OT: Did the Bucs SB loss Break Patrick Mahomes?

[‘Mondre]

Nope. That's kind of a strawman. You can hate his guts if you want. but moving goalposts and tap dancing around facts in order to diminish his on-field accomplishments is disingenuous.

its actually an ad hominem to say you’re a Brady hater just cause you think he’s overrated. He also said “based on your other posts”.

Ad hominem is criticizing the person and not the arguments.

I objectively pointed out that tb had some of the greatest teams ever, and then he called me a Brady hater.

Ad hominem.

 

[Ring 6]

Both players won 4 lombardis in their first 16 years in the NFL and 3 super bowl MVPs along with two regular season MVPs. Montana then retired. Brady kept going because he was able to.

Which makes him greater.

 

[‘Mondre]

He soften his anti-Brady stance since he retired, but at this point you just look like a hater if you would consider another QB over Tom. To be fair to him he said it was his opinion. My opinion we can argue the top football player of all time sure, but not the Quarterback.

“Look like a hater.”

See, There’s another example of ad hominem.

Actually it’s poisoning the well and ad hominem.

Maybe you love watching the sport enough to hate its distillation by media into a personality contest.

 

[Bruins29]

its actually an ad hominem to say you’re a Brady hater just cause you think he’s overrated. He also said “based on your other posts”.

Ad hominem is criticizing the person and not the arguments.

I objectively pointed out that tb had some of the greatest teams ever, and then he called me a Brady hater.

Ad hominem.

Would you like some time on the couch to discuss your feelings?

 

[‘Mondre]

Would you like some time on the couch to discuss your feelings?

Yes I think it’s a bunch of bs!

(Also that’s an ad hominem right there)

 

[TheRainMaker]

Brady vs Montana is dumb. Both are the best of their generations and unfair to compare due to the different time periods they played in.

Brady has admitted recently he’s benefitted greatly by the Colts rule changes where it became easier for him to throw each year due to defenses dumbed down/not able to grab WR’s.

And imagine if Goddell not enforced rules where you can’t touch QB’s? Brady’s career is shortened taking more hits to the head or knees like he did in the 2001 AFCCG and 2008. He’d retire like most between the age of 35-38.

 

[Bruins29]

Brady vs Montana is dumb. Both are the best of their generations and unfair to compare due to the different time periods they played in.

Brady has admitted recently he’s benefitted greatly by the Colts rule changes where it became easier for him to throw each year due to defenses dumbed down/not able to grab WR’s.

And imagine if Goddell not enforced rules where you can’t touch QB’s? Brady’s career is shortened taking more hits to the head or knees like he did in the 2001 AFCCG and 2008. He’d retire like most between the age of 35-38.

Agree on the QBs being protected more now which would probably prolong a career but not on the rule changes.

I'll never understand (rule changes) being brought up to slight Brady. Every team Brady faced had a QB that had the same advantage Brady had. Its not like Brady got the advantages of these new rules and the QB on the other team he was facing did not.

The only way this plays is if you only used stats to compare TB and JM - which is not happening. Unless you count Wins and SB wins stats....

So my question is why does this keep getting brought up? Bradys teams were more dominant over their peers. More so than Montana's teams were over their peers.

 

[VectorPrime]

Forget quarterbacking. Montana wasn’t EVER considered the best football player of all time. It was always Rice or Jim Brown or maybe LT. Brady however has accomplished so much that he is usually considered the best football player. Period.

He isn’t on the Mount Rushmore of football players. That’s beneath him. He’s on the Mount Rushmore of North American Athletes.

 

[Bruins29]

Forget quarterbacking. Montana wasn’t EVER considered the best football player of all time. It was always Rice or Jim Brown or maybe LT. Brady however has accomplished so much that he is usually considered the best football player. Period.

He isn’t on the Mount Rushmore of football players. That’s beneath him. He’s on the Mount Rushmore of North American Athletes.

Exactly. As I mentioned earlier- He is in the Ruth, WG99, Jordan Ali stratosphere i,e Considered the GOAT ever athlete (Russell has been considered too)

Joe Montana?? Great player but he is a 2nd tier guy. Sorry, but it is what it is.

