Report: Mac was reaching out to other coaches about his frustrations with the offense

[Tunescribe]

I would like you to show me one single post where I advocate for Zappe over Mac.

The post said nothing about Zappe.

I have somehow been labeled a "Mac hater" even though I have posted multiple times I would rather them just stick with Mac since we invested a first round pick. Apparently that is hating.

If you genuinely would like to see Mac succeed, then you are not a hater and hereby are absolved.

 

[203Pat]

If you genuinely would like to see Mac succeed, then you are not a hater and hereby are absolved.

 

[venecol]

I would like you to show me one single post where I advocate for Zappe over Mac.

It's a hit list by the leader of the cabal of Patsfan uber homers to paint us as Mac haters. They're regrouping now that their insider is no longer here. It's telling that @Ross12 is on the list. I'm sure they're feverishly working on finding a mod replacement to do their bidding. Its all quite amusing.

 

[RobertWeathers]

There is a part of me who is somewhat OK with Mac going outside the circle of trust for help as it surfaces a serious problem.

Clearly it's not cool to go behind Fat Matt and BB's back for help/guidance without going to them first. That's bad acting.

With that said, the fact that he did do that tells me one of two things if not both.

1. He did go to them first and multiple times and was not getting the support he felt he needed
2. He didn't go to them which tells me he doesn't have the relationship with them he needs/wants

It's like parenting. Don't just be assembly-line with disciplining the behavior but also try to understand what led to it.

What good does it do to chew Mac a new one without examining the root-cause? Certainly why he did it warrants an explanation as to why that isn't appropriate but it's an opportunity for BB/Fat Matt to take that feedback, be introspective and strive to improve as communicators. That's how long-lasting, trusting relationships are formed and they all aren't smooth roads. They can be very bumpy ones.

 

[203Pat]

There is a part of me who is somewhat OK with Mac going outside the circle of trust for help as it surfaces a serious problem.

Clearly it's not cool to go behind Fat Matt and BB's back for help/guidance without going to them first. That's bad acting.

With that said, the fact that he did do that tells me one of two things if not both.

1. He did go to them first and multiple times and was not getting the support he felt he needed
2. He didn't go to them which tells me he doesn't have the relationship with them he needs/wants

It's like parenting. Don't just be assembly-line with disciplining the behavior but also try to understand what led to it.

What good does it do to chew Mac a new one without examining the root-cause? Certainly why he did it warrants an explanation as to why that isn't appropriate but it's an opportunity for BB/Fat Matt to that that feedback, be introspective and strive to improve as communicators. That's how long-lasting, trusting relationships are formed and they all aren't smooth roads. They can be very bumpy ones.

I understand why Bill and the coaching staff would be pissed but I would like to know (obviously never will) was it more organic or did Mac call a former coach for the specific reason to get help/***** about the offense. If Josh called him after the Raiders game to tell him to hang in there or they randomly talked during the season the way Bill and Jimmy allegedly did a couple seasons ago and the topic came up that is one thing. It is another thing if he called Josh just to ***** and complain about Patricia that is another story.

 

[venecol]

Again, maybe it's Josh and maybe Mick Lombardi? But I don't think he randomly reached out to people called other teams' coaches outside of that former coaching circle.

Yea, I don't know. They never mention Josh or anyone in particular. This was a deliberate leak to undermine Mac.

“Mac Jones wasn’t happy,” Simms said, during an appearance on Pro Football Talk. “He was telling people he wasn’t happy. He was calling people about, ‘Hey, can you help us with ideas and do stuff like that?’ From my understanding, Belichick found out all these things. He found out Mac was talking to people and all of this. And there was some back channel conversations going on behind Belichick’s back, and I think that’s where it did get personnel.”

