OT: Official 2020 Tompa Bay Gronkaneers Thread

[SHOWTIME15]

Best deal for both teams:

Bucs trade first-round pick

Patriots trade Stephon Gilmore and James White

(Bucs would be much better with Gilmore than Barrett and probably cost a similar amount)

Thoughts?

White is a free agent...

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I think they need the pass rusher more than they need the CB.

Here’s my reasoning:

Barrett might not even be that great. He didn’t do much in Denver as a UDFA. His 2019 season is a clear outlier. But the biggest factor is his rise to big sack totals aligns exactly with Suh and Vea dominating up front. Same this postseason...as soon as Vea came back that pass rush dominated. In addition to collapsing the line to absorb extra blockers, TB’s elite run defense lets them pin their ears back.



They already have JPP signed and he isn’t cheap. I think Belichick had a good approach to pass rushers, recognizing they cost too much, pressure is more of a team effort, and there are typically a lot of decent options much cheaper. A guy like Ninkovich can give you 75% of the production for like 25% of the cost of an elite guy. There are going to be free agents in the $5-10M range that can fill the role.

Tampa Bay’s one weakness is they don’t have a stud CB, and they were able to scheme around it but might not be able to next time. If they got a shutdown corner, it would be perfect because they have like three #2 CBs who would benefit from easier assignments. Huge domino effect. And an elite secondary + Suh/Vea would make it so much easier for pass rushers too.

I’m really hoping they don’t spend money on Barrett. Almost every team regrets a big investment in a guy like that. Pass rush specialists are so dependent on the players around them.

 

[NYCPATS4LIFE]

Here’s my reasoning:

Barrett might not even be that great. He didn’t do much in Denver as a UDFA. His 2019 season is a clear outlier. But the biggest factor is his rise to big sack totals aligns exactly with Suh and Vea dominating up front. Same this postseason...as soon as Vea came back that pass rush dominated. In addition to collapsing the line to absorb extra blockers, TB’s elite run defense lets them pin their ears back.



They already have JPP signed and he isn’t cheap. I think Belichick had a good approach to pass rushers, recognizing they cost too much, pressure is more of a team effort, and there are typically a lot of decent options much cheaper. A guy like Ninkovich can give you 75% of the production for like 25% of the cost of an elite guy. There are going to be free agents in the $5-10M range that can fill the role.

Tampa Bay’s one weakness is they don’t have a stud CB, and they were able to scheme around it but might not be able to next time. If they got a shutdown corner, it would be perfect because they have like three #2 CBs who would benefit from easier assignments. Huge domino effect. And an elite secondary + Suh/Vea would make it so much easier for pass rushers too.

I’m really hoping they don’t spend money on Barrett. Almost every team regrets a big investment in a guy like that. Pass rush specialists are so dependent on the players around them.

I don’t believe that at all. Their young corners started playing a lot better when they decided to play more press coverage. I thought in the beginning todd bowles played too much zone. Carlton Davis much more effective as a press corner.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I don’t believe that at all. Their young corners started playing a lot better when they decided to play more press coverage. I thought in the beginning todd bowles played too much zone. Carlton Davis much more effective as a press corner.

Players can do a lot of great things when you can constantly pressure with four pass rushers and sometimes three, and when you have a historically good run defense that makes the offense one dimensional.

They had six defensive backs on almost every down in the Super Bowl.

I’m not disparaging their corners...I’m pointing out that with a stud like Gilmore, they’d feast all year and would be the best defense in the league.

 

[Deus Irae]

Here’s my reasoning:

Barrett might not even be that great. He didn’t do much in Denver as a UDFA. His 2019 season is a clear outlier. But the biggest factor is his rise to big sack totals aligns exactly with Suh and Vea dominating up front. Same this postseason...as soon as Vea came back that pass rush dominated. In addition to collapsing the line to absorb extra blockers, TB’s elite run defense lets them pin their ears back.



They already have JPP signed and he isn’t cheap. I think Belichick had a good approach to pass rushers, recognizing they cost too much, pressure is more of a team effort, and there are typically a lot of decent options much cheaper. A guy like Ninkovich can give you 75% of the production for like 25% of the cost of an elite guy. There are going to be free agents in the $5-10M range that can fill the role.

Tampa Bay’s one weakness is they don’t have a stud CB, and they were able to scheme around it but might not be able to next time. If they got a shutdown corner, it would be perfect because they have like three #2 CBs who would benefit from easier assignments. Huge domino effect. And an elite secondary + Suh/Vea would make it so much easier for pass rushers too.

I’m really hoping they don’t spend money on Barrett. Almost every team regrets a big investment in a guy like that. Pass rush specialists are so dependent on the players around them.

I think we're hitting the same point, just from the opposite side. You're saying "They need a better secondary, so they should get a better secondary player, even at the expense of their front 7". I'm saying "Their secondary is young and improving, so having the pass rushers will cover for some of the deficiencies back there".

And it's not that I don't think your side has merit. It's just that I remember the 2019 NE and 2020 TB defenses, and I see that 2020 TB fared better.

