Patriots Pass Rush Should Upgrade With Collins, Buchanan

[mmasterkillah]

Collins has the ability to be one of the better pass coverage linebackers in the entire NFL.

I'd prefer using him as a pass rusher on occasion, but to suggest he'd start at DE would be ridiculous.

 

[LloydBraun]

Chris Jones should help the pass rush as well. If he becomes more of a situational guy on passing downs, he should help there on the inside.

 

[Coach42]

I think C. Jones is destine to be Jarvis Green 2.0, which is a good thing.

 

[JMC00]

I think C. Jones is destine to be Jarvis Green 2.0, which is a good thing.

He's already better than Jarvis Green.

 

[mgteich]

We should especially see fine play from our #4 and #5 LB's as we did in 2013. NOT

Just saying it wouldn't surprise me if Pats got 15 sacks out of their LB corp next season.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Although I recognize OL as a high need (and a safer draft pick at #29) I can't help but feel that given Belichick's offseason free agent moves, he intends to grab a pass rusher early in the draft

In typical Belichick form however, I could see him trading back and turning #29 into an extra pick plus a second rounder used to grab one of his "his guys" as a versitile pass rusher (i.e. a name no one is expecting) in the second round plus a second round OL

Everyone is thinking TE with the first pick but I think it's pass rusher #1 and OL #2

 

[mgteich]

This board sees the need to draft an immediate starter on the OL. I suspect that Belichick feels a bit differently. He may draft an OL in the first two picks; I think later is more likely. IMHO, passing on a TE in the first two round will NOT happen, not in this draft.

Although I recognize OL as a high need (and a safer draft pick at #29) I can't help but feel that given Belichick's offseason free agent moves, he intends to grab a pass rusher early in the draft

In typical Belichick form however, I could see him trading back and turning #29 into an extra pick plus a second rounder used to grab one of his "his guys" as a versitile pass rusher (i.e. a name no one is expecting) in the second round plus a second round OL

Everyone is thinking TE with the first pick but I think it's pass rusher #1 and OL #2

 

[JoeSixPat]

This board sees the need to draft an immediate starter on the OL. I suspect that Belichick feels a bit differently. He may draft an OL in the first two picks; I think later is more likely. IMHO, passing on a TE in the first two round will NOT happen, not in this draft.

I don't disagree - though it may come down to best man on the board

It really wouldn't be all that difficult to turn #29 and a later draft pick into two 2nd rounders, giving Belichick 3 second rounders to utilize for OL, TE and a pass rusher in what most consider to be a very deep draft

Of course you have to have a trading partner, but Belichick certainly has the ammunition he needs to make that happen should he have 3 of his top prospects available

 

[Brady6]

There is exactly zero chance of Collins playing de

Zero chance, really, in 2011 Kyle Arrington lined up at DE so you saying there is zero chance of Jamie Collins lining up there makes zero sense. Belichick is going to try to put his best players on the field at all times, that include Mayo, Hightower, and Collins. If that means mixing Collins and Hightower into sub packages as DE or stand up pass rush LB then that is what he will do. You are drawing your assumption from a season that Mayo missed most of, Collins was a rookie, and the one dimensional Spikes was the only other starting caliber LB. Needless to say I respectfully disagree, I think Belichick put together this secondary so he can get back to more organized cautious, NASCAR packages, etc.

 

[Brady6]

This board sees the need to draft an immediate starter on the OL. I suspect that Belichick feels a bit differently. He may draft an OL in the first two picks; I think later is more likely. IMHO, passing on a TE in the first two round will NOT happen, not in this draft.

Bryan Stork is projected to go in the fourth or fifth round and he could be a day one starter, Joel Bitonio is another potential day one starter who will go in the mid-rounds. We can address the OL either way.

As far as TE goes the Patriots just brought in C.J. Fiedorowicz for a workout, he is the #105 prospect in this draft and is likely to go in the third round so they may pass on TE in the first two rounds. We have the best TE in the NFL the belief that we need to use our first round pick on another one is exaggerated in my opinion.

 

[JoeSixPat]

This board sees the need to draft an immediate starter on the OL. I suspect that Belichick feels a bit differently.

I think it's worth noting that of all our interior linemen, only one, Mankins, was drafted in the first two days.