 

[VectorPrime]

Exactly. As I mentioned earlier- He is in the Ruth, WG99, Jordan Ali stratosphere i,e Considered the GOAT ever athlete (Russell has been considered too)

Joe Montana?? Great player but he is a 2nd tier guy. Sorry, but it is what it is.

It’s Brady in first then Jordan in second place. Gretzky in third. I don’t know how you want to count Tiger Woods or some other Golf legend and frankly I don’t care. Same with boxing, I just don’t know enough about it because while Mohammed Ali is unquestionably the most historically important boxing legend of all time I have no idea if within the confines of the ring itself he was the best to ever do it.

And yes I see your Russel takes. I get it. But it’s just so difficult to try and equate what an athlete accomplished in a young, small league to the modern era juggernauts that all these sporting leagues are now. I’d say the same thing about Ruth who btw never had to play against the best Black talent.

 

[Joker]

Jim Brown is the greatest NFL football player of all time...Walter Payton #2...I don't care who you put after these two transcendent players

 

[Bruins29]

Its amazing!! Mahomes, Brees, Rogers and P Manning have a combined 60 seasons played between them. And in this "its so much easier to be a QB now" league they have a combined 5 Superbowls between them.

These otherworldly, all time great, talented, amazing, QB's needed 60 seasons to get 5 rings

Brady got 7 in 22 Seasons.

 

[VectorPrime]

Its amazing!! Mahomes, Brees, Rogers and P Manning have a combined 60 seasons played between them. And in this "its so much easier to be a QB now" league they have a combined 5 Superbows between them.

These otherworldly, all time great, talented, amazing, QB's needed 60 seasons to get 5 rings

Brady got 7 in 22 Seasons.

Throw Ben and his years in there as well since he’s gonna be a HoFer too. That makes what, 77 combined seasons to match Brady’s?

 

[Bruins29]

It’s Brady in first then Jordan in second place. Gretzky in third. I don’t know how you want to count Tiger Woods or some other Golf legend and frankly I don’t care. Same with boxing, I just don’t know enough about it because while Mohammed Ali is unquestionably the most historically important boxing legend of all time I have no idea if within the confines of the ring itself he was the best to ever do it.

And yes I see your Russel takes. I get it. But it’s just so difficult to try and equate what an athlete accomplished in a young, small league to the modern era juggernauts that all these sporting leagues are now. I’d say the same thing about Ruth who btw never had to play against the best Black talent.

Agree. Ruth is in there, unless that goes back too far and the race thing which is a consideration.. BUT Guy hit more HR in a season than all the other teams combined. Then went out to the mound and would win you 20 games. F'd up.

 

[Bruins29]

Throw Ben and his years in there as well since he’s gonna be a HoFer too. That makes what, 77 combined seasons to match Brady’s?

Yeah, I dont think people grasp what they just witnessed and they try to downplay it for some reason.

I am objective and agree TB benefitted from BB but still, the numbers are the numbers.

 

[Joker]

While I'm admittedly 100% biased when it comes to the sweet science and Rocky Marciano, the greatest pound for pound fighter in ring history is Sugar Ray Robinson

 

[skinnydog]

Agree. Ruth is in there, unless that goes back too far and the race thing which is a consideration.. BUT Guy hit more HR in a season than all the other teams combined. Then went out to the mound and would win you 20 games. F'd up.

Sort of on Ruth, but in many seasons he individually hit more home runs than other teams, but not all teams combined. I think when he retired he had more than twice as many home runs than any other player. As a pitcher he had 90+ wins. Something like 70+ triples . .

 

[Bruins29]

Sort of on Ruth, but in many seasons he individually hit more home runs than other teams, but not all teams combined. I think when he retired he had more than twice as many home runs than any other player. As a pitcher he had 90+ wins. Something like 70+ triples . .

Sorry, I meant to say all other teams combined HR not the whole league combined..

 

[NFL Mystique]

Ruined? No way.

He had a terrible first half in 2021. He was better the second half.

Yes he was terrible in the 2nd half against Cincinnati.

But it happens to everyone.

Chiefs window is wide open as long as he's QB.

 

[skinnydog]

Sorry, I meant to say all other teams combined HR not the whole league combined..

You are right though that Ruth is impossible to leave off of and list of Sports greats. His numbers were so far above anyone else in his own era.