PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

Post Game Thread- Pats beat the Bears


Status
Not open for further replies.
Wut? Super Bowl 52 was won by the first team able to make a play defensively.

Make the case for defenses still winning games by using one of the highest scoring games in SB history where no team could stop each other for 99% of it as an example. Genius. Pure genius.

What is more genius is ignoring that the Brady fumble was not even the first defensive play in the game at all making your entire thesis just wrong.
 
Wut? Super Bowl 52 was won by the first team able to make a play defensively. Super Bowl 51 was won in large part because the Patriots were able to essentially shut down the Atlanta offense in the second half. The Donks won Super Bowl 50 on the strength of one of the better defenses in the last decade. The Patriots won the Super Bowl on a defensive play to save the game. The Seahawks won on another defense that was maybe the best in the last decade. That statement holds no water whatsoever. Yes, the rules changed. Yes, the rules favor the offensive side of the ball. No, that does not mean that the defense has to suck. We’ve seen good Belichick defenses since the rules changes. We’ve seen them from 2013-2016. This ain’t one of them.

Of course the D has to make plays to help the team win. I’m not saying it doesn’t. However, the league has changed in the last few years. Even the 2016 Pats gave up a ton of yards. Last year’s Eagles sucked defensively. Who are your contenders and out of those teams who could you honestly say has a great defense? To me it’s the Rams and only the Rams. I just disagree with this notion that the D has to be a shut down type if we are going to win.
 
They were good in the Miami game and good in the first half against KC.

See this sentence alone is already showing your weird worldview. They were not good but sensational against KC in the first half. They held a historically dynamic offense to 9 points while being allegedly so depleted of talent and slow. This is where we won the game.

The offense scoring 40+ ? That was closer to what was to be expected out of a stacked unit against a team that was missing their top 4 safeties and top pass rusher.

Turn the tables around and if we have 2 first ballot HoF on defense plus additional excellent pieces I will expect more from the defense than from the offense.
 
The fumble last week and the Develin INT this week alone are just bad decisions that you can't see through your homer glasses. You think I am biased ? Lets ask the beat guys..





Do I need to dig up the reactions to last week 10 seconds brainfart before the fumble ?


Yeah, let’s ask Bird Boy and the guy that choked himself in the locker room after games with Garoppolo’s underwear what they think. Meanwhile, in the real world, that ball hit Devlin in the hands. His job to corral it after that. He didn’t and it popped up and ended in an INT. To criticize that is, again, a reach. But you’ve always reached your conclusions through confirmation bias about Brady, especially after this offseason when you took some terrible and laughable stances against the guy. Keep reaching, though. It’s funny.

But then again we all know that you are an absolute Brady homer and he can do no wrong in your worldview. FACT is he made bad decisions and let teams back into games where we were multiple scores ahead and this needs to stop.

Ooooh. A personal dig. You’re mad? But this statement falls flat on its face again since I’ve been critical of multiple Brady throws in multiple games this year. Back in the real world, however, you had to go back to 2014 to find the last time you were critical of BB. Who sniffs who’s jock around here again?

They also won't see that amount of snaps if the ST and offense stops turning the ball over within 10 seconds of in-game play time. You know... "context" the thing you were asking for in other posts yourself.

The offense put up 43 points last week and almost lost the game because of the defense. The offense put up 24 this week (on the road, against one of the better defenses in the NFL, without the GOAT TE) and the ST added two scores and the team was within 1 yard of going to OT. That’s on the defense. Shall I go any further? Shall I bring up the stats on 3rd and 4th down? Total yardage? Wanna hear about the points again? Just stop. Go back to your re-watch thread where you merely post Tweets from other guys breaking down film and respond with some variation of either “yeah... that sounds about right” or “maybe someone can help me out here...” You’re badly biased and, as usual, you’re getting hammered for it.
 
Make the case for defenses still winning games by using one of the highest scoring games in SB history where no team could stop each other for 99% of it as an example. Genius. Pure genius.

What is more genius is ignoring that the Brady fumble was not even the first defensive play in the game at all making your entire thesis just wrong.
Yes or no - did Philly win the game on a strip sack? By the way, why not dispute the other examples? 2014 Pats, 2016 Pats, 2015 Broncos, 2013 Seahawks. Thoughts on them?
 
See this sentence alone is already showing your weird worldview. They were not good but sensational against KC in the first half. They held a historically dynamic offense to 9 points while being allegedly so depleted of talent and slow. This is where we won the game.

The offense scoring 40+ ? That was closer to what was to be expected out of a stacked unit against a team that was missing their top 4 safeties and top pass rusher.