 

[RobertWeathers]

I understand why Bill and the coaching staff would be pissed but I would like to know (obviously never will) was it more organic or did Mac call a former coach for the specific reason to get help/***** about the offense. If Josh called him after the Raiders game to tell him to hang in there or they randomly talked during the season the way Bill and Jimmy allegedly did a couple seasons ago and the topic came up that is one thing. It is another thing if he called Josh just to ***** and complain about Patricia that is another story.

Agree. The context it important.

 

[venecol]

I understand why Bill and the coaching staff would be pissed but I would like to know (obviously never will) was it more organic or did Mac call a former coach for the specific reason to get help/***** about the offense. If Josh called him after the Raiders game to tell him to hang in there or they randomly talked during the season the way Bill and Jimmy allegedly did a couple seasons ago and the topic came up that is one thing. It is another thing if he called Josh just to ***** and complain about Patricia that is another story.

This keeps coming up but there is no indication that he called Josh. They never mention Josh. It seems likely that Josh would be someone he reached out to given his former relationship, but its not a given. He could've called any of his 3 former college OCs for all we know, incl. BoB.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

a few days ago Mac got the old "He's going to be able to play quarterback in this league" or something endorsement from BB. Admittedly, this quote-following is like old-school kremlinology... you don't know what you're "reading" and what you're reading into it. But reading that one really struck me as him being on the warning track (or knowledge that the kid wants out.)

 

[Ross12]

a few days ago Mac got the old "He's going to be able to play quarterback in this league" or something endorsement from BB. Admittedly, this quote-following is like old-school kremlinology... you don't know what you're "reading" and what you're reading into it. But reading that one really struck me as him being on the warning track (or knowledge that the kid wants out.)

Yeah, Bill was speaking about Mac in the way that he'd speak about a player who isn't on the team anymore. Very odd when you compare it to the offseason where he spoke about Mac's "huge improvement" and being way ahead of where he was the prior year. As you said, it could really just be us reading into it too much but in my opinion, Bill usually says things a certain way on purpose. He also paused about 20 times while he thought about the best way to work through that response, so it's not like he just said something off-the-cuff - he said what he meant to say.

 

[Tunescribe]

I really just don't understand your viewpoint. Entertaining trade scenarios isn't "hating", talking about Zappe isn't "hating." Certainly, there is some conduct on this board that I would classify as "hating" on Mac Jones which probably grates me as much as it grates you but I can certainly say it hasn't come from me. I think there's a pathway for Mac Jones to turn it around and be the successful QB of the NEP long term. I also think there's a chance he's just not as good as we hoped, which sucks, but it is what it is. You don't need to cast this wide net targeting every person you can think of that's criticized the QB and blast them, I don't know what you're looking to gain by doing that.

Multiple posters here don't want Mac Jones to succeed as the Patriots' starting quarterback, which is the damndest thing I've seen in nearly 20 years on this site. It goes way, way beyond due criticism toward a weird form of tribalism that arguably has no place here. That is the point of my "blast." Your takes might not be as blatant in that respect but have nonetheless been telltale re. your stated preference for Zappe, questioning how Bob Kraft might address the alleged "quarterback issue," etc. IMO this demonstrates a questionable grasp of things. But fine, since you see "a pathway for Mac Jones to turn it around" -- which I'll assume means competent coaching -- that suggests you at least are open to seeing him swim vs. sink. Hopefully this evolves toward genuine support as long as he wears a Pats uniform.

As for the calendar dates, I think you're missing my point. I'm not saying it's a 2022 calendar, I'm saying that the calendar includes the last 4 months of 2022 within it. Generally publishers do this when they are releasing the calendar in the fall so that people can grab it and use it for the last few months of one year and then throughout the following year. If this calendar was just now released recently and is thus indicative of the player staying on the roster, why would they include 4 months that have already happened and serve no purpose?

Yes, I know. They include fall months so people will buy it early and your point is the calendar was planned/made available before Mac's status with the team supposedly became "called into question."

 

[captain stone]

Lmao, this dude doesn't give up.

