OT: Watson to Brownies

[venecol]

Which speaks to the power of having a good lawyer NOT to whether the allegations are true or not. When a jury finds a defendant "not guilty", it doesn't find them innocent.

True, that's why Kraft spent $10M to dispose of a misdemeanor case where the fine is $500. Kraft was fighting for his reputation. Watson is fighting for his career.

We have been doing a LOT of inferencing here. If Hardin is such a good attorney then why NOT go to court where the legal system puts ALL the weight on the accuser to prove THEIR case which is so difficult in a "he said, she said" situation.

They would if that was the only issue at hand, but they're also facing the NFL inquiry and facing an unknown suspension. This is all being orchestrated around the NFL actions and the upcoming season. I guarantee you that nobody at NFL headquarters gives a damn about these women. They're just trying to protect the image of the league while balancing the interests of one of its members (Haslam).

So given this atmosphere why isn't Hardin racing to have this go straight to court instead of settling most of them out of court if he's such a "bad MFer"?

See above: 230 million reasons to settle.

Personally the mere fact that Watson felt the need to go to 66 different FEMALE massage therapists in a 16month time period takes "allegedly" out of the question.

OK, but not really, legally speaking. I mean we live in a system of laws. Unless you want to go back to the good old days and just lynch him.

Tom Brady's been with the same guy for 20 years. It's not for the massage. You'd think that after around 5 or 10 he'd find a capable person if massage therapy was the issue. It's not for the sex, because if THAT was the need he could have gotten that for free, or else he certainly could hired a professional (who also would have given him a massage as well, btw.) This was a least 66 attempts to impose his will. 66 power trips. Predatory and Narcissistic behavior plain and simple.

Yea, probably.

I don't know if the settling of most but not all these cases will hasten his return to the Browns, but I hope not.

It'll hasten the resolution to the NFL inquiry which is anyone in the NFL really cares about. We don't yet know what that resolution will be: 6, 8, 17 games? Two years? Lifetime ban? Who knows. What do you think it should be?

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

When the NFL suspends Watson, Mayfield better hold the Browns hostage.

Mayfield is playing on his 5th year option. So he is guaranteed $18 million, he is playing, that probably will be the most money he ever gets paid in a single season.

Do I expect him to be a jerk, yes, but he isn't holding out or anything like that, he needs that cash!

 

[Bill Lee]

That ship has sailed.

On that we agree, they are done with Baker and are moving on to the new guy, even if it means playing a scrub at QB this season.

BTW I heard on a podcast yesterday that the new guy got all the snaps in OTAs and mini-camp and Brissett got none.

While that ain't totally unexpected (he's new to the system, Brissett is not) it still shows to me at least they're far more concerned at the new guy hitting the ground running when he eventually gets past suspension than trying to make something out of this season.

Not to mention that the accuser will have the defense investigating her entire past and have it publicly laid open for anyone to see in open court. Even today it is not easy for a woman to go through this, there is a cost that mere money doesn't always make it worth it.

That clearly was Hardin's game plan. Originally some of the accusers were anonymous, he went to court to get their names released because he said his client would not get a fair trial if he did not know who was making the accusations and the judge agreed. That immediately caused one accuser to drop their case, they didn't want to go through the ringer. And of course once the names were released they started getting unwanted attention.

So given this atmosphere why isn't Hardin racing to have this go straight to court instead of settling most of them out of court if he's such a "bad MFer"?

Personally the mere fact that Watson felt the need to go to 66 different FEMALE massage therapists in a 16month time period takes "allegedly" out of the question. Tom Brady's been with the same guy for 20 years. It's not for the massage. You'd think that after around 5 or 10 he'd find a capable person if massage therapy was the issue. It's not for the sex, because if THAT was the need he could have gotten that for free, or else he certainly could hired a professional (who also would have given him a massage as well, btw.) This was a least 66 attempts to impose his will. 66 power trips. Predatory and Narcissistic behavior plain and simple.

I don't know if the settling of most but not all these cases will hasten his return to the Browns, but I hope not.

We know there were appointments made with 66 therapists, and 18 have made statements supporting the player:

18 massage therapists, with names attached, voice support for Deshaun Watson

None of the 21 women who have sued Texans quarterback Deshaun Watson of misconduct during massages have attached their names to the lawsuits.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

 

[XLIX]

Mayfield is playing on his 5th year option. So he is guaranteed $18 million, he is playing, that probably will be the most money he ever gets paid in a single season.

Do I expect him to be a jerk, yes, but he isn't holding out or anything like that, he needs that cash!

Not only that, but he also needs to be thinking of his future dollars. The difference between a good season for him versus a bad one will be tens of millions of dollars on his next deal.