Turn the tables around and if we have 2 first ballot HoF on defense plus additional excellent pieces I will expect more from the defense than from the offense.
Wait, I thought the first and second half defense “were both the same units?” What happened to that stance? They were very good in the first half against KC. They completely **** the bed in the second half and nearly gave the game away. 31 points allowed in a half is an absolute joke no matter what caliber of offense you play. If the results were reversed, and the Pats scored 31 second half points against any team, we’d rightly be laughing at their defense.
 
Of course the D has to make plays to help the team win. I’m not saying it doesn’t. However, the league has changed in the last few years. Even the 2016 Pats gave up a ton of yards. Last year’s Eagles sucked defensively. Who are your contenders and out of those teams who could you honestly say has a great defense? To me it’s the Rams and only the Rams. I just disagree with this notion that the D has to be a shut down type if we are going to win.
I’m not asking the Pats to be a shut down defense. They don’t have the personnel to be able to do that in 2018. I’m just asking them not to suck and give up 30+ points. Start there.
 
Yeah, let’s ask Bird Boy and the guy that choked himself in the locker room after games with Garoppolo’s underwear what they think. Meanwhile, in the real world, that ball hit Devlin in the hands. His job to corral it after that. He didn’t and it popped up and ended in an INT. To criticize that is, again, a reach. But you’ve always reached your conclusions through confirmation bias about Brady, especially after this offseason when you took some terrible and laughable stances against the guy. Keep reaching, though. It’s funny.

None of this is a reach. Brady threw a ball with no pop behind it at all to his FB in the flat while being under pressure. This is a bad decision and should have been picked even before Develin touched the ball.

Jesus the excuses.. look you can't have it both ways. You can't call him the greatest QB of all time but then not expect people to scrutinize bad situational decisions. And this was another one of those the second week in a row that resulted in a tighter game than necessary.

Also maybe stop calling people like Lazar who clearly know more about the game than you ever did names. If you want to disagree with him then at least stay on message and not make fun of how he looks. This is just a bad look.

The offense put up 43 points last week and almost lost the game because of the defense.

The offense got one short field handed to them and left the defense with another short field. Thats about 14 points that you are wrongly assigning between the units. The reality is that before the Hightower play the offense did jackshit turning the ball over on downs and then kicking a FG.
 
31 points allowed in a half is an absolute joke no matter what caliber of offense you play.

And if the ST didn't allow the return to the redzone and Brady didn't cough up the ball like he did in scoring range it would have been fewer than 31 points. That is a 14 point swing right there. But again who cares about context when it is not conveniently fitting your own narrative.
 
I’m not asking the Pats to be a shut down defense. They don’t have the personnel to be able to do that in 2018. I’m just asking them not to suck and give up 30+ points. Start there.

Which they would have accomplished easily if the other two units didn't **** their pants consistently in the last two games.

If our defense is really so bad how about we start by making it harder on the opponents and not give them consistently short fields or make them play 5 defensive series' in a row.

And then lets see where we stand defensively. How about that ? It the offense really is that excellent and lethal how about not turning the ball over for once this season. Is that too much to ask ?
 
I’m not asking the Pats to be a shut down defense. They don’t have the personnel to be able to do that in 2018. I’m just asking them not to suck and give up 30+ points. Start there.

And they’ll improve. The D was given poor field position all day against the Bears. Against KC, even the best D in the league in the Rams would have given up 30+ points. I am more concerned with the turnovers at this point than the D. A team like the 2003-2004 Colts would thrive in this league.
 


A great example of why we should all love BB.

He was asked about that in his radio interview and he gave a perfect "Well, I'm not getting into that, we just put the players out there we think are best in the situation" answer.

You KNOW that this was something that they had up their sleeve (and it was brilliantly executed). If it had been most coaches they would have been running a victory lap -- Parcells would have been boasting about it to Will McDonough, and so on.

BB is ALL about winning and loose lips sink ships. No explanations, no justifications, no complaints.
 
None of this is a reach. Brady threw a ball with no pop behind it at all to his FB in the flat while being under pressure. This is a bad decision and should have been picked even before Develin touched the ball.

Sure, it's a reach. He threw a catchable ball that Devlin had hit him in the hands and was in the process of hauling in before it popped out.



Devlin needs to secure that ball and haul it in. He does his job there and it's likely the Patriots get a new set of downs where they can continue to milk the clock. Instead, what happened is the same thing that has happened in spades this season - the receiver loses the ball, it pops up, and gets intercepted. But to act like that wasn't a good decision nor was it a catchable ball reeks of bias. It's the same bias you've had against the guy all offseason.

Jesus the excuses.. look you can't have it both ways. You can't call him the greatest QB of all time but then not expect people to scrutinize bad situational decisions. And this was another one of those the second week in a row that resulted in a tighter game than necessary.