 

[skinnydog]

I think we're hitting the same point, just from the opposite side. You're saying "They need a better secondary, so they should get a better secondary player, even at the expense of their front 7". I'm saying "Their secondary is young and improving, so having the pass rushers will cover for some of the deficiencies back there".

And it's not that I don't think your side has merit. It's just that I remember the 2019 NE and 2020 TB defenses, and I see that 2020 TB fared better.

Yeah, a dominant D-Line makes everyone behind them better

 

[JMC00]

Here’s my reasoning:

Barrett might not even be that great. He didn’t do much in Denver as a UDFA. His 2019 season is a clear outlier. But the biggest factor is his rise to big sack totals aligns exactly with Suh and Vea dominating up front. Same this postseason...as soon as Vea came back that pass rush dominated. In addition to collapsing the line to absorb extra blockers, TB’s elite run defense lets them pin their ears back.



They already have JPP signed and he isn’t cheap. I think Belichick had a good approach to pass rushers, recognizing they cost too much, pressure is more of a team effort, and there are typically a lot of decent options much cheaper. A guy like Ninkovich can give you 75% of the production for like 25% of the cost of an elite guy. There are going to be free agents in the $5-10M range that can fill the role.

Tampa Bay’s one weakness is they don’t have a stud CB, and they were able to scheme around it but might not be able to next time. If they got a shutdown corner, it would be perfect because they have like three #2 CBs who would benefit from easier assignments. Huge domino effect. And an elite secondary + Suh/Vea would make it so much easier for pass rushers too.

I’m really hoping they don’t spend money on Barrett. Almost every team regrets a big investment in a guy like that. Pass rush specialists are so dependent on the players around them.

Trade a 2nd & 4th for Gilmore, Draft Patrick Jones III at #32

 

[venecol]

Not everyone has to do things BB’s way. Leading up to the game, BA talked openly about the gameplan against the Chiefs and yet still pants’d them. The team is thought to be run loosely and without discipline, and yet in the postseason they played incredibly smart and disciplined. They went to Green Bay and said they didn’t even practice in the cold or try to simulate conditions and they played great.

I think people give BB too much credit for little things like being tight lipped, not giving bulletin board material, injury stonewalling, etc. They don’t make a difference on the scoreboard.

As long as you keep your team focused and playing well, you’re doing your job.

BB’s way worked for him. It isn’t the only way that works. And Tampa Bay should be absolutely all-in right now knowing they have a year or two window.

BA's team did two things never done before: 1st team to score 30+ points in each of 4 postseason games. Which is hard to believe its never been done before. Also, 1st team to beat 3 MVP QBs in a postseason. All this while being oldest coach (68) to win SB.

BA talked about giving his players days off to keep them fresh. He spoke of both Brady & Gronk not being used to this but then coming around. It worked. So yea, different styles with successful results while breaking some impressive records. He managed to get team to peak at the SB, the most complete game they had all season against the best team.

 

[Kontradiction]

As someone that’s owned a boat for almost two years, I can testify that those boat days will sneak up on you and destroy you. Something about being out on the water in the Sun gets you blackout drunk. Anyway, I’m putting the above picture on a T-Shirt.

 

[Kontradiction]

BA's team did two things never done before: 1st team to score 30+ points in each of 4 postseason games. Which is hard to believe its never been done before. Also, 1st team to beat 3 MVP QBs in a postseason. All this while being oldest coach (68) to win SB.

BA talked about giving his players days off to keep them fresh. He spoke of both Brady & Gronk not being used to this but then coming around. It worked. So yea, different styles with successful results while breaking some impressive records. He managed to get team to peak at the SB, the most complete game they had all season against the best team.

Yeah, I’m not sure why everyone here wants every coach to be like BB - shouting “NO DAYS OFF” at the podium like an absolute f.ucking psychopath. Everyone has different styles. Arians just won his first Lombardi as a HC. Let him enjoy it. And I’d say the same thing about Bill if the situations were reversed.

 

[RicoG]

Agree. I love the Parcells/BB/Coughlin way because it's proven to be sustainable and enduring but its not the ONLY way.

The BA approach worked with THIS team and THESE players THIS year.

Did it work in AZ? Kinda. Did it work last year? Meh. Did it work this year? Damn straight it did.

It worked because of Brady who also brought his version of the Patriot way with him. In addition, he brought along his 3 amigos in Gronk, Brown, and Fournette. Each a veteran and a star in their own right whom ended up being instrumental offensively in the win.

Arians and the othe coaches did a great job because instead of a my way or the highway attitude, they allowed these guys to enfluence how the team was run and how the team played.

 

[venecol]

eh, Brady carried the Bucs this year. and Brady was the one coaching the bucs up with teaching points which he undoubtedly learned from BB. Bruce was there for the ride. Obviously Bruce's way on offense didn't work with the Bucs until they gave the keys to Brady.

WAT???? God damn, you sure as hell changed your tune. You spent 500 pages poo pooing every Brady success with excuse after excuse.

You not only bent the knee and kissed his ring, you're all in on the lube job too. Glad to see you came around. You seem happier.

 

[RicoG]

Unless they go more man, I say no because of Bowles scheme. If Fournette returns, White is not needed. In fact, White will have a very small market as he's a gimmick back.