 

[venecol]

 

[Deus Irae]

Last week, we pointed out that a negotiated resolution of Browns quarterback Deshaun Watson‘s discipline was possible, but not likely. The problem was that Watson, as of last week, was determined to clear his name.

With Watson settling 20 of the 24 cases pending against him, that possibly will lay the foundation for a settlement between the league, the union, and Watson.

Josina Anderson of CBS Sports reports that negotiations have indeed occurred. However, talks “fell apart” regarding the extent of the punishment.

Report: Settlement talks between NFL, NFLPA, and Deshaun Watson "fell apart" - ProFootballTalk

 

[patfanken]

True, that's why Kraft spent $10M to dispose of a misdemeanor case where the fine is $500. Kraft was fighting for his reputation. Watson is fighting for his career.

They would if that was the only issue at hand, but they're also facing the NFL inquiry and facing an unknown suspension. This is all being orchestrated around the NFL actions and the upcoming season. I guarantee you that nobody at NFL headquarters gives a damn about these women. They're just trying to protect the image of the league while balancing the interests of one of its members (Haslam).

See above: 230 million reasons to settle.

OK, but not really, legally speaking. I mean we live in a system of laws. Unless you want to go back to the good old days and just lynch him.

Yea, probably.

It'll hasten the resolution to the NFL inquiry which is anyone in the NFL really cares about. We don't yet know what that resolution will be: 6, 8, 17 games? Two years? Lifetime ban? Who knows. What do you think it should be?

1. You know V, I really don't get the comparison of what Kraft did with Watson. Bob Kraft went to an open to the. public massage parlor. He may or may NOT have had a happy ending with willing participant. Watson had 66 cases where he definitely didn't have a consensual encounter at LEAST 24 times, There IS no comparison. Just a lawyer's argument to deflect way the obvious implication from his client. ...and $10MM? where'd you pull that number from?

2. Yeah, it really IS all about what the NFL is going to do. For some reason the player's assoc. looks like they are also going to go to the wall for Watson. My guess is that none of the members have sisters or mothers and they condone Watson's behavior. But as deflategate has proven that Rodger has the final say on any discipline period. Regardless of the evidence or even legality. The appeals court made that clear in its ruling.

3. I can't see the league taking more than 25 of that 230MM contract, so none of us are going to have throw Watson a testimonial dinner anytime soon.

4. "yeah probably" is way too weak of an agreement that Watson is a predatory narcissist. but that's just me.

5. You might be right. I'd like to see the NFL hasten its decision on this. Maybe this settlement will get them off their asses. I don't care if its not fair to the Browns, I care that it's not fair to the Browns' FAN BASE.

 

[patfanken]

On that we agree, they are done with Baker and are moving on to the new guy, even if it means playing a scrub at QB this season.

BTW I heard on a podcast yesterday that the new guy got all the snaps in OTAs and mini-camp and Brissett got none.

While that ain't totally unexpected (he's new to the system, Brissett is not) it still shows to me at least they're far more concerned at the new guy hitting the ground running when he eventually gets past suspension than trying to make something out of this season.


That clearly was Hardin's game plan. Originally some of the accusers were anonymous, he went to court to get their names released because he said his client would not get a fair trial if he did not know who was making the accusations and the judge agreed. That immediately caused one accuser to drop their case, they didn't want to go through the ringer. And of course once the names were released they started getting unwanted attention.


We know there were appointments made with 66 therapists, and 18 have made statements supporting the player:

18 massage therapists, with names attached, voice support for Deshaun Watson

None of the 21 women who have sued Texans quarterback Deshaun Watson of misconduct during massages have attached their names to the lawsuits.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

1. Actually I'm a little surprised the Browns aren't keeping Mayfield. They have a pretty good overall team. Very good OL, great RB's, and very decent receiver group and TE's. The fans might be willing to wait a year for Watson, but for the players they want to win NOW. In a league with very limited time span for players, every team would like to think they can compete for at least the playoffs.

2. Interesting.

3. Accuse the accusers has been the mainstay argument for decades and why so many sexual assault cases never get to courts

4. Don't quite understand where you are going with this. So OK 18 "supported" Watson, that means 48 either filed suit or felt threatened by the system not to file suite, but in no way supported Watson's behavior.. Is it your contention that sexually predatory behavior only matters if it happens OVER 50 times and we should ignore it when it doesn't reach that bar?

 

[Bill Lee]

4. Don't quite understand where you are going with this. So OK 18 "supported" Watson, that means 48 either filed suit or felt threatened by the system not to file suite, but in no way supported Watson's behavior.. Is it your contention that sexually predatory behavior only matters if it happens OVER 50 times and we should ignore it when it doesn't reach that bar?