The guys that Belichick values on the inside of the line can be found later in the draft

 

[mgteich]

So, ONLY three of our starting linemen are first or second rounders. Is that your point?

Yes, Belichick has used later picks for interior linemen in the past. When was the last time Belichick drafted an interior lineman that even made the team?

We need to develop two starting interior linemen. Personally, I don't think that Belichick has a preference for late rounders, anymore than other coaches.

Belichick may indeed see more value at other positions early in the draft.

I have a strange perspective. I think that there are much more serious needs than OL. DE, LB, TE and LB stand out for me.

Don't get me wrong; we need to develop offensive linemen. I just don't think that Belichick is all that unhappy with Wendell and Connolly, with Kline and Cannon as backups.

I think it's worth noting that of all our interior linemen, only one, Mankins, was drafted in the first two days.

The guys that Belichick values on the inside of the line can be found later in the draft

 

[supafly]

I think it's worth noting that of all our interior linemen, only one, Mankins, was drafted in the first two days.

The guys that Belichick values on the inside of the line can be found later in the draft

So, ONLY three of our starting linemen are first or second rounders. Is that your point?

Yes, Belichick has used later picks for interior linemen in the past. When was the last time Belichick drafted an interior lineman that even made the team?

We need to develop two starting interior linemen. Personally, I don't think that Belichick has a preference for late rounders, anymore than other coaches.

Belichick may indeed see more value at other positions early in the draft.

I have a strange perspective. I think that there are much more serious needs than OL. DE, LB, TE and LB stand out for me.

Don't get me wrong; we need to develop offensive linemen. I just don't think that Belichick is all that unhappy with Wendell and Connolly, with Kline and Cannon as backups.

I think his point is that the majority of interior lineman can be found in the middle rounds or later of the draft, and we don't need to waste a top 1-2-3 pick on the position of center/guard. This certainly makes a lot of sense, and obviously Logan Mankins was the exception.

It should also be noted that Belichick may have felt that he had some versatility with Mankins, since he played entire seasons in college at the position of tackle just as well. A guy like that from a program that Belichick was familiar with may have been too good to pass up on, particularly in a year when we were coming off of 3 SB wins in 4 years and didn't have a ton of immediate needs.

For what it's worth, I tend to agree with you that we have bigger priorities at the positions of DL, LB, and S than we do at OL, so it's quite possible that unless someone really jumps out we can get by with a 4th round pick for a C/G.

Having 6-7 fairly capable starting players before the draft and camp cuts is a decent place to be. I'd imagine if they re-sign Svitek, we'll be just fine to bring in a mid round rookie for competition with Wendell, Connelly, Cannon, and maybe even Cave to allow the top 2/5 to rise to the top.

 

[Joker]

So, ONLY three of our starting linemen are first or second rounders. Is that your point?

Yes, Belichick has used later picks for interior linemen in the past. When was the last time Belichick drafted an interior lineman that even made the team?

We need to develop two starting interior linemen. Personally, I don't think that Belichick has a preference for late rounders, anymore than other coaches.

Belichick may indeed see more value at other positions early in the draft.

I have a strange perspective. I think that there are much more serious needs than OL. DE, LB, TE and LB stand out for me.

Don't get me wrong; we need to develop offensive linemen. I just don't think that Belichick is all that unhappy with Wendell and Connolly, with Kline and Cannon as backups.

Guess there's something wrong with me...I don't process ANY of this post...

when was the last time BB drafted an interior O lineman that made the team? Uh, Marcus Cannon, a consensus 2nd rounder was picked as an OG in the 5th...before that, some guy named Mankins seems to ring a bell.

After watching Denver pour through the middle of our offensive line, my EYES tell me there's a serious need to upgrade the center and guard positions. If BB is not unhappy with Wendell at center and Connoly at guard again this season, backed up by a now healthy Cannon, I most certainly will be SHOCKED.

You also posted more serious needs than O line are "DE, LB, TE and LB stand out for me.". I'm a bit confused. You think we need TWO linebackers, a DE over a DT and a TE before even considering an O lineman?

OK...we'll see I guess.