And I'm fine with people harping on him when it's needed. Throwing the ball into double coverage multiple times to Gronk and once to Hogan in Week 1 is a justified harping. But you're reaching badly here and should thus be called on it. If you want to talk about excuses, look no further than your posts defending the defense (which you've already admitted is a problem in your first post to me in this thread):

  • 31 points allowed to the Bears. "It's the offense's fault!"
  • 40 points allowed to the Chiefs. "It's the offense's and ST fault!"
Genius. Pure genius. If that's the sort of hard-hitting analysis that you're going to offer on here, maybe you should become sort of a reverse troll account where you just agree with everything BB does and think everything is great. It'll save people time from having to decide whether or not they want to take your posts seriously.

Also maybe stop calling people like Lazar who clearly know more about the game than you ever did names.

Lazar has had enough hawt taeks and terrible takes to render this statement incorrect. You've referenced one of them in your last two posts to me. Where he's good is providing the All-22 and the breaking down the play with what he THINKS is the call. Where he fails miserably is assigning blame or credit for what went wrong or right.

If you want to disagree with him then at least stay on message and not make fun of how he looks. This is just a bad look.

Why do one or the other when you can do both?

The offense got one short field handed to them and left the defense with another short field. Thats about 14 points that you are wrongly assigning between the units. The reality is that before the Hightower play the offense did jackshit turning the ball over on downs and then kicking a FG.

I'll try to make this as simple as I possibly can for you...

  • The offense's job is to move the ball and score points.
  • The defense's job is to stop the other offense from moving the ball and scoring points.
Short field or not, it's still the defense's job to either A) stop the offense from scoring altogether, B) hold the offense to a FG, or C) turn the offense over. The defense has not consistently done any of those three. Furthermore, as I mentioned, this is a BBDB unit that supposedly benefits from short fields. They still can't get the stops they need and those possessions turn into TDs far more often than not. That's not something we've seen from our defenses in years where they won championships. Those defenses routinely stopped the opposing offense or, at the very least, held them to FGs. Hell, we even saw that from non-championship teams (late 2012, 2013, 2015). But those defenses were good. This one is not.


And if the ST didn't allow the return to the redzone and Brady didn't cough up the ball like he did in scoring range it would have been fewer than 31 points. That is a 14 point swing right there. But again who cares about context when it is not conveniently fitting your own narrative.

And the defense could have made an 8 point difference on each possession. They did not. That's to say nothing about the 31 points they allowed in the second half of the Chiefs game where the team as a whole had to be bailed out by Brady and the offense sealing the game.

Which they would have accomplished easily if the other two units didn't **** their pants consistently in the last two games.

If our defense is really so bad how about we start by making it harder on the opponents and not give them consistently short fields or make them play 5 defensive series' in a row.

And then lets see where we stand defensively. How about that ? It the offense really is that excellent and lethal how about not turning the ball over for once this season. Is that too much to ask ?

Talk to Brady's receivers. They've been at fault for the majority of his INTs in the 2018 season. Meanwhile again, in the real world, the Patriots as a defense are 27th in the league on third down giving up 45% on third down. They can't get off the field. They're even worse on 4th down giving up 71%. They're surrendering 25.6 points per game - helped greatly by the Dolphins only scoring 7. That looks like the lone outlier on the list. In the last two weeks, they've given up 40 (31 in the second half) and 31 points on the road. And, meanwhile, you're sitting here trying to lay blame on an offense that still put up 24 shorthanded in a hostile environment without its biggest weapon. All of this coming after you already admitted that the defense has been a problem. Good work.
 
I’m not asking the Pats to be a shut down defense. They don’t have the personnel to be able to do that in 2018. I’m just asking them not to suck and give up 30+ points. Start there.

You recognize that they don't have the personnel to be a shutdown performance but expect them to cover up Offensive and ST miscues.

The Pats defense was on the field save for a few seconds from 7:34 left in the first quarter until 9:46 left in the second. Why put an average defense in that position?

Chicago's drives during that time frame:

1. Started from their 37. FG
Patriots Fumble on the KR
2. Started from NE's 24. TD
Patriots Fumble after 3 plays
3. Started from NE's 26. TD
Patterson returns a Kick for a TD
4. Started from their 25. Punt

Chicago did not score any points on drives that started on their 25 or less.
 
Sure, it's a reach. He threw a catchable ball that Devlin had hit him in the hands and was in the process of hauling in before it popped out.



Devlin needs to secure that ball and haul it in. He does his job there and it's likely the Patriots get a new set of downs where they can continue to milk the clock. Instead, what happened is the same thing that has happened in spades this season - the receiver loses the ball, it pops up, and gets intercepted. But to act like that wasn't a good decision nor was it a catchable ball reeks of bias. It's the same bias you've had against the guy all offseason.



