Speculation: Patriots set to make big trades

[PatsWickedPissah]

Suh is shades of Haynesworth. Hard to imagine the club giving up what it would take to bring him in after having so recently dealt with a headcase DL.

What's with these DLs that think they're WR divas?

 

[JoeSixPat]

I don't know about "big trades" but trades are a normal part of the offseason

Many fans complain when the Patriots don't address all their needs in free agency

Then they complain that they haven't addressed all their needs in the draft

They usually forget about two key additional components of the off-season - trades and pickups from other teams' cuts.

Fans should just be more patient and plan on judging the team once it's assembled and there's been some competition in training camp to retain the best 53

 

[signbabybrady]

What about a three way trade, involving Mallett and another high pick. Suh is going to cost a barrel of money to sign and it would be a consideration in a trade. It's speculation but next to Wilfork ........ Wow.

Either you gets to living or you gets to dying.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Okay, number 1, it was hurting me because I don't follow cap stuff anymore (mainly because every time I thought I learned something from an absolute cap maven dictat on here, something happened in the world of real contracts that mooted what seemed to be the accepted wisdom)

Number 2, continue to educate me using Fitz as a hypothetical case -- I'm not arguing for Fitz here, although whenever someone establishes himself at elite level, there's a natural feeling of "wow wow wow Svissgar, let's get dat guys."

And finally, number 3 - can't the signing team say "yeah and we'll pick up some of your cap hurt" when writing the new contract?

Not saying we would or should. Just trying to get the mechanism down.

not sure why is hurting you but try this:

at simplest: trading a vet who signed a contract with a lot of bonus $ can be cap suicide for the losing team because all that bonus $ that was being prorated over the out-years of the contract - all of a sudden gets lumped back into the here and now in one lump sum.

if player is in last year of a contract it will make no difference;

if he still has 3+ to go; a trade is unlikely.

Ex:
2010: player A: signs 5-year deal for $25M -$1M salary per yr & $20M signing bonus (sb)
cap hit on team each yr: $5M

cap hit in yr traded to losing team:
-if traded in 2011: $16M
(20sb - 4M from 2010) [team out cash of $21M for 1 yr of play]

-if traded in 2012: $12M
(20sb-8 from 2010-11) [team out cash of #22M for 2 yr of play-11M per]

-if traded in 2013: $8M
(etc) [team out $23M for 3 yrs-7.6 per]

-if traded in 2014: $4M
(etc) [team out $24M for 4 yrs-6M per]

obviously trading the guy in 11 or 12 makes no sense; it dumps 10%+ of your cap space on a guy who is going to play for someone else. unless the guy is screwing the coach's wife; a team wont do that.

 

[eom]

Okay, number 1, it was hurting me because I don't follow cap stuff anymore (mainly because every time I thought I learned something from an absolute cap maven dictat on here, something happened in the world of real contracts that mooted what seemed to be the accepted wisdom)

Number 2, continue to educate me using Fitz as a hypothetical case -- I'm not arguing for Fitz here, although whenever someone establishes himself at elite level, there's a natural feeling of "wow wow wow Svissgar, let's get dat guys."

And finally, number 3 - can't the signing team say "yeah and we'll pick up some of your cap hurt" when writing the new contract?

Not saying we would or should. Just trying to get the mechanism down.

you mean if they just signed fitz, or replaced brady with him?

ps #3 = no

 

[Patsgofor4]

I keep coming back to this thread hoping that someone is posting some new, interesting information. Color me disappointed.

 

[Danger Zone]

Ive long thought that the NFL could benefit from some kind of (limited) cap-trading ability to augment a teams use of draft picks.

Teams could trade assume or trade away a certain percentage/amount of their cap room for whatever it is they want.. for picks, to sweet trades etc.

So for example: We could offer a 1st to the Jets for Revis along with giving them 10 million of our maximum cap.

 

[Brady2Moss]

Ive long thought that the NFL could benefit from some kind of (limited) cap-trading ability to augment a teams use of draft picks.

Teams could trade assume or trade away a certain percentage/amount of their cap room for whatever it is they want.. for picks, to sweet trades etc.

So for example: We could offer a 1st to the Jets for Revis along with giving them 10 million of our maximum cap.

And then pay Revis in peanuts!

 

[Gumby]

Okay, number 1, it was hurting me because I don't follow cap stuff anymore (mainly because every time I thought I learned something from an absolute cap maven dictat on here, something happened in the world of real contracts that mooted what seemed to be the accepted wisdom)

Number 2, continue to educate me using Fitz as a hypothetical case -- I'm not arguing for Fitz here, although whenever someone establishes himself at elite level, there's a natural feeling of "wow wow wow Svissgar, let's get dat guys."