 

[NewFeep]

Although I recognize OL as a high need (and a safer draft pick at #29) I can't help but feel that given Belichick's offseason free agent moves, he intends to grab a pass rusher early in the draft

In typical Belichick form however, I could see him trading back and turning #29 into an extra pick plus a second rounder used to grab one of his "his guys" as a versitile pass rusher (i.e. a name no one is expecting) in the second round plus a second round OL

Everyone is thinking TE with the first pick but I think it's pass rusher #1 and OL #2

I believe BB will trade out of round 1 and do exactly what your theorize JSP.

If this is as deep a draft as all the "experts" are touting if would simply make too much sense..........

 

[JPsPats]

If Dee Ford is sitting there @29 and BB wants a de that's probably the pick. Ford thinks he's better then clowney and the fact that clowneys gunna go top 3-5 and he's going prob late first will give him a chip on his shoulder.

 

[strngplyr]

If Dee Ford is sitting there @29 and BB wants a de that's probably the pick. Ford thinks he's better then clowney and the fact that clowneys gunna go top 3-5 and he's going prob late first will give him a chip on his shoulder.

252lb 6'2 DE in our system? Okay.

When I say "okay", I mean "not happening". Tuitt is 100x more likely as he could play both DE/DT in our system and won't be a liability against the run.

The dude has already gained 50lbs in his college career, how much more do you think a 6'2" frame can take?

 

[manxman2601]

252lb 6'2 DE in our system? Okay.

When I say "okay", I mean "not happening". Tuitt is 100x more likely as he could play both DE/DT in our system and won't be a liability against the run.

The dude has already gained 50lbs in his college career, how much more do you think a 6'2" frame can take?

Rob Ninkovich is 6'2" and only eight pounds heavier.

 

[mgteich]

1) We were talking about the recent past. Also, the suggestion was that we could use late round picks for starting interior linemen. We haven't done this since we drafted Koppen.

2) You can call Cannon a consensus #2 if you like. As Andy keeps on reminding us, if a player was a consensus #2, he would have been drafted in the 2nd round. I did like the Cannon pick. He has performed well as backup at RT, RG and even TE. Some here think that he is clearly our best RG and should be starting. Dante never believed this, and Belichick clearly does not. Also, we continue to need a backup OT. For now, this year, Mankins is the backup LT and Mankins is the backup RT (and RG also).

3) I have been wanted to draft a top interior lineman for years. Belichick has decided not to use picks in the early rounds for an interior lineman. In the end, no lineman after the 3rd has even made the team, except Cannon (who was and is a tackle; in is considered an exception because of his illness).

4) Almost ALL of us understand that the Wendell/Connolly/Cannon at C/RG is only a temporary solution.

ANALYSIS AND CONCLUSION
Is it reasonable to expect a quality starter in the 4th, 5th or 6th round. Many here would answer a resounding "yes". My answer would be "not likely". It is certainly possible. More likely, we would end up with a player no better than Connolly, Wendell and Cannon (surely not as good as Cannon since such a player is 2nd round quality according to you).

If we want a top interior lineman, then we need to use quality draft picks. If not, then we will only have ONE of the best offensive lines in the NFL, with 3 1st rounders and a couple of average or slightly below average interior linemen as the other starter. This is NOT a terrible situation.

OPTIONS AND CONCLUSION
We could use a future starter at RG and at C. We could also use a backup RT, since Cannon is on his contract year. This backup could also be expected to backup at another position, LT or RG.

Guess there's something wrong with me...I don't process ANY of this post...

when was the last time BB drafted an interior O lineman that made the team? Uh, Marcus Cannon, a consensus 2nd rounder was picked as an OG in the 5th...before that, some guy named Mankins seems to ring a bell.

After watching Denver pour through the middle of our offensive line, my EYES tell me there's a serious need to upgrade the center and guard positions. If BB is not unhappy with Wendell at center and Connoly at guard again this season, backed up by a now healthy Cannon, I most certainly will be SHOCKED.

You also posted more serious needs than O line are "DE, LB, TE and LB stand out for me.". I'm a bit confused. You think we need TWO linebackers, a DE over a DT and a TE before even considering an O lineman?

OK...we'll see I guess.

 

[JoeSixPat]

So, ONLY three of our starting linemen are first or second rounders. Is that your point?

Correct. Tackles typically need to be taken in the first two days - interior linemen do not.

That doesn't mean Belichick won't take a tackle early with an eye to the future and rotate him into the middle - but if we're looking for OL depth, Belichick can find quality guys later in the draft.