going to abandon his read because a check down is open

Absolutely nothing about the coverage that the Eagles were throwing at the Pats on that play signaled that Gronk, with a deep-breaking out route, should have been the primary read. That's the problem here. That you're failing to grasp that is, to put it quite mildly, absolutely stunning for someone that claims to be as knowledgeable about football as you claim to. In your first few posts in this thread, you came off as someone that had absolutely no idea that a QB's progressions can and do change based on what the defense both presents at the LoS and what they do after the snap. Now it looks like you're backtracking to CYA in an almost "Yeah, I knew that!" sort of way.

 

[Off The Grid]

Someone was arguing that Thomas was a "centerfielder." I took that to mean that he wasn't tough enough...

Well, you couldn't've gotten it wronger. "CenterFielder" is my term for Free Safety, as I specifically stated in the post to which you issued your idiotic response.

My point ~ which I hadn't thought it possible to miss ~ was that, with us paying McCourty a mint already and with Harmon around, as well, paying a ton for Thomas on top of those struck me as a spectacularly stupid idea...and that's before giving up Mason for'm.

*Edit. Let me add, having now noted that you were among those applauding the trade the very loudest, that I am not disparaging the intelligence of those of you who feel that way. I am disparaging the intelligence of the trade itself, which I find utterly ludicrous.

 

[captain stone]

Apologies if this has already been mentioned somewhere during the previous 6 pages, but:

Why in the world would we want to trade for Earl Thomas, and the salary cap hit associated with him, when Tre Boston, Eric Reid & Kenny Vaccaro are all available at 1/10th of the cost with no surrender of assets whatsoever? I admit that none of Boston, Reid & Vaccaro are the same caliber of player that Thomas is, but he isn't 10x better than any of them either.

Now if Seattle is willing to accept McCourty & all of his cap implications, then maybe...

 

[tom444]

The situation was that he had a good match for Gronk, and his line had been getting the job done. His situational awareness was fine. The timing of Mason's matador work was not.

Whatever, it's almost July, that was last season.

 

[Chuck Walden]

Yeah hard pass for me. Thomas is great, but I’d rather have Mason. Keeping Brady upright should be priority number one, and keeping Mason leads to fewer hits on Brady.
New England Patriots Should Stay Away From Earl Thomas - Last Word on Pro Football

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Earl Thomas asks Seahawks either to extend him or “let’s make a trade happen”

 

[TB_Helmet]

I like Mason but I don’t understand when he became this elite guard commanding 8 figures annually. Seems that has been a topic of discussion only recently.

He is a very good run blocker but that’s less important in today’s game. And don’t forget he missed the block that led to the Brady fumble that lost the Super Bowl.

I hope we keep him but of all the players to break the bank for, I’d put him lower on the list.

By the way, (I forget the context of this post but whatever), BSJ said recently that Mason might be the best right guard in the league (take that source for what it’s worth).

That’s eyebrow raising in my opinion. I don’t watch enough film to be able to accurately rank right guards around the league but I know that he didn’t give up the fewest sacks in the league at that position (admittedly as I said he’s great in the run game). Maybe people who know more than I would agree that he’s the top guard...but if so, that’s another thing to be excited about going into the season, and maybe a reason to pay the man. And it should be included in any discussion of BBs draft track record.

 

[zoostation]

Only thing I'd say is a dominant secondary is what wins us Superbowls.
I'd much rather trade for a pass rush and develop the young guys once You get rid of players who can't cover or take angles you'll be surprised how good this secondary looks.
We have studs in Gilmore Mccourty a very good tough nosed player in Chung alot of potential between all the young developmental corners.
A potentially very good Nickel in Jonathan Jones.
We don't know if Rowe is a good player who was injured and ineffective or if Rowe is a long line in players who can't put it together once they get in the NFL.
If only we could put Richards brain in Rowe's body we might have something.
A more simplified aggressive scheme sounds to me like we prefer players who can take angles hit and cover vs know all the assignments but can't carry out one of them.
If so THANK YOU!

You're probably going to laugh ....... but don't forget about Cyrus Jones

 

[zoostation]

Not at all. My purpose in using this board is finding things I disagree with to discuss. Reasonable people often disagree. Do you agree with everything everyone says?

Just my wife. But she's not even close to being reasonable.

 

[zoostation]

Anyway, he wasn't situationally aware, and it cost.

Seriously? He was being Tom Brady and going for the juggler.

 

[maust]

I said the QB in the pocket must read through his progressions and it’s ignorant to suggest that he give up on the primary route that the play call and coverage dictate to see if h has a checkdown.

What??? How is it that a QB "must read through his progressions" but in so doing not "see if he has a checkdown" available? By definition those two things are mutually exclusive. How can anyone that even cursorily follows football, never mind a self professed expert, make such a harebrained statement? What's truly ignorant (and completely contradictory) to suggest is a QB is giving up on the presnap preferred play (primary in your parlance) simply by doing his job and going through his progressions to at least 'see if he has a checkdown.'

 

[maust]

Not at all. My purpose in using this board is finding things I disagree with...

That much is painfully apparent and something we can all agree with.

 

[maust]

Seriously? He was being Tom Brady and going for the juggler.

The Juggler? Is that The Riddler's dimwitted cousin?

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

The only way a trade for Thomas makes sense is if they ship McCourty the other way. First off, the Seahawks should be examined for brain damage if they even contemplated that, because Thomas is a far superior player.

Trading McCourty would mean a 3.9 million dollar cap hit and a 8 million dollar cap savings. Seattle would take only a 1.9 million dollar cap hit and would also save 8.5 million on their cap. So the money works both ways. But I can't see Seattle making this deal. if they did, I would drive McCourty to the airport!