OT: Why is the league head over heels to hire Fish's DC Vance Joseph?

[captain stone]

It wasn't merely a job interview that won Joseph the Donkeys gig; he and Kubiak had a previous working relationship during their time in Houston. I'm still surprised however that someone with a background in defense instead of offense was hired. That QB situation isn't going to fix itself.

 

[patfanken]

IOW, there's more to evaluating a HC candidate than just his prior unit's production. There's a ton we can't see.

Mike Lombardi has been preaching this sermon for a while now. He sees the problem with HCing in the league now is that teams hire guys who are ill prepared to be HEAD COACHES. They are good at offense or good at defense and good at scheming one or the other. What they AREN'T, especially at first, are good at having a full TEAM vision of what an how a team should be constructed and maintained. How to build the culture to make it run. AND have the skills to either run a personnel department or work with someone who can.

So trying to measure how good a HC Vance Joseph might be by simply looking at the stats of the defenses he ran just misses the point completely. If that were what makes a HC great, BB would have been fired for putting together that 2011 defense and certainly never hired for the job he did......which in reality was miraculous for getting that bunch into the superbowl. But if you want to call Joseph a bum whose getting an opportunity because he's black because his defense ranked low, you have to use the same criteria.

Above all a HC needs to be a LEADER with a VISION, and the ability to put that vision into action. He DOESN'T need to be a genius X;s and O's guy. He just needs the ability to identify, hire and motivate that guy. He's the guy who needs to keep all the other coaches and players on the same page moving in the same direction. This is NOT just one way to do this successfully. Pete Carroll and BB are polar opposites in a lot of areas, BUT there are certain consistencies where they are in lock step. They both have a vision of how their teams should run, they both have the leadership to put together the team to make it happen, and they both have created the structure and culture that allows them to maintain excellence over time.

As Pats fans we have been witness to the GOAT. Or at least certainly the greatest of all time in the cap era. But that genius didn't happen overnight or even on his first try. I find it sad that so many are so judgemental with so little information. Very typical of today's social climate......and also very sad.

 

[ALP]

if you suck at OC/DC...you ain't gonna be good at HC...thats a given

we all understand being impressive OC/DC doesn't necessarily translate to HC level, but the opposite is not true

 

[Ross12]

You ever have a boss who was a good speaker, and worked hard to motivate those around him/her, but didn't actually know anything in regards to how to perform the jobs of those under him/her?

You can be a good "leader", but at least in my experience, ultimately if you can't do the jobs of the people you're leading, they won't respect you.

 

[Pessimistic Pete]

Bad signing + losing Wade Phillips?

Thrilled with these developments in Denver.

 

[captain stone]

If you're going to be a "players coach" and a "people person," you damn well better have a solid QB
to cover-up for your constant screw-ups.
Tomlin has that in ****tsburg; that's why he still has a job.
Wrecks Ryan didn't have that in both NJ & Beefalo; that's why he doesn't have a job.
And Vance Joseph doesn't have that in Denver; that's why he won't have a job sooner than later.

 

[Gronk]

if you suck at OC/DC...you ain't gonna be good at HC...thats a given

we all understand being impressive OC/DC doesn't necessarily translate to HC level, but the opposite is not true

I dunno...I think there are examples of people who weren't necessarily renowned as coordinators at the professional level that turned out to be good HC's. These are admittedly few. Parcells is one, Jimmy Johnson another. ****, I'd even throw in both Harbaugh brothers as people who have been very successful as NFL HCs and have never held an NFL OC or DC job. OC/DC is the obvious training ground for HC so there's gonna be more bad than good when you look at it in aggregate because most NFL HCs fail. I understand not having held the job isn't the same thing as sucking at it, and more knowledge is always better, but there's definitely some wiggle room there for successful leaders who aren't necessarily high-level coordinators who handle X's and O's on a more micro level than an NFL HC might.

That being said I'd also agree with @Ross12 that, essentially, part of being a good leader is often the confidence of those beneath you that you could (and/or have demonstrated that you can) do everyone else's job. It's actually a studied thing that I read about (which I would link, but come on it's just a fb forum and I'm drinking here) that it impacts employee satisfaction, confidence, and performance in a positive way if they feel like their manager/boss could perform their job abilities in their absence. To this point, I don't think that Josh McDaniels or any other NE OC has ever doubted that BB could either do their job personally or find someone else to do their job at a very high level despite never having actually been an NFL OC himself.

 

[patchick]

If you're going to be a "players coach" and a "people person," you damn well better have a solid QB
to cover-up for your constant screw-ups.
Tomlin has that in ****tsburg; that's why he still has a job.
Wrecks Ryan didn't have that in both NJ & Beefalo; that's why he doesn't have a job.
And Vance Joseph doesn't have that in Denver; that's why he won't have a job sooner than later.

It seems like a pretty big leap from a report that Joseph is a "good people manager" to assuming he's a "players coach" and "people person."

A good people manager chooses the right personnel, motivates them, gives them the tools and opportunity to succeed and gets them working together toward a common purpose. That can mean a hardass as easily as a cheerleader.

 

[Delicate Genius]

New Broncos Coach Vance Joseph Left University Of Colorado After Being Accused Of Rubbing His Erect Penis On A Woman

 

[Clonamery]

New Broncos Coach Vance Joseph Left University Of Colorado After Being Accused Of Rubbing His Erect Penis On A Woman

OK, that explains why Denver hired him...he can speak "Talib."

 

[fightingirish595]

Hiring a head coach is a crap shoot. There's absolutely no way of knowing a guy is going to succeed or not.

 

[NashuaPats]

New Broncos Coach Vance Joseph Left University Of Colorado After Being Accused Of Rubbing His Erect Penis On A Woman

The Mannings would approve and probably recommended him to Elway.