The Situation At Safety

[mayoclinic]

I want to see more of Harmon before they go out and put a high pick or big contract into a new SS. Harmon played reasonably well at both FS and SS, and he showed an ability to put hits on WRs attempting catches down the sideline. I know he's not the "intimidating" SS that people want, but it looks like once his brain catches up to his body, he'll be a better player than Gregory.

To me, replacing Gregory is priority #1 this offseason.

It's not even priority #5 in mine.

Agreed. Safety is one of the least worrisome positions on this team.

Even if Safety were a high need, cutting Gregory wouldn't be a high need. He'd still be needed to compete for a backup reps.

I'd be content to go into training camp letting Gregory and Harmon battle for the #2/3 safety positions, and draft a day 3 rookie to compete with Tavon Wilson for the #4 spot (I think Ebner is secure as a core STer). Someone like Antone Exum or Jonathan Dowling, who also has CB versatility would be my preference. The bar isn't too high to leapfrog Wilson, and if they happen to play well enough to move up the depth chart, that would be gravy.

I wouldn't be upset if someone like Calvin Pryor fell to #29 and we took him, or Lamarcus Joyner round 2, but I don't see those as a likely target, or likely to happen.

 

[TriplecHamp]

Way to much Gregory love in here for my tastes. Late in Run support, late in coverage, there has been a handful of times over the past two years where you can say "Gregory made a play" meanwhile you have rookies like Cyprien and Eric Reid while having their rookie struggles, making multiple plays a game. There are 4 safeties in this draft that I think could walk in and be an immediate upgrade over Gregory.

 

[captain stone]

Re: 2014 Pats Salary Cap Breakdown - Safeties

...Like Gregory, I see Adrian Wilson's spot on the Patriots dependent on how much space the Pats need to sign/extend their players like Talib, Wendell, and McCourty...

Why in the world would Wendy be re-signed?

 

[Deus Irae]

Might as well get started on the position early.

Cut A. Wilson
Approach Gregory about a cut. If he won't take it, cut him.
Extend McCourty, if he's being reasonable about his number.

T. Wilson and Ebner can be cut later in the offseason, after upgrades are found. The same goes for Davis. Alternately, Ebner can be kept as one of the positional-spotwasting "ST only" guys.

Harmon stays as the #4 safety if Gregory takes the cut, or the #3 safety if Gregory refuses.

Then go out and get a starting safety. If Gregory gets cut, also look for competition for that S3 spot.

 

[Jackson 2]

Can Bequette play safety?

 

[TonyTucker]

Tavon Wilson is ready to make a big leap, I'm glad they stole him in the 2nd.

 

[ausbacker]

I'd take a blowtorch to the Safety position and cut Gregory and Wilson outright. It's unfortunate for Wilson that Father Time has caught up with him and Gregory, well he's a slightly better version of Patrick Chung prone to similar mistakes. Outside of the odd game or two, I'm just not all that comfortable with him wearing the green dot when required.

The Patriots need to get more athletic at SS. They also need an enforcer. I'm sick of watching people run over the middle without being clobbered.

 

[Miguel]

Gregory must have reached $500K in incentives since Field Yates is reporting that his 2014 cap number is now $3,683,334

 

[50-yard-line]

CUT ADRIAN WILSON EARLY
This saves little. However, if Belichick sees him as done, then he should be cut.

Suppose BB doesn't think he's done?

 

[Froob]

I'd like to keep Gregory. Maybe at a reduced salary if he'll agree to it. He'll at least provide quality dept. It's the NFL, injuries are bound to hit. You'd like to upgrade over Gregory but, if you can't he can do a decent job. Who knows if Harmon will regress.

 

[mgteich]

If Belichick doesn't think he's done, then he'll be given an opportunity to compete for a roster spot in camp. We save under $700K by cutting him.

Suppose BB doesn't think he's done?

 

[mgteich]

I don't see why our starting safety would agree to less than $2.25M in salary plus incentives, and a role as a backup.

I would think that he would simply say "no" and let the team cut him.

The team would then see who they could get in free agency to replace him at $2.25M and someone else would get a potential starter at a bargain $2.25M.

I'd like to keep Gregory. Maybe at a reduced salary if he'll agree to it. He'll at least provide quality dept. It's the NFL, injuries are bound to hit. You'd like to upgrade over Gregory but, if you can't he can do a decent job. Who knows if Harmon will regress.

 

[ashley]

Way to much Gregory love in here for my tastes. Late in Run support, late in coverage, there has been a handful of times over the past two years where you can say "Gregory made a play" meanwhile you have rookies like Cyprien and Eric Reid while having their rookie struggles, making multiple plays a game. There are 4 safeties in this draft that I think could walk in and be an immediate upgrade over Gregory.