And I'm fine with people harping on him when it's needed. Throwing the ball into double coverage multiple times to Gronk and once to Hogan in Week 1 is a justified harping. But you're reaching badly here and should thus be called on it. If you want to talk about excuses, look no further than your posts defending the defense (which you've already admitted is a problem in your first post to me in this thread):

  • 31 points allowed to the Bears. "It's the offense's fault!"
  • 40 points allowed to the Chiefs. "It's the offense's and ST fault!"
Genius. Pure genius. If that's the sort of hard-hitting analysis that you're going to offer on here, maybe you should become sort of a reverse troll account where you just agree with everything BB does and think everything is great. It'll save people time from having to decide whether or not they want to take your posts seriously.



Lazar has had enough hawt taeks and terrible takes to render this statement incorrect. You've referenced one of them in your last two posts to me. Where he's good is providing the All-22 and the breaking down the play with what he THINKS is the call. Where he fails miserably is assigning blame or credit for what went wrong or right.



Why do one or the other when you can do both?



I'll try to make this as simple as I possibly can for you...

  • The offense's job is to move the ball and score points.
  • The defense's job is to stop the other offense from moving the ball and scoring points.
Short field or not, it's still the defense's job to either A) stop the offense from scoring altogether, B) hold the offense to a FG, or C) turn the offense over. The defense has not consistently done any of those three. Furthermore, as I mentioned, this is a BBDB unit that supposedly benefits from short fields. They still can't get the stops they need and those possessions turn into TDs far more often than not. That's not something we've seen from our defenses in years where they won championships. Those defenses routinely stopped the opposing offense or, at the very least, held them to FGs. Hell, we even saw that from non-championship teams (late 2012, 2013, 2015). But those defenses were good. This one is not.




And the defense could have made an 8 point difference on each possession. They did not. That's to say nothing about the 31 points they allowed in the second half of the Chiefs game where the team as a whole had to be bailed out by Brady and the offense sealing the game.



Talk to Brady's receivers. They've been at fault for the majority of his INTs in the 2018 season. Meanwhile again, in the real world, the Patriots as a defense are 27th in the league on third down giving up 45% on third down. They can't get off the field. They're even worse on 4th down giving up 71%. They're surrendering 25.6 points per game - helped greatly by the Dolphins only scoring 7. That looks like the lone outlier on the list. In the last two weeks, they've given up 40 (31 in the second half) and 31 points on the road. And, meanwhile, you're sitting here trying to lay blame on an offense that still put up 24 shorthanded in a hostile environment without its biggest weapon. All of this coming after you already admitted that the defense has been a problem. Good work.


I stopped reading this mess a sentence after you still can't see the obvious bad decision by Brady and blame the FB for not catching that throw.

Pointless to read the rest if you can't see even the obvious.
 
A great example of why we should all love BB.

He was asked about that in his radio interview and he gave a perfect "Well, I'm not getting into that, we just put the players out there we think are best in the situation" answer.

You KNOW that this was something that they had up their sleeve (and it was brilliantly executed). If it had been most coaches they would have been running a victory lap -- Parcells would have been boasting about it to Will McDonough, and so on.

BB is ALL about winning and loose lips sink ships. No explanations, no justifications, no complaints.

We should also throw a little gratitude Joe Judge's way.
 
Devlin had hit him in the hands and was in the process of hauling in before it popped out.

It was punched out by Adrian Amos after Develin had secured it and turned upfield.
 
What is more genius is ignoring that the Brady fumble was not even the first defensive play in the game at all making your entire thesis just wrong.
Now now, you should know by now that any bad outcome resulting from Brady doing something wrong needs to be blamed on some other player or other unit. Get with the program! (Too many people in this forum behave just like Goober in his postgame press conferences.)
 
Now now, you should know by now that any bad outcome resulting from Brady doing something wrong needs to be blamed on some other player or other unit. Get with the program! (Too many people in this forum behave just like Goober in his postgame press conferences.)

At times people here seem to be more obsessed with how any game or throw affects Bradys legacy than with the games that are unfolding in front of them.

I cant wait for people to suggest that they rather not make the SB just so his record of 5-3 is not at risk of going to 5-4.
 
Now now, you should know by now that any bad outcome resulting from Brady doing something wrong needs to be blamed on some other player or other unit. Get with the program! (Too many people in this forum behave just like Goober in his postgame press conferences.)

I think I agree with kontra in that Develin should have had that one.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.


New Patriots WR Javon Baker: ‘You ain’t gonna outwork me’
Friday Patriots Notebook 5/3: News and Notes
Thursday Patriots Notebook 5/2: News and Notes
Wednesday Patriots Notebook 5/1: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Jerod Mayo’s Appearance on WEEI On Monday
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/30: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Drake Maye’s Interview on WEEI on Jones & Mego with Arcand
MORSE: Rookie Camp Invitees and Draft Notes
Patriots Get Extension Done with Barmore
Monday Patriots Notebook 4/29: News and Notes
Back
Top