Fournette was taken 4th overall I believe. So obviously he has a very high ceiling. It never materialized until the playoffs. Brady brought the best in him. He really looked like the best of Blount and White. They should try and keep him if they can. But I can see him leaving if another team makes a rediculous offer.

 

[RicoG]

Your post encapsulates everything that has been said over the last 72 hours without blame or indictment. I applaud you.

It happened. It sucks...but it is what it is.

It was nice seeing the whole NE fanbase rally around Brady, Gronk, and the Bucs like they were their own.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I feel so fortunate to get a Bonus Round of Brady’s career. Now that he just did that this season, there is literally zero pressure or stress in rooting for him. It’s over. Legacy secure forever. Could go 19-1 and choke; could throw 4 interceptions in the Super Bowl; could lose the next three Super Bowls; could lose to Rodgers, Wilson, and Mahomes. It doesn’t matter anymore. This run changed everything about all that stuff.

And if Brady doesn’t win, what do I really care? No more banners for the Patriots anyway. It’s a fun place to be in to have zero downside and just enjoying the ride.

So - should be a delicious read here. Loving that Arians is basically an annoying troll. It’s beautiful. He’s the absolute perfect coach for those of us who just want to see Brady burn down the other 30. Hope the Bucs continue to run their mouths and become the league’s new most hated team.

Chiefs Arians:Anybody that says, Run It Back bullst. Thats Kansas Citys bullst. - ChiefsPlanet

Chiefs Arians:Anybody that says, Run It Back bullst. Thats Kansas Citys bullst. Nzoner's Game Room

www.chiefsplanet.com

 

[denverpatsfan]

I feel so fortunate to get a Bonus Round of Brady’s career. Now that he just did that this season, there is literally zero pressure or stress in rooting for him. It’s over. Legacy secure forever. Could go 19-1 and choke; could throw 4 interceptions in the Super Bowl; could lose the next three Super Bowls; could lose to Rodgers, Wilson, and Mahomes. It doesn’t matter anymore. This run changed everything about all that stuff.

And if Brady doesn’t win, what do I really care? No more banners for the Patriots anyway. It’s a fun place to be in to have zero downside and just enjoying the ride.

So - should be a delicious read here. Loving that Arians is basically an annoying troll. It’s beautiful. He’s the absolute perfect coach for those of us who just want to see Brady burn down the other 30. Hope the Bucs continue to run their mouths and become the league’s new most hated team.

Chiefs Arians:Anybody that says, Run It Back bullst. Thats Kansas Citys bullst. - ChiefsPlanet

Chiefs Arians:Anybody that says, Run It Back bullst. Thats Kansas Citys bullst. Nzoner's Game Room

www.chiefsplanet.com

Well said, sir!

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I thought Robert Horry was welcoming Tom to the 7 ring club in a tongue in cheek kind of way, but apparently he was serious. Lol...can’t believe he takes himself that seriously and his feelings are hurt. Did he really expect there wouldn’t be a tidal wave of jokes? Dude averaged 7 ppg.

Robert Horry, 7-time NBA champ, fires back after criticism of Tom Brady tweet

Is Tom Brady the greatest athlete there ever was? After winning his seventh championship on Sunday you could certainly make such an argument but he isn’t alone in that accomplishment.

www.foxnews.com

 

[carmelo15]

watching Brady and Gronk party on boats in 80 degree weather while I sit in New England in 30degree weather with snow on the ground does make me question why people got upset that brady prefers the weather there.

Remember they think players would chose pizza over weather and nightlife hahaha

 

[venecol]

I feel so fortunate to get a Bonus Round of Brady’s career. Now that he just did that this season, there is literally zero pressure or stress in rooting for him. It’s over. Legacy secure forever. Could go 19-1 and choke; could throw 4 interceptions in the Super Bowl; could lose the next three Super Bowls; could lose to Rodgers, Wilson, and Mahomes. It doesn’t matter anymore. This run changed everything about all that stuff.

And if Brady doesn’t win, what do I really care? No more banners for the Patriots anyway. It’s a fun place to be in to have zero downside and just enjoying the ride.

So - should be a delicious read here. Loving that Arians is basically an annoying troll. It’s beautiful. He’s the absolute perfect coach for those of us who just want to see Brady burn down the other 30. Hope the Bucs continue to run their mouths and become the league’s new most hated team.

Chiefs Arians:Anybody that says, Run It Back bullst. Thats Kansas Citys bullst. - ChiefsPlanet

Chiefs Arians:Anybody that says, Run It Back bullst. Thats Kansas Citys bullst. Nzoner's Game Room

www.chiefsplanet.com

Their list of excuses is endless: the flags, their OL, Andy being distracted, home stadium, the streaker, lmao. Only a couple of them admit they were outplayed and outcoached. They think everyone in the NFL fears them.

 

[carmelo15]

Brady is pretty clearly the driving force/motivating factor on that team. If they stay healthy again next season, they’ll ***** slap all three of those teams.

Ya GB isn’t a threat to anyone next year there losing Aaron Jones LA with Stafford is a serious threat though