Great post, I agree 100%. I think it is a must that we go into next season with an upgrade at safety. I don't mind having Gregory as the number 3 or number 4 guy, but he can't be our starting safety. Too many big 3rd down conversions against him and not enough intimidation. I'm 5'7" and 120 pounds, and I would bring more of an intimidation presence. Seriously though, even for those against picking a safety in the first round of the draft, there is enough talent in this years draft to get a starting safety in rounds 2-4 that would be an upgrade.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

Gregory is god awful! I would cut him regardless of his salary. He is a waste of a roster spot! McCourty is average, at BEST! I can not understand the McCourty love around here. He made what, one nice play (the int. in the Saints game) in 18 games? Can someone else come up with any others? He had One interception this year. Zero sacks, Zero tackles for loss, hell he played safety and only had 69 tackles all year!

Look at his stats for the playoff game against the Colts. was he even on the field? No pass defended, NO tackles!! How do you play an entire game and not make a single tackle???

He is a JAG!!!

The Pats need to find both a strong and a free safety! For the love of God, please find a safety that can hit someone!!

Gee did anyone watch the last football game of the year? You know the one where the Broncos star receiver got crushed going over the middle on the first series, and the game was basically over after that? The NFL is a passing league now, and what the Seahawks did, was basically build their defense from the back forward. They have two big safeties and two big corners. The disrupt timing routes and you saw the results. The team that the Pats couldn't stop to save their lives, was humiliated!!

I love Talib, I love what he brings. Hate that he gets hurt. I would cry if they don't bring him back and clone him. But please, bring back a Rodney/Lawyer Milloy type safety, and one that isn't in his thrities!!

 

[All22PatsFan]

Gregory is god awful! I would cut him regardless of his salary. He is a waste of a roster spot! McCourty is average, at BEST! I can not understand the McCourty love around here. He made what, one nice play (the int. in the Saints game) in 18 games? Can someone else come up with any others? He had One interception this year. Zero sacks, Zero tackles for loss, hell he played safety and only had 69 tackles all year!

Look at his stats for the playoff game against the Colts. was he even on the field? No pass defended, NO tackles!! How do you play an entire game and not make a single tackle???

He is a JAG!!!

The Pats need to find both a strong and a free safety! For the love of God, please find a safety that can hit someone!!

Gee did anyone watch the last football game of the year? You know the one where the Broncos star receiver got crushed going over the middle on the first series, and the game was basically over after that? The NFL is a passing league now, and what the Seahawks did, was basically build their defense from the back forward. They have two big safeties and two big corners. The disrupt timing routes and you saw the results. The team that the Pats couldn't stop to save their lives, was humiliated!!

I love Talib, I love what he brings. Hate that he gets hurt. I would cry if they don't bring him back and clone him. But please, bring back a Rodney/Lawyer Milloy type safety, and one that isn't in his thrities!!

McCourty was only targeted 18 times this year and he only allowed 9 catches.He played the most snaps among the DBs. Watch Dmac on film he is a stud, many analyists consider him to be the best FS in the game. Stats are for losers.

 

[Sciz]

McCourty is average, at BEST! I can not understand the McCourty love around here. He made what, one nice play (the int. in the Saints game) in 18 games? Can someone else come up with any others? He had One interception this year. Zero sacks, Zero tackles for loss, hell he played safety and only had 69 tackles all year!

Look at his stats for the playoff game against the Colts. was he even on the field? No pass defended, NO tackles!! How do you play an entire game and not make a single tackle???

He is a JAG!!!

You don't seem to understand McCourty's role in the defense. His job isn't to make good plays. His job is to not make bad ones. And when it comes to minimizing bad plays, he's among the best in the NFL. His job is not to make TFLs or sacks. His job is to prevent deep passes. He did an awfully good job of that. Also, you need to work on your fact checking:

Geno Smith pass complete short left to Chris Ivory for -2 yards (tackle by Devin McCourty)

Giovani Bernard left end for -4 yards (tackle by Devin McCourty). Giovani Bernard fumbles (forced by Devin McCourty), recovered by Jerod Mayo at CIN-46 and returned for 2 yards (tackle by Clint Boling)

But you know who actually didn't have a TFL or sack all season? Earl Thomas.

It's also hilariously awful that you think McCourty only had one good play all season. How about the tipped interception to Cole? That forced fumble that gave the Pats an extra life against the Bengals? There are more, but if you can't remember those two, then there's not really any point in arguing with you about any more of them. You're box score scouting a free safety, who by design is the furthest guy from the ball on the majority of the defensive snaps, and you can't even get your box score stats right.