I've already had my hopes raised once when a friend texted me his tweet earlier this week about Phatt Matt being Phired... I don't want to be disappointed twice in a row.

 

[Ross12]

Multiple posters here don't want Mac Jones to succeed as the Patriots' starting quarterback, which is the damndest thing I've seen in nearly 20 years on this site. It goes way, way beyond due criticism toward a weird form of tribalism that arguably has no place here. That is the point of my "blast." Your takes might not be as blatant in that respect but have nonetheless been telltale re. your stated preference for Zappe, questioning how Bob Kraft might address the alleged "quarterback issue," etc. IMO this demonstrates a questionable grasp of things. But fine, since you see "a pathway for Mac Jones to turn it around" -- which I'll assume means competent coaching -- that suggests you at least are open to seeing him swim vs. sink. Hopefully that evolves toward genuine support as long as he wears a Pats uniform.

I think you misunderstand my point of view but it is what it is, no point going round and round on it. Glad to consider it settled.

Yes, I know. They include fall months so people will buy it early and your point is the calendar was planned/made available before Mac's status with the team supposedly became "called into question."

Right. So the calendar's existence can't be used as some kind of evidence of Mac Jones staying with the team in 2023 if it was published and put out for sale in September of 2022.

 

[captain stone]

There's a good reason why a guy with the stats that he had in college fell to the 4th round. Tbh I think the Pats could have signed him as a UDFA.

Sure he's probably more likeable than Mac. So was Cam Newton and I don't want that guy starting here either.

Scam wasn't likable, at all.

 

[Boomer B]

Belichick did.

Yup, and 2 years later if a team is looking to get rid of a 1st round QB it means it hasn’t worked out.

 

[captain stone]

Why is it that people cannot see that Zappe does not have an NFL arm?

Like Corky has one? As if...

 

[Vindicate]

There is a part of me who is somewhat OK with Mac going outside the circle of trust for help as it surfaces a serious problem.

Clearly it's not cool to go behind Fat Matt and BB's back for help/guidance without going to them first. That's bad acting.

With that said, the fact that he did do that tells me one of two things if not both.

1. He did go to them first and multiple times and was not getting the support he felt he needed
2. He didn't go to them which tells me he doesn't have the relationship with them he needs/wants

It's like parenting. Don't just be assembly-line with disciplining the behavior but also try to understand what led to it.

What good does it do to chew Mac a new one without examining the root-cause? Certainly why he did it warrants an explanation as to why that isn't appropriate but it's an opportunity for BB/Fat Matt to that that feedback, be introspective and strive to improve as communicators. That's how long-lasting, trusting relationships are formed and they all aren't smooth roads. They can be very bumpy ones.

Bingo. If I'm a leader and I've felt slighted by someone going around/above/outside of me to vent, complain, etc. - I always urge myself to ask "Well. There's something here that I'm not seeing or understanding. And while it's okay to feel slighted, what's more important is to calmly figure out _why_ this happened."

Often times the only way to figure that out is to sit down with someone, disarmed and listening.

IMO, you never get anywhere when treating a symptom with aggressiveness (talking philosophically here, when I say aggressive I mean with a binary, 'NO THAT'S BAD, LET ME MAKE AN EXAMPLE OUT OF THIS'). Because the further the symptom is removed from the issue, the more blowback an aggressive approach has.

 

[sb1]

It's better than Corky's, so...

Zappe's arm isn't better than Mac's. If Zappe had a good arm he would have been picked a lot higher in the draft than he was.

 

[sb1]

Scam wasn't likable, at all.

Not on the field because he stunk for us but I found him likeable off the field.

 

[Ian]

It's better than Corky's, so...

It's not. Did a comparison on that:

Mac:


Zappe:


Mac has the stronger arm, at least at this point in time.

Although, again, as I said previously, it's not a 100% fair comparison. Mac had an entire offseason to get stronger, which Zappe didn't have being a rookie. He'll have that now, so we'll see if things change when we see him again in training camp.