Not at all. It seems to be yet another quirk in his behavior. Maybe there are some situations where he feels he has to behave, others where he feels he can misbehave. Or maybe it's as simple as him not being turned on in one situation versus another. OTOH others might want to use the fact that 18 support him to paint the others in a bad light, but I don't see it that way, yet still do feel compelled to point out supporters do exist.

 

[venecol]

1. You know V, I really don't get the comparison of what Kraft did with Watson. Bob Kraft went to an open to the. public massage parlor. He may or may NOT have had a happy ending with willing participant. Watson had 66 cases where he definitely didn't have a consensual encounter at LEAST 24 times, There IS no comparison. Just a lawyer's argument to deflect way the obvious implication from his client. ...and $10MM? where'd you pull that number from?

The comparison is as it relates to NFL punishment. Kraft was criminally indicted and charged w/ 1st degree misdemeanoir for solicitation of prostitution. They had actual video of the sex acts and payments on 2 consecutive days (there's no "may or may not have"). He mounted a strong defense w/ at least 3 high priced NY attorneys and a couple of high priced FL attorneys. The case took 18 months. The charges were dismissed during appeal because the videos were tossed out. Yet, the women he was with, pled guilty to prostitution and had to pay thousands in fines and faced jail time. Nvm about the whole human trafficking angle of this sordid spectacle. NFL punishment: Zilch, Nada. Do you think if instead of Kraft, this would've been a player that the NFL would've done nothing?

BTW, I supported Kraft's right to defend himself regardless of guilt and being a FL resident, was glad when he won his case against the State for illegal use of video surveillance.

2. Yeah, it really IS all about what the NFL is going to do. For some reason the player's assoc. looks like they are also going to go to the wall for Watson.

That's their job, to represent the players. For some reason, you're very adverse to these processes. They have the right to bring up how NFL billionaire owner cases were handled by the league since apparently there is no personal conduct policy for every NFL employee. It’s a player conduct policy. They're hypocrites.

But as deflategate has proven that Rodger has the final say on any discipline period. Regardless of the evidence or even legality.

There's a new process in place where the initial hearing is heard by an ex-judge. If she hands out a punishment, it can be appealed by either side and then heard by Goodell. If she says there was no violation, it dies there. That's why NFL & NFLPA are trying to reach agreement to avoid an appeal.

3. I can't see the league taking more than 25 of that 230MM contract, so none of us are going to have throw Watson a testimonial dinner anytime soon.

Unless there's a lifetime ban, which some zealots are calling for.

4. "yeah probably" is way too weak of an agreement that Watson is a predatory narcissist. but that's just me.

Ok

5. You might be right. I'd like to see the NFL hasten its decision on this. Maybe this settlement will get them off their asses. I don't care if its not fair to the Browns, I care that it's not fair to the Browns' FAN BASE.

Right

 

[venecol]

What's the bet for:

8 games
10 games
12 games
14 games
1 season
2 seasons
Life time ban

 

[patfanken]

What's the bet for:

8 games
10 games
12 games
14 games
1 season
2 seasons
Life time ban

one season. I hope

 

[Bourne Again Christian]

one season. I hope

Hoping for a lifetime ban.

 

[Deus Irae]

Report: NFL seeks indefinite suspension of Deshaun Watson, lasting at least one year - ProFootballTalk

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

Should be one season

 

[Pape]

Two years off before he hits the fielding Cleveland... Hope they built an out into his deal

 

[Tunescribe]

one season. I hope

But what will he do with all that idle time? Get a massage?

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Not the worst spots in the world. Baker & Pete would be fun to watch.

 

[venecol]

A full-season suspension would push Deshaun Watson's entire contact back by a year

Much was made of the fact that the Browns gave Deshaun Watson a base salary for 2022 of only $1 million, given that the approach would reduce dramatically the financial consequences of, for example, a six- or eight-game suspension.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

A full-season suspension by rule would toll Watson’s contract for a year. His $1 million salary would move from 2022 to 2023, supplanting the $46 million he’s due to make next year. And he would be under contract to the Browns for five full seasons beyond 2022, not four.

 

[Dingleberry]

What's the bet for:

8 games. (+300)
10 games. (+300)
12 games (+300)
14 games. (+300)
1 season. (+100)
2 seasons. (+200)
Life time ban. (+500)

What's the bet for:

8 games. (+300)
10 games. (+300)
12 games (+300)
14 games. (+300)
1 season. (+100)
2 seasons. (+200)
Life time ban. (+500)
Castration. (+5000)


I am thinking about opening the casino a month early just to take these bets!