Pass rush?

[reflexblue]

We "added" Rivers, Hightower, Clayborn. And the draft isn't over.

I'm not sure Rivers will ever pan out, from what i remember he wasn't doing so well catching on before he got hurt. Catching on to his place in the scheme will be harder with all the time hes lost.
I don't have much faith in Hightower making it through an entire season without getting injured.
Clayborn , hes missed two out of his 7 seasons, and up until last year averaged 5 sacks.

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

 

[Todd Bradley]

I wish we could’ve coaxed James Harrison out of retirement.

Sadly, he was our best pass rusher in the Super Bowl.

 

[Joey007]

Carter is a project as a pass rusher. Hubbard most likely not better than Rivers. Unless you wanted the team to throw the entire draft to get Chubb I am not sure what you expected from one of the weakest pass rushing drafts of the last decade.

People bring up Landry but he really was not a scheme fit and because of that not value that early.

This is also the point where we should bring up that the defensive scheme we have been running since the transition to Patricia (and maybe even longer) has devalued pure pass rushers that are hesitant or simply are unable to set the edge (think Chandler Jones).

The number of sacks in the last few seasons have shown that over an entire season we can manufacture pressure schematically when we want to. In fact, I would suggest you to watch some of the key third downs in the SB again and see how close Flowers and Harrison were to a sack/strip. If we only had a DT in the middle who could create space for them by taking on blocks they would have had a pretty good chance to hit home.

If you are a fan of the kind of aggressive defense that consistently attacks and has a lot of splash plays then maybe you should find a second team to follow because I am not sure you will ever see a BB coached team again that will go for that. Unless we tank the season post Brady and end up with very early picks that give us access to blue chippers.

I’ll give you that this is a really really weak draft class for pass rushers. Which is pretty bad luck for us considering that was our biggest need.

I would’ve almost considered shipping everything to get Chubb. But who knows how much that would have cost.

 

[Joey007]

With Trey Flowers, Derek Rivers, Wise, etc., I'm less worried about a pass rush than I am by our linebackers inability to cover anyone. The Eagles with Foles did what they wanted to our back 7.

At least with LB’s, they’re easier to find. Pass rushers are such a high premium.

 

[Brady6]

Agree..pass rushing is a huge concern. Opposing QBs lick their chops when they play us

I’m not sure why it’s a huge concern. We have Flowers and Clayborn who are proven NFL pass rushers. We have Wise coming off a promising rookie season. We have Hightower returning and Rivers should be healthy as well. You can never have enough pass rush but I don’t view it as a huge concern.

 

[Brady6]

My previous post aside I can see them drafting Josh Sweat at #105,

 

[zoostation]

Will we have any semblance of it next year? Because it’s looking like QB’s will be sipping cups of tea in the pocket again next year. No one will be afraid of this pass rush as it stands. Guys like Trey Flowers are nice players, and even decent starters at that. But no one is going to lose sleep over guys like him. O-lines like Philly will only continue to dominate us.

Teams were sipping big mugs of tea in 2016. That's all I heard the entire season and I agree the pass rush was somewhat nonexistant that entire season.....that is until the team needed a big play (thank you Dant'a . Things turned out ok that year. Even when BB has the weapons (Chandler Jones for example) he doesn't set them lose. Would it have been nice to be in a position to draft Chubb? hell yeah. Anyway, there's a few weeks of team building left. I'm not hitting the panic button after day 2 of the draft just because Buffalo won the April SB again.

 

[zipster9]

My previous post aside I can see them drafting Josh Sweat at #105,

If Sweat is still there. Since Patriots has only 4th round and then a 5th pick. Sweat would be gone by 5th round. Unless they trade up.

 

[TheRainMaker]

I’m not sure why it’s a huge concern. We have Flowers and Clayborn who are proven NFL pass rushers. We have Wise coming off a promising rookie season. We have Hightower returning and Rivers should be healthy as well. You can never have enough pass rush but I don’t view it as a huge concern.

While Flowers is solid, he doesn't scare anyone. Clayborn is extremely inconsistent and doesn't scare anybody as well. His numbers last year were highly inflated due to his one good game against a back up LT. He's more of a guy who will give you 3-5 sacks a year. If the Pats would've gotten faster and more talented at LB, I could see Hightower rushing the passer more which he is highly underrated at. Wise Jr. needs to work on more rush moves as it was easy for Tackles to block him once there was tape on him. The jury is out on Rivers but hopefully he can carve a role like Trey Flowers did in his 2nd year.

