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Im a little confused, are we talking about the same thing! You said they cleared the money in 2020 so they had a ton of it in 2021. If Brady was on the books going into the 2021 season, they still wouldve had a lot of money to spend, correct? Maybe we should just agree to disagree
No, not unless he blindly accepted playing on a bad team. Plus they owed 13.5 million in cap debt for him before signing him. Add 50 million to 13.5 and you’ve lumped 63.5 million in cap debt onto the books… they were already broke and like 12 starters needed to be re-signed or replaced.
63.5 Mil didnt go on the books in 1 year. You just said they ate that dead money in 2020 anyway...So the remaining 2/50 wouldve been just that in 2021 and 2022, without even adding in additional extensions. Gilmore has no relevance to this conversation. He was traded away, that couldve happened with Brady here as well. His 2021 cap hit was 10.5, I dont see how that hinders them from doing much of what they did in the 2021 offseason. 1 player being on the roster doesnt cost 160 mil gtd in a year
So break it up into two years like the Tampa deal. That’s almost a 32 million dollar cap hit for both 2020 and 2021. That’s a lot.
I gave you the cap numbers, you said theyd reset in 2020...Agree wholeheartedly. His numbers wouldve been high. Offset that with not Franchising Thuney and youre mostly all set. We know what his cap hits in 21 and 22 were/will be, if they did exactly what Tampa gave, it was 10.5 last year and almost 12 this year. They wouldve been better than they were last year and probably this year, that is for certain.
TB wanted to go.
We will have to agree to disagree on that one!
Uh, no, the results indicate he left.
They also indicate they didnt really care to offer him the contract he wanted
Except that team would have sucked royally... I mean they would have been terrible. The same roster in 2020 with Tom instead of Cam and no Thuney, no Devin McCourty.... that's a horrible team no matter how you slice it. And they don't have all that cap space in 2021 if they do this.
The goal is to win rings, not retain Tom and scrape by.
You keep talking about the 2020 roster, I think ive made the point they couldve had a down year in 2020 and have rebuilt on the fly like they did in 2021 and on. They dont have all of the space in 2021 if they had Brady, but they have a lot of it. McCourty was on the books for 11 mil last year, thats more than Brady. I think they couldve pretty easily found the way to use that 100+ mil in money to upgrade the roster, with a HOF qb.
Not sure whos arguing that sir! Just that they couldve retained Brady and still been competitive!
And Tom wasn't okay with that, it's why he left.
Brady reworked his deal in Tampa after 2020 so they could bring everybody back in 2021, it screwed him initially because it added an extra season onto his deal and he tried to leave for Miami. Point being his initial cap hit before reworking his deal was 25 million per season over two years.
Not competitive in 2020, possibly competitive in 2021... but they still would be working a bunch of young players in because they wouldn't have spent as much in free agency. It's more likely they don't win a ring in 2021 than do.
The first two of those players are incompatible with a heavy 2-gap defensive scheme, the coaches also have to step up and tweak the scheme to make it work as well. Or, why did the choose those players in the first place?
Jennings can provide depth behind Judon, possibly play opposite him on passing downs if he emerges as a force. McGrone can run a high 4.4 forty according to his ex-Michigan coach, he and Uche should provide speed back there. Bentley takes over from Hightower as the lone thumper in the middle. A SS will play a lot in big nickel at LB. Assuming the youth step up and play well, they should have a good unit.
This is a different discussion wed would have to have! Maybe in another thread
His initial cap hit didnt matter, they took the year to eat money. If he signed the 2/50 deal here, im sure he wouldve extended and done the same. Its what hes done forever.
Not arguing 20, I think theyre competitive in 2021 for sure, they almost were with a rookie qb and tons of new guys. Sub in a HOF qb and I think the team is much better. Do they win a ring though? Wouldnt bet on it, but theyve done some incredible things I wouldve never bet on during their run as well!
And poor coaching/culture and structure! Talent only gets you so far! A lot of other talented teams in the league, not just TB.
So Belichick's got all the answers for Mac jones as well, right? We should be expecting a Super Bowl title soon. But then again, what happened in 2020 with Cam? Didn't have all the answers to the test that year? Bledsoe in 2000? Kosar and Testaverde? Funny how having all the answers only works with Brady.
You're hopelessly ridiculous. You said the Bucs had basically the same exact team. I point out how WRONG you are by reminding you they were down their #1 and #3 WRs and your reply is being without your #1 and #3 WRs doesn't matter. ************.
Here again you're WRONG. Go ahead tell me this doesn't matter either:
I don't recall a season when Edelman, Brown and Pattern were their 1-3 WRs. I mean what's your point here anyway?... because he won with lesser WRs he then should have been able to suddenly get by with Grayson and Perriman over Godwin and AB?
The 2015 Broncos had Peyton Manning, one of the greatest QBs of all-time, and he actually was a detriment to the team winning.
Again, you're meandering, so try to stay on track... we're talking about the 2002 Bucs... more than half of those players didn't make the pro bowl. Their offense ranked 18th in scoring and 24th in yards whereas their defense was 1st in both. In 3 postseason games their defense forced 13 turnovers... they completely dominated that season start to finish. The rest of their team was mediocre at best.
We can talk fantasy football if you'd like but otherwise I think we've established here that we're talking actual football.
That Super Bowl result is an anomaly because you had the unprecedented occurrence of a head coach inexplicably benching a vitally important player which had an obvious detrimental impact on the outcome of the game.
There's only one GOAT... that's how it works. If I had an example of another quarterback dominating postseason game-winning drives then I would give it to you. There isn't one.
He obviously knew the grass was greener elsewhere, and it was. I don't fault him.
If Tom was on last year's team I think the defense still falls apart after the bye week. Either way it wouldn't be the same exact team, signing Tom would have a ripple effect on their overall spending. Something like 4% of their entire cap was dedicated to the QB position in 2021 with Cam's dead cap, Mac, Stidham and Hoyer... that number would be substantially higher with Tom. Some free agents we have now wouldn't be there assuming Tom re-signed. It's not a one for one situation.
Jameis Winston leading the league in turnovers, throwing the 6th most INT's in NFL history and fumbling the ball is largely what doomed Tampa. Tom was exactly what they needed.
Maybe be true at some point in his thinking, but I think there were other major factors involved as well. Again, im happy to discuss in another thread! I already feel partly responsible for derailing this one!
Agree there, not 1 for 1...But they still have a lot of money to upgrade the roster. Do they have to be more conservative about their choices? Sure, but thats what the FO/Bill gets paid to do. They can choose just Henry instead of Henry and Smith. And that saves a lot of money, can they live without Godcheaux? I think so, etc etc.
I dont dispute parts of that, but their coaching/culture and structure was bad. They havent made the playoffs in 15 years, thats a hard feat to achieve. Jameis was fine in NO, under good coaching. I know you care about coaching based on our discussions, so its not something to overlook