They have two big safeties

5'10", 202 pounds is big? I get that Earl Thomas is an awfully darn good safety, but you can't seem to get anything right about him.

 

[Mack Herron]

You don't seem to understand McCourty's role in the defense. His job isn't to make good plays. His job is to not make bad ones. And when it comes to minimizing bad plays, he's among the best in the NFL. His job is not to make TFLs or sacks. His job is to prevent deep passes. He did an awfully good job of that.

Not sure how you get "awfully good job"? McCourty was voted all pro, but so was Meriweather. Patriots pass defense was closer to the bottom than the top in many important passing stats. In pass plays >20 yards defense was 20th in the NFL, 31st in passing first downs per game, 30th in first down %. Seems to me while he doesn't make a whole lot of plays (not a ball hawk, not a force in the run game, not a physical presence, struggles with his back to the QB) he also gives up plenty. It is also noteworthy that when BB looked for someone to put everyone in the right place (green dot), he tabbed the much maligned Gregory over McCourty. Compared to the turnstyles we have put out there the past few years, McCourty is a welcome relief, but I cannot see how he ranks "among the best in the NFL."

 

[Triumph]

You don't seem to understand McCourty's role in the defense. His job isn't to make good plays. His job is to not make bad ones.

Well, that explains why Mcourty is "Elite". There is no way that he is one of the Stud Safeties in the NFL and worth 5 Million bucks this season.

 

[Triumph]

Not sure how you get "awfully good job"? McCourty was voted all pro, but so was Meriweather. Patriots pass defense was closer to the bottom than the top in many important passing stats. In pass plays >20 yards defense was 20th in the NFL, 31st in passing first downs per game, 30th in first down %. Seems to me while he doesn't make a whole lot of plays (not a ball hawk, not a force in the run game, not a physical presence, struggles with his back to the QB) he also gives up plenty. It is also noteworthy that when BB looked for someone to put everyone in the right place (green dot), he tabbed the much maligned Gregory over McCourty. Compared to the turnstyles we have put out there the past few years, McCourty is a welcome relief, but I cannot see how he ranks "among the best in the NFL."

Spot on Mack.

Mcourty plays deep center field so that he cant get his butt burned. More often that not, he is late or out of the play so you rarely hear his name mentioned. Hes fantastic at flying under the radar.

NFL offensive coordinators are not lying awake at night worried on how they will ever get by Devin "Elite" McCourty.

 

[Sciz]

Not sure how you get "awfully good job"? McCourty was voted all pro, but so was Meriweather. Patriots pass defense was closer to the bottom than the top in many important passing stats. In pass plays >20 yards defense was 20th in the NFL, 31st in passing first downs per game, 30th in first down %. Seems to me while he doesn't make a whole lot of plays (not a ball hawk, not a force in the run game, not a physical presence, struggles with his back to the QB) he also gives up plenty. It is also noteworthy that when BB looked for someone to put everyone in the right place (green dot), he tabbed the much maligned Gregory over McCourty. Compared to the turnstyles we have put out there the past few years, McCourty is a welcome relief, but I cannot see how he ranks "among the best in the NFL."

You can't look at stats to say how well McCourty is doing. It doesn't work. It's not McCourty's job to prevent a 20 yard pass when he's busy covering a guy 40 yards down the field who otherwise would have been wide open. There's hardly ever a time where a 10 yard pass (which is all it takes to get a first down) would be on McCourty. No matter how good a deep safety is, the overall passing defense can only be as good as the guys in front of him.

Yes, it'd be great to have a prime Ed Reed who could not only cover back deep but also bait QBs into throwing to guys that are really covered, but McCourty right now is the next best thing, the guy that just makes QBs not throw at him. I don't really see how you could say that he gave up a lot of plays, because I've probably watched more of McCourty on the all-22 than any other player, and you could count the number of really bad plays that he made all season on one hand. He had the Tavonesque deep TD allowed against the Colts in the playoff game and he was completely "outphysicaled" on a deep ball against Julio Jones, but other than that he was as good as it gets in the NFL at defending deep passes. Do you have any example of these plays that he gave up? I'm not seeing them.

As for the green dot, it doesn't make any sense to have the the furthest guy away from everybody else in charge of the communication. McCourty starts the typical play 15-25 yards off the LOS. Outside of 3rd and a mile, Gregory is more in the 5-15 yard range. Giving McCourty the dot would be like giving it to one of the CBs. That's how far away from everybody else he is.