Their front seven should be a concern in the passing game as opposing teams will keep exploiting it and gash them with RB's in the passing game until the Pats stop it.

 

[Uptown]

If Sweat is still there. Since Patriots has only 4th round and then a 5th pick. Sweat would be gone by 5th round. Unless they trade up.

 

[upstater1]

Brady was actually not well protected in the SB, at least not in the 1st half. He made a lot of throws off his front foot, with defenders pushing our interior line into his body, that were completed because of the horrendous Eagles D.

If you give Brady MORE time, he'll carve people up.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Teams were sipping big mugs of tea in 2016. That's all I heard the entire season and I agree the pass rush was somewhat nonexistant that entire season.....that is until the team needed a big play (thank you Dant'a . Things turned out ok that year. Even when BB has the weapons (Chandler Jones for example) he doesn't set them lose. Would it have been nice to be in a position to draft Chubb? hell yeah. Anyway, there's a few weeks of team building left. I'm not hitting the panic button after day 2 of the draft just because Buffalo won the April SB again.

It's funny because when Jones was a stand up LB at times in NE, I didn't think he was that effective as much as when rushed more as a DE. Because of this, I didn't think he'd do as well in Arizona. But the most frustrating thing about Jones is that how does he lead the league in sacks with a losing team who were always behind in games but he disappeared with a team (NE) that more often than not had a double digit lead?

 

[TheRainMaker]

Brady was actually not well protected in the SB, at least not in the 1st half. He made a lot of throws off his front foot, with defenders pushing our interior line into his body, that were completed because of the horrendous Eagles D.

If you give Brady MORE time, he'll carve people up.

Did you post this in the wrong thread because this really has nothing to do with this thread.

And that's great if Brady has more time but the Pats lost because they couldn't stop the other team.

 

[ashley]

Mike Reiss?Verified account @MikeReiss 2m2 minutes ago
Patriots select Purdue LB Ja'Whaun Bentley with the 143rd overall pick. He is 6-foot-2, 260 pounds. Off-the-ball linebacker who is considered a contact player.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Sorry, that last post was so long. Here's the short version:

I've been watching people here say for damn near to the whole 17 years of the Brady/BB era, "Wahhhhh we need a pass rush we need a pass rush."

They sometimes find the nut sometimes, like the blind squirrel, and the guy above who says "even when BB does have the weapons he doesn't cut them loose."

BINGO.

Of course he doesn't. Look at the results of the last 17 seasons. Nobody's against leading the damn league in sacks/pressures/etc. But we're not going to invest to that extent -- and even when we have the perfect pass-rush "piece," he's got other responsibilities, and those are not just "oh my bad" in the BB scheme. They're "Why the hell were you freelancing when you had responsibility for that gap?"

We do finish most years with good results, by the numbers.

But we are not built to sack the quarterback as the cornerstone of the defense, the easily measureable trait I used in the proxy discussion above.

What is less measureable is the ability to make a QB feel pressure, in combination with freaking tackling guys, stuffing gaps, and the ability to sufficiently cover receiving targets. One more ingredient which is huge for BB defenses: The ability to step it up with points on the line.

Fortunately, these characteristics appear to be what BB seeks. The pass rush is one of a set of tools to which he applies limited resources.

Denying points is the goal of a BB defense. He typically succeeds at it. That success is typically represented deep into the post-season.

So, meh -- on the "OMG I need a pass rusher so bad!!!" point of view.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Put another way: Why would he look at it as building a team, not just collecting talent? I'll make it easy. He's building a team because yeah, he'll use what skills you have, but your towering talent at "getting home" is not getting you a ton of snaps in a vacuum. You'd better have other skills, because he's going to protect against downsides.

And yes, I do dare to say this even though the D got carved up in Super Bowl 52. On the defensive side, the coach and everybody on down relatively speaking crapped the bed. They did the thing the Pats are good at not doing - allowing buckets of points on the board.

If your QB throws a deep interception, though, you don't tell him "okay don't throw anything past 10 yards."

Similarly, if your D philosophy combined with your D execution (combined with personnel on-hand and controversial calls regarding personnel) lose you one SB, you might spaz if you've never been there before.

If you're usually there, you do what you want your QB to do after throwing an interception. You shrug it off and move on to doing it better next time -- on every aspect of defense, including but not limited to the pass rush.

/rant

 

[TBR]

Trade for Carlos Dunlap. 1 year left for half his market value ($7.3m).

 

[Uptown]

We will trade for a vet pass rusher before the season.