And finally, number 3 - can't the signing team say "yeah and we'll pick up some of your cap hurt" when writing the new contract?

Not saying we would or should. Just trying to get the mechanism down.

1. Of course, rules do evolve/change -same as new laws. most changes though only occur like in this past 2 years when a new cba comes into effect. the 2011 c

2. i'll have to bow out on fitz; as i dont know his #s without looking-researching. sorry.

3. while cba art 13 sect 6, (below subpara) seems pretty ironclad.....

(3) In the event that a player who has had a signing bonus allocated over the years of his Player Contract is traded, or whose Contract is assigned to another team pursuant to the NFL's waiver procedure, the Team Salary of the player's new team will not include any portion of the signing bonus.

i could imagine a situation where you could POSSIBLY (legally) get away with it, BUT it would require a 3-way agreement between player & both teams & Go-To-Hell would likely have a cow.

The player would have to "refund" to the old team. other than getting to move on the player doesnt get an advantage (might even get taxed twice) & new team certainly would not like the big cap hit. so pretty unlikely anyone would ever try this.

from further down samecba art 13 sect 6,..)

(iv) Credit for Salary Forfeited or Refunded. In the event that a Club receives a refund from the player of any previously-paid Salary, or the Club fails to pay any previously allocated portion of a signing bonus (including any amount treated as
signing bonus), such amount as has previously been included in Team Salary shall be credited to the Club's Team Salary for the next League Year. ........

 

[FourierSeries]

I keep coming back to this thread hoping that someone is posting some new, interesting information. Color me disappointed.

Let's check with Erika Leigh or Incarcerated Bob.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

i could imagine a situation where you could POSSIBLY (legally) get away with it, BUT it would require a 3-way agreement between player & both teams & Go-To-Hell would likely have a cow.

FWIW, I believe one of the reasons the Patriots didn't trade for Tebow last offseason was that he had a clause in his contract requiring the team trading for him to reimburse Denver, potentially as much as $5 million.

 

[supafly]

Let's check with Erika Leigh

Erika Leigh let me down with that report of Abraham signing...

Just when I thought she may be able to be taken seriously.

 

[RayClay]

FWIW, I believe one of the reasons the Patriots didn't trade for Tebow last offseason was that he had a clause in his contract requiring the team trading for him to reimburse Denver, potentially as much as $5 million.

Was there a list of reasons?

 

[Frezo]

Erika Leigh let me down with that report of Abraham signing...

Just when I thought she may be able to be taken seriously.

It seems that there is some kind of badge of honor among sports tweeters to be first with news. Accuracy means so much more. What's the big difference if we know about something the instant it happens or if we find out 60 minutes later? Even the draft is 40 days away never mind the regular season. Being accurate is so much more important.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

Erika Leigh let me down with that report of Abraham signing...

Just when I thought she may be able to be taken seriously.

Ya. He still may sign here...but that report was way off

 

[Patsgofor4]

Erika Leigh let me down with that report of Abraham signing...

Just when I thought she may be able to be taken seriously.

She is not a fraud on the order of IncBob but she is a fraud nonetheless. I love her last tweet "I'll be off the grid for a few hours while I try to track down some info. I'll be back!" LOL.

 

[Sciz]

She is not a fraud on the order of IncBob but she is a fraud nonetheless. I love her last tweet "I'll be off the grid for a few hours while I try to track down some info. I'll be back!" LOL.

Yeah, everything she has said has been either really vague or based on a visit. She got the Jones signing after knowing he was visiting, but bombed on Abraham and Sanders. Her Talib tweets were super vague. She's been throwing crap at the wall and only Jones has stuck.

 

[Marqui]

Yeah, everything she has said has been either really vague or based on a visit. She got the Jones signing after knowing he was visiting, but bombed on Abraham and Sanders. Her Talib tweets were super vague. She's been throwing crap at the wall and only Jones has stuck.

To be fair, she said Talib was the next name we were going to hear about with the Pats. And he was. I'd say that's a pretty solid hit.

 

[Ring 6]

Was there a list of reasons?

Yes

1) Dont want him.

 

[tonyto3690]

What about a three way trade, involving Mallett and another high pick. Suh is going to cost a barrel of money to sign and it would be a consideration in a trade. It's speculation but next to Wilfork ........ Wow.

I don't care if it's a ten player trade. Teams are not going to give up more value for less value and gift us value.